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Forums - Politics Discussion - Best solution to the refugee crisis in Syria?

hershel_layton on 25 May 2016
wartaal said:
WolfpackN64 said:

Confirmation bias, confirmation bias, confirmation bias,... Is repeating word sentences which you probably don't fully understand the only thing you people can do? I know the Iron Curtain was used to keep people in. It was not in line with the treaty of Human Rights. But the current Iron Curtain, made to keep people out is also in violation of the Human Rights treaty, and it is build by people who should know that building giant iron fences NEVER amounts to something good. So once again, my comparison holds.

Economic/political reasons then. It's quite simple really. Syria and Iraq, both countries with oil reserves, Syria also having a big food producing potential. They're both surrounded by different regional powers (Iran, Turkey, Saudi Arabia), who are supported by different big powers (NATO countries and the CIS countries). The whole ordeal has turned into a giant geopolitical proxy-war, with in the middle Daesh, which under the guise of Islam, uses terror tactics to constitute their own state out of a weakened Iraq and Syria. The use of such violence, is under normal religious circumstances forbidden (one should not attack people from the Abrahamic relgions, according to the Islam). All religions have such a golden rule, but all religions also violated it (or were used in name, seeingas religions themselves do not have personal character).

So if anything is not in line with human rights treaty it is comparable? Sure lets compare some hastily thown up fences with a 46 year social/economical isolation of eastern europe. Your comparison is horrible. 

Islam has no Golden Rule, golden rules apply to anyone. Not just jews/christians. And  jews and christians are treated no different than anyone else, its convert or die. The only exception is the Jizya, a tax made specifically to extort money from conquered jews/christians. Also they should feel humiliated and submitted. AFter they have no more money all their priviliges(lol,paying money to not get killed is actually a privilige in Islam) dissapear.

Violence is condoned throughout the entire QU'ran. Muhameds is the perfect example of mankind. He was a pedophile, rapist, murderer, rascist and sadist. His interpretation is the ONLY interpretation. Guess what that means.

It means Pedophaelia, rape, murder, rascism and sadism is rampant throughout the muslim world(which it is). Now tell me what does economics/politics have to do with this? As an added bonus both muhamed and the QU'ran condone the opression of women and also Female genital mutilation. Oh and leaving Islam is punished by death. Same goes for being gay and adultery.

And Islam does not mean peace, it means submission. Comparing Islam to any other religion is laughable, what other religion mutilates little girls genitals and throws battery acid in their face if they want to go to school? What other religion performs 3 deadly attacks a day on average?

You dont even understand Islam is a political ideology. It wants to impose Sharia on the entire world, as it has been doing  for 1400 years now. 

PLease stop defending this ideology, for someone who is so concerned with Human Rights the hypocrisy is through the roof.

Choose whether you think islam is peaceful or not, but the jizya "oppression" is bullshit. Muslims are already enforced to give a large amount of money to charity and other things(which is essentially what jizya essentially is). Whether you're a Muslim or not, you're giving chunks of your money to charity and whatnot.

 

Also, non-muslims aren't forced to fight in wars. Muslims are. Basically, they are given a decent amount of taxes to pay but now that means they're being attacked? At least you only pay it once per year(unlike Muslims who pay for it constantly). Besides, the money could be used to advance cities and help with projects and poor people(who aren't forced to pay it).



 

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12/22/2016- Made a bet with Ganoncrotch that the first 6 months of 2017 will be worse than 2016. A poll will be made to determine the winner. Loser has to take a picture of them imitating their profile picture.

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Slimebeast on 25 May 2016

Let no one into Europe. Not one single person. It's not a solution to permanently move 6 million or 10 million people just because of a civil war.

The vast majority of the refugees are already in refugee camps at or near the border in neughboring countries or simply moved to relatives in more peaceful parts of Syria, and that's just like it should be. Give them shelter, food and school for their children and when the war is over they can go back and rebuild their country.

 



Aura7541 on 25 May 2016
WolfpackN64 said:

See! You ignore the golden rule again, notwhitstanding that killing people of other abrahamic religions is forbidden by the scripture. These are facts. Peadophelia and murder? Give me a religion that has not had both scandels?!

Islam is not different to "any relgion". You reguritate the right-wing drivel without critical reflection.

I knew you would use the right-wing buzzword card. You're literally telegraphing your responses. Not all religions are equal. Some are as harmful as a static shock, others as harmful as a lightning strike to the head.

hershel_layton said:

Choose whether you think islam is peaceful or not, but the jizya "oppression" is bullshit. Muslims are already enforced to give a large amount of money to charity and other things(which is essentially what jizya essentially is). Whether you're a Muslim or not, you're giving chunks of your money to charity and whatnot.

Also, non-muslims aren't forced to fight in wars. Muslims are. Basically, they are given a decent amount of taxes to pay but now that means they're being attacked? At least you only pay it once per year(unlike Muslims who pay for it constantly). Besides, the money could be used to advance cities and help with projects and poor people(who aren't forced to pay it).

??? Jizra is applied to non-muslims. Whether that money is used for charity does not justify the wrongful act of discrimminating against a group of people who do not follow the religion/ideology.



WolfpackN64 on 25 May 2016
Aura7541 said:
WolfpackN64 said:

See! You ignore the golden rule again, notwhitstanding that killing people of other abrahamic religions is forbidden by the scripture. These are facts. Peadophelia and murder? Give me a religion that has not had both scandels?!

Islam is not different to "any relgion". You reguritate the right-wing drivel without critical reflection.

I knew you would use the right-wing buzzword card. You're literally telegraphing your responses. Not all religions are equal. Some are as harmful as a static shock, others as harmful as a lightning strike to the head.

Like what? Are you one of those people who always use Bhuddism as the "peaceful" side?



Aura7541 on 25 May 2016
WolfpackN64 said:
Aura7541 said:

I knew you would use the right-wing buzzword card. You're literally telegraphing your responses. Not all religions are equal. Some are as harmful as a static shock, others as harmful as a lightning strike to the head.

Like what? Are you one of those people who always use Bhuddism as the "peaceful" side?

Does the Eightfold Path tell you to kill apostates?



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WolfpackN64 on 25 May 2016
Aura7541 said:
WolfpackN64 said:

Like what? Are you one of those people who always use Bhuddism as the "peaceful" side?

Does the Eightfold Path tell you to kill apostates?

No, just as you should not kill people from other Abrahamic religions in Islam. Yet, how would you explain the increase in Bhuddist inspired violence in South-East Asia? It's not Bhuddism itself being violent. It's the religion being used. Not to mention many Japanese Bhuddist sects supported the war effort in WWII.



hershel_layton on 25 May 2016
Aura7541 said:
WolfpackN64 said:

Like what? Are you one of those people who always use Bhuddism as the "peaceful" side?

Does the Eightfold Path tell you to kill apostates?

WHat I think WolfpackN64 is saying is that every religion can be used with the intention of good or bad. Think of it as a gun. If used properly, the beauties of what it can establish is amazing( Ottoman empire, golden age). However, if used improperly, the damages are devastating( Saudi Arabia, ISIS, etc etc)



 

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12/22/2016- Made a bet with Ganoncrotch that the first 6 months of 2017 will be worse than 2016. A poll will be made to determine the winner. Loser has to take a picture of them imitating their profile picture.

Slimebeast on 25 May 2016
KungKras said:
Here's how we can deal with it.

Theoretically, we can accept the number of refugees that we are, but our systems aren't designed for it and so we're doing a terrible job at it.
We need to put up systems that spread the refugees out across the countries instead of gathering at the same locations and forming little independand societies within societies. Which is a bad thing. This should be easy. Refugees need to interact with the locals in their daily lives. If it's possible to not have to do that in an area, then we're not spreading them out enough.

The wahabism that Saudi Arabia is spreading throughout the world is a huge problem, and we need to enact laws that prevent religious institutions from being funded from outside interests. Most middle eastern refugees aren't wahabbis, don't let Saudi Arabia give them an imam that is.

Enforce laws and send a clear message that crime is not tolerated. Driver's licenses have trial periods where if you get caught speeding within a couple of years from when you got it, you lose the license. I don't see why citizenship should be different. And educate people about what the laws are. Make sure everyone knows exactly what will get them in trouble.

Make language education better. Either make it mandatory or easy to come by. The language barrier is a problem that separates people, and we want people to mix as much as possible. The language barrier needs to be efficiently eliminated as soon as possible.

And finally don't turn down people fleeing a war zone. America once turned dowan a ship of jews fleeing nazi germany out of fear that they were german spies. How is history looking back at that one? Do you think the people fleeing Syria likes ISIS? You think they want something similar here? Of course they don't. They're the most likely to want to be brought into society.

Yes, if you are Lebanon or Turkey, beighboring countries with similar countries, you can't turn down truly fleeing people. But there's no reason for them to come to Europe, or rather there's no reason for us to allow them in and cause problems.

Only a small fraction of the total amount of refugees and luck seekers in the Middle east, and they still cause huge problems. How many Syrians were accepted into Europe last year, probably not even half a million, with another half a million young male Afghans and some other groups. And all these cause problems for our countries. And yet there's another 5 million in each country just waiting to come.

So it's hypocricy this blaming the left does that we have to physically accept foreigners when reality is that we're only talking about a fraction we would let in anyway.

I don't see the point in letting in one tenth of all refugees to cause so much problems when the other nine tenths will have to stay and suffer anyway (suffer according to the left, not my words). You don't solve a problem, you just cause new ones.

And a reminder. ISIS is only a small part of the Syrian crisis. It's still mainly a civil war between Assad and rebels of the people who asked for democracy.

Plus saying "they want to be brought into society" sounds a bit simple. Who's society? Your society? Germany? Hungary? Greece? Or the twisted dream image Middle Easterners have of Europe where honey drops down from the trees?

There's a lot of people who flee the terror of Isis and yet want to impose their totalitarian ideology and culture on our society in the long run, willingly or unwillingly.



Aura7541 on 25 May 2016
WolfpackN64 said:
Aura7541 said:

Does the Eightfold Path tell you to kill apostates?

No, just as you should not kill people from other Abrahamic religions in Islam. Yet, how would you explain the increase in Bhuddist inspired violence in South-East Asia? It's not Bhuddism itself being violent. It's the religion being used. Not to mention many Japanese Bhuddist sects supported the war effort in WWII.

I'm strictly talking about the religions, themselves, not the followers.

And Quran (2:191-193) contradicts your claim that Islam does not allow killing people from other Abrahamic religions.

hershel_layton said:

WHat I think WolfpackN64 is saying is that every religion can be used with the intention of good or bad. Think of it as a gun. If used properly, the beauties of what it can establish is amazing( Ottoman empire, golden age). However, if used improperly, the damages are devastating( Saudi Arabia, ISIS, etc etc)

I was talking strictly on religions, not followers of religions. Huge distinction between the two topics.



WolfpackN64 on 25 May 2016
Aura7541 said:
WolfpackN64 said:

No, just as you should not kill people from other Abrahamic religions in Islam. Yet, how would you explain the increase in Bhuddist inspired violence in South-East Asia? It's not Bhuddism itself being violent. It's the religion being used. Not to mention many Japanese Bhuddist sects supported the war effort in WWII.

I'm strictly talking about the religions, themselves, not the followers.

And Quran (2:191-193) contradicts your claim that Islam does not allow killing people from other Abrahamic religions.

Well, Qur'an 2:256 contradicts that statement. It calls for no division to be made between the three.