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Forums - PC Discussion - No Man Sky in trouble? Developers may have a patent problem.

Everyone's calling these guys scum for doing what any of us would do in a situation like this.

Beside that, apparently Genicap is actually using this patent - you know that thing they got on their idea so no one can take it. They also have tried speaking to Hello Games and gotten no response.

http://www.pcgamer.com/company-claims-no-mans-sky-uses-its-patented-equation-without-permission/

Why are people so quick to jump to negative conclusions when their favorite thing is called out?



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IkePoR said:

Everyone's calling these guys scum for doing what any of us would do in a situation like this.

Beside that, apparently Genicap is actually using this patent - you know that thing they got on their idea so no one can take it. They also have tried speaking to Hello Games and gotten no response.

http://www.pcgamer.com/company-claims-no-mans-sky-uses-its-patented-equation-without-permission/

Why are people so quick to jump to (negative) conclusions when their favorite thing is called out?

Cus that's just what people do



That's a very broad patent as usual.

https://www.google.com/patents/US20050140678?dq=ininventor:%22Johan+Gielis%22&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwj4y5u5pIPOAhXox4MKHWFmBVwQ6AEITzAH

1. A method for the creation of computer graphics images, comprising:
a) generating at least one shape with a computer based on a parameterized formula;
b) having said computer suggest a plurality of variations of said at least one shape.
2. The method of claim 1, wherein said at least one shape is a two-dimensional shape.
3. The method of claim 1, wherein said at least one shape is a three-dimensional shape.
4. The method of claim 1, wherein said parameterized formula is a representation of the superformula formula.
etc etc.

Software patents suck. I've been in litigation over software before and my company had no choice to buy patents and file their own to get out of trouble even though we did nothing wrong. Whole thing cost tens of millions of dollars and lots of time wasted.


Sounds like another asshole claiming to have invented something popular like that one guy that claims Steve Jobs stole the idea for the iphone from him.



FunFan said:

A dutch company called Genicap is claiming they own the "super-formula" used as the basis for No Man Sky procedually generated Space. And they do have a very good case as No Man Sky devs already discussed a year ago that they were using a formula created by a plant geneticist named Johan Gielis who happens to work at Genicaps. Well, seems this formula was patented back in 2004. 

Still, the timing of this claim seems a bit too convenient as the game was close to launch on PC, but this dispute may force another delay until things are settled. It could take years to settle anything in court, but something tells me Genicap might be very willing to settle things outside. Regardless of what happens this is a very unfortunate event for No Man Sky developer as they seem to be caught in a lose-lose situation here. In case the worst happens, at least we still have Starbound.

Article from Gamezone. Original Report from Telegraaf.


Speaking of which, Starbound is due to release on Fri 22nd http://playstarbound.com/starbound-release-announcement/

I'll have to make me thread on that today at some point.

OT: it seems a bit coincidental that someone would make a case just now when the game is nearing release. I've seen enough times to take notice of some folks who step forward when a celeb cashes in on a million or makes a decent amount of cash, only to have someone step in and suddenly say they were attacked by them or something, same with companies that see how popular something has become and only then do they want some of the pie, if it wasn't popular and failed then a majority of the time no case would be made, at least not as often. 

The other thing about this to note is Hello games didn't ask the original owner to see if it was okay to use it and as some above have pointed out, they have had no contact from HG either when asked about them using it. 



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IkePoR said:

Everyone's calling these guys scum for doing what any of us would do in a situation like this.

Beside that, apparently Genicap is actually using this patent - you know that thing they got on their idea so no one can take it. They also have tried speaking to Hello Games and gotten no response.

http://www.pcgamer.com/company-claims-no-mans-sky-uses-its-patented-equation-without-permission/

Why are people so quick to jump to negative conclusions when their favorite thing is called out?

The man could've done so a long time ago. I wonder why he's making issues now.



 

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People are more divided on the matter than I thought. Maybe I should had included a poll...



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hershel_layton said:
IkePoR said:

Everyone's calling these guys scum for doing what any of us would do in a situation like this.

Beside that, apparently Genicap is actually using this patent - you know that thing they got on their idea so no one can take it. They also have tried speaking to Hello Games and gotten no response.

http://www.pcgamer.com/company-claims-no-mans-sky-uses-its-patented-equation-without-permission/

Why are people so quick to jump to negative conclusions when their favorite thing is called out?

The man could've done so a long time ago. I wonder why he's making issues now.

Well it says they attempted to reach out to Hello Games and haven't gotten a response.  It's important to note that there's no timetable for this - they could have contacted them ages ago and still haven't heard anything.

If I'd been trying to contact you over something I owned and knew you were plagiarizing to make profit and you ignored me, I'd make noise around the same time Genicap is.  Just before you could make a red cent off my patent.  Right now there's no way to tell if this is the case but if it is, it makes a lot of sense.



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IkePoR said:
hershel_layton said:

The man could've done so a long time ago. I wonder why he's making issues now.

Well it says they attempted to reach out to Hello Games and haven't gotten a response.  It's important to note that there's no timetable for this - they could have contacted them ages ago and still haven't heard anything.

If I'd been trying to contact you over something I owned and knew you were plagiarizing to make profit and you ignored me, I'd make noise around the same time Genicap is.  Just before you could make a red cent off my patent.  Right now there's no way to tell if this is the case but if it is, it makes a lot of sense.

NMS has been in crush time game development for a long time. When you're trying to finish a game on time, there's not much time to discuss how it all works. That's what Gielis seems to want from Hello games.
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2016-07-21-why-no-mans-sky-fans-are-worried-about-a-patented-superformula

  • It would be great to exchange knowhow with Hello Games. We believe No Man's Sky is the beginning of a new generation of games. What Hello games did with the formula is very impressive. Johan Gielis, the founder of Genicap and the one who discovered the superformula, is extremely proud.
  • If Hello Games used our technology, at some stage we will have to get to the table. We have reached out to them but understand they have been busy. We trust that we will be able to discuss this in a normal way.

It's the Telegraaf that's stirring things up
The Telegraaf quotes an ICT lawyer, called Arnoud Engelfriet, as saying if No Man's Sky infringes on Gielis' patent, then there should be "a compensation", and "distribution should be discontinued".
It's not even Genicap's patent lawyer.

So in the end I guess that even if NMS uses the super formula, all that Genicap wants is their knowledge to further their own work to create a working engine

  • Genicap is working on a project to create revolutionary software based on the superformula that can be used likewise by indies and the major game studios.
  • Using the superformula to generate natural objects enables you to create endless varied and original objects such as trees, rocks, beaches, planets and mountains. Currently most of this work is still done manually. We are still in the conceptual phase. We expect to be able to tell you more in autumn.

You can use our formula, if you show us how you made all of that with it. Of course then the patent lawyers step in as Hello games could just as well patent their applications. It would all just be a lot nicer without patent lawyers!



Random_Matt said:
Idiots for not asking first.

if they wrote all the code in their game, why would they need to ask?