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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Xbox One vs PS4 Year One Review (Eurogamer)

Jazz2K said:
1. A lot of things could be done now to show what next gen gameplay is about but it requires a lot of work and a lot of gamers can't see past regular gameplay or don't want things to evolve at all.

2. AI for instance. AI greatly affects gameplay far more than 1080p vs 900p. A better AI for enemies, companions, NPCs and wild life could put games on a different level than where they were last gen.

3. We have cameras that can detect movements and facial expressions. Implemented well it could be a game changer. No need to replace the controller with camera movements, but the cam could be used to augment features from the game. Like characters could ask you to look away or just say no (in games like ME this could get conversations to a more life like level)...

4. Physics, destructions and atmosphere. A game like Drive Club is a great example of immersion through weather effects. Games could make use of that on a whole new level. It could affect how things react to environment.

5. All we get for now are last gen gameplay with better graphics.

Oh please, this si sthe exact same kinda nonsense that the journalists are spinning....

  1. Gamers ot wanting things to evolve has nothing to do with "next gen gameplay", if the gameplay is so great, then like always great gameplay will speak and sell itself. That has always been the case before.

  2. Nothing has ever stopped anyone from making great AI in a game. And this is the one thing that you have said that I will kinda agree with. But this isn't anything new. AI has always been a majory part of every game ever made, and again, this is basically just boils down to more of the same when you break it down.

  3. Now this part I completely do not agree with. I don't have a problem tacking on another controller input (in this case a camera) but here is the problem. ANYTHING, and I repeat anything that is easier to do with a button press gets broken the second you start having people go about doing them in some convuluted way for whatever reason. This also hapens to be one of those tings that sounds really good in your head, and maybe even good when you talk about it, but in practice, makes zero sense and have much better more effecient way sf doing them.

    Simply put, if your idea of next gen gameplay is that I can move my head to a direction that selects yes/no, or I can move my hand to select yes/no or I can hit a button that says X=yes/O=no; then I am sorry, but I will take old school gaming over that brand of next gen anyday.

  4. Agaian, you are just saying the same thing but using it to make a different non-existent argument. Everything you have described here is just the same age old more of the same. Look at every single generation dating back from the PS1. Weather effects, physics, lighting, level design and size...etc have always gotten better with each generation of consoles as they will no doubt get with this gen. These are all natural incremments with every new console, the very thing you are praising here is the very thing you/EG is also complaining about.

  5. Which is funny, cause most of what you just asked for here with exception to the AI stuff and camera stuff (which is a bad idea by the way) is exactly that. last gen gameplay with better graphics. 

    Whats really sad is that if you were to be honest, and really think about it, isn't every single racing game today just gran turismo 1 with better graphics? Isn't every FPS shoter today just halo evolved with better graphics, isn't every open world game today just GTA3 with better graphics? But wait!! last gen gears brought us that awesom cover system.... errr sorry, killswitch did it on the PS2.

    I think there are a lot of double tsandards when people make these accusations at current gen consolesor games. They are all talking about this fabled next gen stuff, but no one actually ever talks about what that is in a way that it actually makes sense and not sound redundant. 


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SubiyaCryolite said:
kljesta64 said:
SubiyaCryolite said:
I'll be honest, I don't see Eurogamers angle here. What do they consider to be next gen gameplay? Games that simply cant run or scale to older hardware? Games with radically new concepts? Will they consider Uncharted 4 to be next gen? What makes 3D World more next gen than Galaxy? What makes Smash for Wii U more next gen than Brawl? According to them what should Capcom do to make SFV more "next gen" than SFIV? This is very subjective and confusing.

for example : "Battlefield 4's 64-player online battles demonstrates a radically improved gameplay experience  a world apart from the last-gen equivalents"

So "Games that simply cant run or scale to older hardware? ".

No gameplay that could not work on other systems.

Look to the launch up     NFS rivals/Fifa 14/Cod ghost/ACIV were basically the same game on PS4/Xone with better visuals but hardly any gameplay difference?

BF4 with 64 players was a step up in gameplay.



i just find it funny how much they downplay the ps4's commanding lead in terms of technical capability.
when last gen a difference of 5-10% in resolution and 5 fps, was made to look huge, and note worthy



 

Intrinsic said:
Jazz2K said:
1. A lot of things could be done now to show what next gen gameplay is about but it requires a lot of work and a lot of gamers can't see past regular gameplay or don't want things to evolve at all.

2. AI for instance. AI greatly affects gameplay far more than 1080p vs 900p. A better AI for enemies, companions, NPCs and wild life could put games on a different level than where they were last gen.

3. We have cameras that can detect movements and facial expressions. Implemented well it could be a game changer. No need to replace the controller with camera movements, but the cam could be used to augment features from the game. Like characters could ask you to look away or just say no (in games like ME this could get conversations to a more life like level)...

4. Physics, destructions and atmosphere. A game like Drive Club is a great example of immersion through weather effects. Games could make use of that on a whole new level. It could affect how things react to environment.

5. All we get for now are last gen gameplay with better graphics.

Oh please, this si sthe exact same kinda nonsense that the journalists are spinning....

 

  1. Gamers ot wanting things to evolve has nothing to do with "next gen gameplay", if the gameplay is so great, then like always great gameplay will speak and sell itself. That has always been the case before.

  2. Nothing has ever stopped anyone from making great AI in a game. And this is the one thing that you have said that I will kinda agree with. But this isn't anything new. AI has always been a majory part of every game ever made, and again, this is basically just boils down to more of the same when you break it down.

  3. Now this part I completely do not agree with. I don't have a problem tacking on another controller input (in this case a camera) but here is the problem. ANYTHING, and I repeat anything that is easier to do with a button press gets broken the second you start having people go about doing them in some convuluted way for whatever reason. This also hapens to be one of those tings that sounds really good in your head, and maybe even good when you talk about it, but in practice, makes zero sense and have much better more effecient way sf doing them.

    Simply put, if your idea of next gen gameplay is that I can move my head to a direction that selects yes/no, or I can move my hand to select yes/no or I can hit a button that says X=yes/O=no; then I am sorry, but I will take old school gaming over that brand of next gen anyday.

  4. Agaian, you are just saying the same thing but using it to make a different non-existent argument. Everything you have described here is just the same age old more of the same. Look at every single generation dating back from the PS1. Weather effects, physics, lighting, level design and size...etc have always gotten better with each generation of consoles as they will no doubt get with this gen. These are all natural incremments with every new console, the very thing you are praising here is the very thing you/EG is also complaining about.

  5. Which is funny, cause most of what you just asked for here with exception to the AI stuff and camera stuff (which is a bad idea by the way) is exactly that. last gen gameplay with better graphics. 

    Whats really sad is that if you were to be honest, and really think about it, isn't every single racing game today just gran turismo 1 with better graphics? Isn't every FPS shoter today just halo evolved with better graphics, isn't every open world game today just GTA3 with better graphics? But wait!! last gen gears brought us that awesom cover system.... errr sorry, killswitch did it on the PS2.

    I think there are a lot of double tsandards when people make these accusations at current gen consolesor games. They are all talking about this fabled next gen stuff, but no one actually ever talks about what that is in a way that it actually makes sense and not sound redundant. 

 


1 - I'm sorry but things need time and todays people aren't ready to give any of it. No new innovation was super great when it was first released it got better with time and as it was refined. New gameplay mechanics often comes with new hardware and new controllers. From the Atari to Nes to SNES and then to Playstation' Dual Shock but since then it's like we stagnated. Whatever anyone can say about Nintendo, at least they tried to bring new types of gameplay with each of their new hardware. Sometimes it was for the better while other times it was for the worse but they tried. If you keep the same controller then come up with things you didn't/could do the gen before. Will every gamers jump in the new thing? No of course but at least try it.

2 - Great AI requires time of development too. It also requires ressources but I read somewhere that if AI was too intelligent in games it would ovverpower the gamer and the gamer wouldn't have any fun so he would stop playing. I think this is true to some extent. AI isn't only about ennemies and sometimes it would be great to feel how the new hardware could pull this foward. When I first played Halo, the AI was what I remember most about the game back in 01. I thought it would get only better from then on but ehh, some AAA games today can't even compte with it.

3 - I'll say it again, I don't think replacing button presses with camera movements work at all. I think cameras could do what buttons can't. There are things we can do with this but people decided that cameras were to be hated like AIDS. Buttons can't see you nor can they hear you. I think it's devs work to come up with ways to implement them properly. Last gen they tried to replace button commands with camera movements and it failed. Does this mean there is nothing we can do with them?  I don't think you are agains't wheels for racing games. Now imagine if you had to play a shooter with a wheel when the controls aren't adapted for that kind of game. You would be agains't wheels immediately. That's what happened with last gen but you would be surprised how motion controlled games are nice when done properly.

4 - I'm talking about their usefulness in gameplay. Not only for esthetics. This is getting better and better but how many games offer destruction where you can use destroyed objects to deal with ennemies. Not many games offer you the option to use what's in background at your advantage and/or at your disadvantage. Enemies could interact with objects more than just hide behind them waiting for you to kill them. As for weather and environments I'm not talking about scripted set pieces.

5 - Better graphics in higher resolution and better lightning. These won't give you different gameplay.

Bolded: It's not that easy really. Gaming is mostly a matter of opinions and preferences. The fact that some people can't tell you exactly what new features they expect doesn't mean there isn't anything new to be done. There will be new things of course, wew are only one year with the new hardwares. But I hope devs put a little less ressources in graphics fidelity and push other features more. The possibilities are there.



We are not so easily entertained anymore. The question is who's fault is it?



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I played Mario kart 8, dark souls 2 and bayonetta 2, probably had the best experience from both titles this year. Did they have next gen gameplay? Don't think so? I don't think anyone wanting next gen knows what they want, to me its a silly reasoning for gamers that aren't interested in the games released on Xbox and PlayStation. What do you want from ps4/x1? A new gameplay experience? One thing I know for sure, we won't see anything from these three consoles so next gen seeking gamers will wait till the next consoles, if any. D PC gamers even seek next gen?



SocialistSlayer said:
i just find it funny how much they downplay the ps4's commanding lead in terms of technical capability.
when last gen a difference of 5-10% in resolution and 5 fps, was made to look huge, and note worthy


Yeah pretty much double standard BS we've seen from them for a while.

 

Also I disagree with this article because it ignores some pretty big game changing stuff. Aside from the steadily increasing quality of graphics; advanged physics, superior resolutions, material shaders, etc, etc (all of which make for more believable and immersive worlds), I think we've seen quite a bit of new-gen gameplay features so far. Just off the top of my head; I can free up the TV and walk around the house and keep playing my WiiU, I can walk out the door and keep playing my games via remote play with PS4 and Vita, shit I can play my PS4 games across the damned country! I can share clips and images of my games instantly with anyone, I can let others try out  and jump into my games with Share Play, I can start playing my games before they're done being downloaded, I can navigae instantly to new content with Kinect, I can stop and start my games where I left off with resume play (no more slow slow boot up bs).......

This is only a partial list and we're just getting started! We only just finished year one for Chirst's sake, which is a transition year! I think this gen is a significant improvement so far and will become more so as these features are added and mature, and the software devs have time to dig their heals into the new machines. To say otherwise is non-sense.



Jazz2K said:


1 - I'm sorry but things need time and todays people aren't ready to give any of it. No new innovation was super great when it was first released it got better with time and as it was refined. New gameplay mechanics often comes with new hardware and new controllers. From the Atari to Nes to SNES and then to Playstation' Dual Shock but since then it's like we stagnated. Whatever anyone can say about Nintendo, at least they tried to bring new types of gameplay with each of their new hardware. Sometimes it was for the better while other times it was for the worse but they tried. If you keep the same controller then come up with things you didn't/could do the gen before. Will every gamers jump in the new thing? No of course but at least try it.

2 - Great AI requires time of development too. It also requires ressources but I read somewhere that if AI was too intelligent in games it would ovverpower the gamer and the gamer wouldn't have any fun so he would stop playing. I think this is true to some extent. AI isn't only about ennemies and sometimes it would be great to feel how the new hardware could pull this foward. When I first played Halo, the AI was what I remember most about the game back in 01. I thought it would get only better from then on but ehh, some AAA games today can't even compte with it.

3 - I'll say it again, I don't think replacing button presses with camera movements work at all. I think cameras could do what buttons can't. There are things we can do with this but people decided that cameras were to be hated like AIDS. Buttons can't see you nor can they hear you. I think it's devs work to come up with ways to implement them properly. Last gen they tried to replace button commands with camera movements and it failed. Does this mean there is nothing we can do with them?  I don't think you are agains't wheels for racing games. Now imagine if you had to play a shooter with a wheel when the controls aren't adapted for that kind of game. You would be agains't wheels immediately. That's what happened with last gen but you would be surprised how motion controlled games are nice when done properly.

4 - I'm talking about their usefulness in gameplay. Not only for esthetics. This is getting better and better but how many games offer destruction where you can use destroyed objects to deal with ennemies. Not many games offer you the option to use what's in background at your advantage and/or at your disadvantage. Enemies could interact with objects more than just hide behind them waiting for you to kill them. As for weather and environments I'm not talking about scripted set pieces.

5 - Better graphics in higher resolution and better lightning. These won't give you different gameplay.

Bolded: It's not that easy really. Gaming is mostly a matter of opinions and preferences. The fact that some people can't tell you exactly what new features they expect doesn't mean there isn't anything new to be done. There will be new things of course, wew are only one year with the new hardwares. But I hope devs put a little less ressources in graphics fidelity and push other features more. The possibilities are there.

  1. same can be said about the automobile, after we got the combustion engine I guess we can say we stagnated for over a 100yrs. And are now only finally beginning to explore other types of powertrains. The simple answer to your staganation problem, is that meaningfulchange can only be made when the technology is there to support it. And by meaningful I mean things that are as long standing as analouge sticks on a controller and not motion controls.

  2. There are also some games with great AI. AI is just one part of a game development process, and every developer has a right to chose how much or how little of their time they want to invest in the game AI. Sometimes, what a game needs a stupid AI, next gen doesn't automatically mean that you should have alien isolation like AI in every game. Imagine playing Mario and that thing you are trying to hop on to kill decideds to take cover then flanks you.

  3. Ok, indulge me, give me one... just one meaningful usage case scenario where having a camera adds/expands the depth in gameplay found in any type of game.

    Camera's didn't become AIDs overnight, they had years to prove their worth and even now people are still willing to give them a ahcance. There is still noting about using a camera to augment or bolster gaming as we know it that comes off making sense or being better than just using a controller to carry out that function.

    People didn't just adopt analouge sticks, or vibrating controlers because someone had the sense to put them into a controller, people adopt things because it makes sense to have them and not just cause they are there. If analouge controls suck, no one would use them and they wouldn't be in every controller today. If motion controls suck, they would fade away too, if camera assisted gaming suck, they go away. If the wiiU gamepad ends up adding no real meaningful value to wiiU games, be rest assured that you won't see it in the next console. And its not about gamers not wanting to give things a chance, if the devs even knew what to do with these "next gen" control inputs that you seem to be referencing, they would have made great games on them that everybody will want to go and play. Thats kinda how the industry works you know?

  4. Now this is someting you have said that I can fully get behind. Then again, I think like you said in your first point here..these things take time. This gen has only just begun and we can already see traces of such things, like in DC.

  5. Thats one way to cherry pick my comment... what about the rest of things that encompass bigger and better instead of just resolution and lightning. What about bigger levels? More NPCs on screen, Better animations...etc. These things not only all affect gameplay but can determine what kinda game you even make. 

I don't doubt the possibilities are there. Personally I think that the only major changes we will see as far as conventional games go are in the feilds of AI and even better more synced presentation. Anything outside that will be in the realm of VR. But what I don't get is, those that do complain about the current gen consoles especially by saying "next gen gameplay" have never been able to show, give an example of or refernece what to them qualifies as next gen gameplay in this day and age. We CANNOT have a Mario 64 moment again right now.  Its almost like movies are praised for finally being in colour, then criticized for remaining in color, no matter how much betterthose colors are or how much better the stort teling methods are. Thats exactly what "no next gen gameplay" sounds like to me.


pokoko said:
Ultimately, any difference is up to the developers. How fast can they come to grips with the technology? Will they build to the least common denominator? Is parity in their best interest as a business strategy?

My guess is that the majority of games will have superficial differences between the systems. Now and then, with a game that pushes the hardware, and where the developers really don't want to pare back, we'll see a title offer clear advantages on the PS4. That will be the exception rather than the rule, however, especially with big publishers who need to please both platform holders.

Personally, I don't really care, unless we're talking about a vast performance discrepancy. I'd gladly take the less powerful device as long as it had the games I want to play.

I also have no intention of judging the games from the first year as though they will be representative of what the new consoles can offer. I've seen too many console launches to make that mistake.

wise words.



This may sound petty, but why does Xbox One constantly get top listing over PS4 in articles despite PS4 being industry leader? 90 % of the time It's Xbox One and PS4, hardly ever PS4 and Xbox One....