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Forums - Gaming Discussion - I don't get how Mass Effect 3 was a bad game (major spoilers)...

 

What ending did you choose?

FUCK THE REAPERS! #DESTROYFTW! 38 42.22%
 
My god... control is so e... 11 12.22%
 
Yo man... peace is import... 21 23.33%
 
FUCK YOU ALL! I HAD ENOUG... 20 22.22%
 
Total:90

It's the only ME that I played through only one time. They released a new ending and I said I'd replay the whole saga from the beginning. I never did and I never saw the updated ending. I guess I know what I must do.



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haxxiy said:


-> Dudebro James Vega (swear he's the same guy who tags along on Dead Space 3)

 



JWeinCom said:

Except, the story wasn't like that... at all...

You mention the that the second game was devoted to something called a suicide mission, but how did that turn out?  If you played your cards right, you could *spoilers of course* save every single member of your party.  You're told throughout the whole game that there is NOTHING you can do to survive this, but you (if you spend the time) prove them wrong.  That doesn't demonstrate bleak nihilism, but the exact opposite.  That's a message of hope and empowerment if I ever saw one.

Among the course of the games, you are able to save the Citadel from destruction, convince Saren to kill himself, save the Rachni species from extinction, survive a suicide mission against overwhelming odds, stop a centuries long was between quarians and geth, save a planet (well moon) from reaper infestation, restore the Krogan race, and so on so forth.

I don't know where you're coming up with this idea that you have limited control over the universe.  Commander Shepard is specifically resurrected because he happens to be so damn special.  Among the billions of humans, his remains were plucked from space because he as an individual was that important.  And throughout the games, he and his crew are able to practically work miracles.  This isn't Bioshock we're talking about.  There are no shackles on Shepard's wrists.  There is nothing in the first two games that indicates that your efforts are futile and meaningless.

And from a gameplay perspective as well, it was never implied that your actions were futile.  You are encouraged to carry over a file through three games.  Characters in the second game (like the rachni queen) pop up to say "hey remember me from before?  There's a payoff to this, I promise."  Reporters grill you about your decision to let the Ascension live or die.  The gameplay promises at every turn what you do matters.  And then it doesn't.

Aside from that, the ending just kind of sucks.  Keep in mind, the OP played the extended cut which at least sucked less.  There was little explanation for the literal deus ex machina at the end of the game.  The starkid insists that the whole point of this is an inevitable war between synthetics and organics, but that plot point had been on the backburner since Me1.  And, the game shows that you can make peace, and that the Geth are basically space Ghandi anyway.  The endings are not just all terrible, but all the same.  Except in one ending, everyone is robots at the end which is the stupidest shit in the world.  Space radiation just made everyone a robot?  The fuck?

And what the game promises above all else is explanation.  This is a game where even the most minute things are explained with excrutiating detail.  This wasn't being john malkovich, or serial experiments, or lost where everything is super vague and mysterious.  Until the very last moment, everything is explained as clearly and meticulously as possible.  Then at the last moment, your crew is thrown on a random planet, people you saw die were alive, buzz aldrin is talking to his kid, and everything is all wtf.  You can't have such a dramatic tonal shift in the last five minutes.

To OP.  Basically, it's like this.  Imagine you have a wonderful date with the most beautiful girl (or guy) you've ever met.  You spend the whole night in a dizzying state of euphoria.  At the end of the night, you lean in for a kiss, and then, she stabs you in the scrotum.  Sure the date was fine up to the last five minutes, but you'll probably be more focused on the whole scrotum stabbing thing.

This. +1,000,000,000. My scrotum has never the same. It seems like they said fuck it when it came to 2nd half of ME3. 





They made a gaming sin and connected (a potentially paid for on Xbox 360) multiplayer part affect the main story. A HUGE mistake in my personal opinion as one day, they'll turn those servers off.

Also, the ending 'Well done, not pick 1 of 3... sorry 4, options'. Rest of the game was good. It just wasn't as good as number 2.



Hmm, pie.

The Fury said:
They made a gaming sin and connected (a potentially paid for on Xbox 360) multiplayer part affect the main story. A HUGE mistake in my personal opinion as one day, they'll turn those servers off.

Also, the ending 'Well done, not pick 1 of 3... sorry 4, options'. Rest of the game was good. It just wasn't as good as number 2.

 

You can still get all endings playing solo, but you really gotta give all you've got, and leave no secondary mission undone.

 

Not justifying that multiplayer bullshit, though. Especially not when, for no reason whatsoever, you get every troop number halved "just because you're not playing multiplayer".



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Wright said:

You can still get all endings playing solo, but you really gotta give all you've got, and leave no secondary mission undone.

Not justifying that multiplayer bullshit, though. Especially not when, for no reason whatsoever, you get every troop number halved "just because you're not playing multiplayer".

See, that latter is the reason it pisses me off. I didn't know and I played all the main story before touching, what I assumed, was just multiplayer. My first play throughs of games like ME or DA are always 'go with the flow' stories, not all good all bad, so when it came to taking back earth and nearly doing pretty much everything I could and my Shepard saying 'We aren't ready for this.' or some crap I ignored it as part of the game, little did I know it's because I wasn't playing the MP. When it came to the very ending... only 2 choices, not 3 (before patch).

I did get confused when people talked about the 3 options and I only got 2.

MP should never be connected to a single player RPG like that ever. 

Oh well. /rant



Hmm, pie.

Airaku said:

JWeinCom said:

 


No, not really.  Synthetic vs organic was only a really prominent theme in the first game.  From the second on, it is a secondary thing at best.  The more overriding theme of the games, is individualism for humanity vs cooperation.  The major choice you make at the end of the first game is whether or not to sacrifice human lives to save the council, and whether to put a anti alien or pro alien member on the council.  In the second game, the theme is hammered throughout the game, while synthetics vs organics is only important in the Tali missions, and in a more minor capacity with Edi.  In the third, it's again a fairly minor point.  No more important than the genophage, or the illusive man's plans... at least until the last few seconds.

 


I'm going to need to agree to disagree because the main plot of the series was indeed the interaction of Organics and Synthetics. I would argue that the 3rd game implied it the most with both EDI, Legion, and the Reapers. Number two did the same thing. Heavily questioning if Synthetics have a soul. For they are self aware. Legion questions because they are aware, they have a consciousness, if they have a consciousness, then in a sense, they have a soul.

The main philosophy of the series is regarding both Organics and Synthetics in various forms and points of views. Verses does not necessarily mean fighting, but comparing the two and the aspects of them. Again, I directly asked someone who worked on the game on this matter. I can't name them but they did confirm this to me. Oh I CANNOT wait on the new game they are working on!

Sure there was the part of mass effect 3 with the Geth and Quarian, but that was just one plot point.  No more focussed on than the genophage, or the fall of the Asari homeworld.  Organics vs synthetics was a theme, but it was hardly THE theme.  Legion questioned if Geth had a soul in Mass Effect 2, but that was just one of many threads running through it.  Like Miranda's genetic modifications, or Garrus' plot for revenge, and so on.  It wasn't given much more prevalance.

To say it was the main plain, or the one plot point that *needed* to be resolved isn't right.  The idea of humanity's relationship with the rest of the galaxy was a far more important theme.  The beginning of the first game is about Shepard being named the first Spectre, and it ends with humans being appointed to the council.  It is far and away the dominant focus of Mass Effect 2. (The Collectors are after the humans because they are somehow special, Cerberus and the Illusive man plot for human dominance in the galaxy, and so on).   It is less focussed on in Mass Effect 3, but still as prominent of a plotpoint as anything else.  There's a reason why Earth is the epicenter of this game.

I don't know who you talked to and I'm not really that interested.  I don't care what any of the developers say, because I've played the game for myself.  The authors could say anything they want, but that doesn't make it so.



d21lewis said:
It's the only ME that I played through only one time. They released a new ending and I said I'd replay the whole saga from the beginning. I never did and I never saw the updated ending. I guess I know what I must do.

Don't bother.  It's the same ending pretty much, but with some added details.  The first ending was shitty and incoherent.  The second is shitty and coherent.  A minor upgrade.



JWeinCom said:
d21lewis said:
It's the only ME that I played through only one time. They released a new ending and I said I'd replay the whole saga from the beginning. I never did and I never saw the updated ending. I guess I know what I must do.

Don't bother.  It's the same ending pretty much, but with some added details.  The first ending was shitty and incoherent.  The second is shitty and coherent.  A minor upgrade.

The updated ending is much better than the original but that doesn't say much. The biggest problem with the ending to ME3 is that the game takes a huge thematic shift in the last five minutes. The "Star Child", Reaper motivations, and sudden pushing of the Organics vs. Synthetics as the main theme of the series flew in the face of the rest of the series. Also, they never explained how Cerberus suddenly had such a large fleet of ships. The Council had strict limits on the amount of ships that could be produced. Cerberus started as a splinter group from the Alliance. It's one thing to construct one ship in secret. It's another to construct an entire fleet that rivals the Council races.





JWeinCom said:
                                       

Sure there was the part of mass effect 3 with the Geth and Quarian, but that was just one plot point.  No more focussed on than the genophage, or the fall of the Asari homeworld.  Organics vs synthetics was a theme, but it was hardly THE theme.  Legion questioned if Geth had a soul in Mass Effect 2, but that was just one of many threads running through it.  Like Miranda's genetic modifications, or Garrus' plot for revenge, and so on.  It wasn't given much more prevalance.

To say it was the main plain, or the one plot point that *needed* to be resolved isn't right.  The idea of humanity's relationship with the rest of the galaxy was a far more important theme.  The beginning of the first game is about Shepard being named the first Spectre, and it ends with humans being appointed to the council.  It is far and away the dominant focus of Mass Effect 2. (The Collectors are after the humans because they are somehow special, Cerberus and the Illusive man plot for human dominance in the galaxy, and so on).   It is less focussed on in Mass Effect 3, but still as prominent of a plotpoint as anything else.  There's a reason why Earth is the epicenter of this game.

I don't know who you talked to and I'm not really that interested.  I don't care what any of the developers say, because I've played the game for myself.  The authors could say anything they want, but that doesn't make it so.

 

Weather you wish  to agree or not. Is not the point. That is your personal interpretation of the game. That doesn't make it true or false. In your head, that may be true. However, according to the developers, at Bioware. The main point of the series is the parallels of organics vs synthetics. The Geth war is a very small point of that. The Reapers are a major point in this. Changing biological life into synthetic life because no matter what. There will never be peace with organics. War is natural for them. With synthetics. It is not. However as long as both persist. There can never be peace. By merging the two together, Shepard had created a master race. They synthetic ending is the only one, and I mean the only one that brings peace to the galaxy. I can, with great confidence, confirm to you that the war between organics and synthetics continues on in the ALL of the other endings. There is no peace.

You are correct that there are many plot points. Of course there is. It's Mass Effect. There is tons of them. First contact war (which also has a Reaper point with technology, read the novels that are written by the writer of the series. Mac Walters). The Illusive Man is obsessed with finding the secrets of the reapers and even ensures everything is cyberneticly enhanced. Shepard is a victim of this. EDI plays a huge role in the whole synthetic debates. From Mass Effect 2, all the way to Mass Effect 3 where she got a humanoid body. She was not very human friendly at the beginning of ME2 but then grew upon them. Wished to become on and feel like one. And she did. She felt love, sympathy, anger, confusion, and the whole ranger of humanlike emotion. We saw a growth of both kin. The story really evolved.

I respect your perception of the story and I do not wished to call you wrong on the matter. However.... I think arguing with the writers and developers of the series is rather... silly. They certainly know the story better than you,, or any of us will.