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How much power would the NX need to perfectly emulate WiiU games?

Forums - Nintendo Discussion - How much power would the NX need to perfectly emulate WiiU games?

Zekkyou said:

That depends mostly on what type of architecture they go for. The less like the WiiU their new console's hardware is, the more power they'll need to emulate it. We won't know much power they'll need until we have a better idea of what will be inside the NX (assuming it's a home console).

that's not how emulation works. horsepower and coding is all that matters. You would be right regarding BC through hardware.



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Usually, emulation is pretty hard on any system and, unless NX uses a similar architecture to the Wii U, it will be near impossible to pull it out.

Concerning the Xbox, I understand backwards compatibility is not running on emulation. The Xbox One uses only the assets, such as geometry and textures, from the disc and get the executables from the Microsoft's servers. The trick is that the Xbox team was able to create a program that interpret the PowerPC code of the 360 and write a new executable for the x86 architecture of the Xbox One. That is a pretty amazing feat and I would be surprised if Nintendo and Sony, which are not software companies, could replicate it.



Monteblanco said:

I would be surprised if Nintendo and Sony, which are not software companies, could replicate it.

They dont have to figure it out them self.. They could just pay others.. (just like opera made the browser for Wii or DeNA will help with mobil stuff)

But when it comes to BC.. I could see NX.. not having it.. Sony got away with it and earning lots of money on it.. and Wiiu userbase will likely end up 5 times smaller than wii.. (Not that many it will benefit)



The NX is already confirmed to be absorbing the Wii U's architecture. That's literally one of the first things we learned about the platform. Wow this thread is old why am I taking it so seriously I don't know.



Well, this is new.

Read.

spemanig said:
The NX is already confirmed to be absorbing the Wii U's architecture. That's literally one of the first things we learned about the platform. Wow this thread is old why am I taking it so seriously I don't know.

As far as I remember, that was said about wii u's successor, not NX.



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8 GameCubes worth



Thunderbird77 said:

As far as I remember, that was said about wii u's successor, not NX.

Don't even start with that nonsense.



Well, this is new.

Read.

A lot it was stronger than 360, and even the Xbox One is struggling emulate specific modded 360 games



Thunderbird77 said:
bonzobanana said:
If they want wii u compatibility it will be designed with that in mind even if using different architecture. They will optimise a few things to enable full speed wii u emulation. As previously stated the wii u gpu its pretty standard although low power radeon hardware and the cpu is absolutely dire so no problems with that. The memory bandwidth is very low in wii u except for the 32MB of high speed memory. That 32MB could be difficult to emulate but the NX may well have a similar memory arrangement.

Full wii u compatibility is no problem at all and wii emulation could be done easily fully in software I'm sure without having to worry about optimising anything.

I think people have to remember with Microsoft's approach that they use patches to bypass emulation issues. So its only partial emulation and part new code. It's a different approach and the xbox one probably isn't powerful enough to emulate the 360 fully in software. However the 360 in many ways is more powerful than wii u and the xbox one is likely less powerful than NX at least in cpu terms so its an easier job.

So looking forward to NX hoping its a return to decent Nintendo hardware that will unleash the full potential of Nintendo's game developers and not having to fight the hardware all the time.

I would truly love it if the NX had a top loading optical drive and ran wii u, wii and gamecube software but the reality is I think no optical drive so wii u compatibility is only going to be for digital downloads so I'll need to keep my wii u anyway as I have few digital games.

The 360 is way less powerful than wii u in every way and so will x1 against NX (if NX is a home console.

In everyway? Main memory bandwidth is less, cpu benchmarks far less, gpu gflops may even be less if the wii u is 176 gflops even if the wii u gpu has a better feature set. Remember the wii u is on the same 45nm process and consumes far less power. Games that exist on both 360 and wii u almost always run better on 360 with often much higher frame rates. Some games are lower resolution on wii u like sonic racing transformed. Not forgetting the 360 also generates full 5.1 dolby surround sound where as wii u provides uncompressed sound data which requires less processing.

The one game that actually looks impressive on wii u, xenoblade actually has some very simplified mechanics like lack of collision detection and the developer also produced miracles on the humble wii with the original xenoblade game.

I have ps3, 360 and wii u and for technical accomplishment both ps3 and 360 easily beat wii u. I.e. their technically most advanced games are more impressive than wii u's.

Since the wii u was released the reality of the spec has slowly been realised and its been a downhill journey all the way. From what was something competitive with ps4 and xbone we are now at an understanding that it generally performs below ps3 and 360 on average. Most of  us realised I think at the beginning just how bad it was when almost every game was sub ps3/360 performance. It was always a ridiculously poor console sold at a hugely inflated price just like the wii before it.



Emulation of the WiiU on the NX would be relatively trivial as the Wii U's hardware is relatively poor.

The PC emulates things far differently than how the Xbox One does emulation, the PC will "Brute force" it's way through as it will take an instruction, translate it  and often chop it into several other instructions to be executed on the host machine, which is why it requires orders-of-magnitude greater levels of hardware.

What Microsoft has done on the Xbox One is virtualised the Xbox 360's OS, created an API between the Xbox One's hardware and the VM layer and then repackaged the games, it has stupidly low overheads and fantastic accuracy, impossible to do on the PC without intimate knowledge of the hardware.
Before the Xbox One's release, people laughed at me on these forums when I said emulation was entirely possible on next gen and they pointed towards PS2 emulation as the example of the hardware required to achieve it, even after I provided a detailed analysis that says otherwise. (Obviously I got the last laugh, when Microsoft announced it. Suckers.)

The PS3 could also be emulated on the PS4.

But that is a Software approach.

If Nintendo opts for the Hardware method... Then all they will need is probably the CPU.
And if we shrink the CPU from 45nm down to a MODERN 14nm included in the SoC, then you are looking at an insignificant cost, we are probably talking cents here as the Wii U's CPU is only 50~ to 150~ Million transisters.
The Xbox One and Playstation 4 have 5~ Billion transister SoC's, with roughly 400-500 million transisters for the CPU units, the Nintendo NX could even be larger than that.
9~ Billion 28nm chips are available, 14nm would allow you to bring a 9~ Billion transister chip down to the size similar (Or smaller, depending on other factors) to that of the Xbox One or Playstation 4's SoC.

Essentially, allowing for hardware backwards compatability wouldn't be terribly expensive, the Wii U is built on an old node and was pretty conservative with it's transistor counts.


With that said... If I was in Nintendo's position, I wouldn't bother with backwards compatability with the Wii U at all.
The Wii U does not have a large games library or fanatical user base, they would be better off providing regular Wii comptability.