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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - 3DS is cannibalizing Wii U

Soundwave on 01 April 2014
nitekrawler1285 said:
oniyide said:
Soundwave said:
curl-6 said:
oniyide said:

its says high as well, lets throw xone in the mix. PS3 was STILL doing better than WIi U in the same time frame so i dont evne know why you brought that up

Because PS4 is the exception to the rule. Generally a more expensive console, like the PS3/360/Wii U, will not hit its real stride until it drops in price.


System's today really are not as expensive as people make them out to be. 

The Super NES when inflation is taken into account was the equivalent of $337 at launch. The original Game Boy would be $183. The Playstation clocks in at $451. The GameCube $264. 

$400 today or less in today's market for a relatively high end piece of electronics is a fairly affordble price. 

By and large most electronics are cheaper today actually than they used to be back in 80s/90s. If you wanted a really high end TV back then you have to pay a good $3000 to get one, DVD players were $1000+ at launch and for quite a while, a nicely speced PC also cost a lot more back then. 

i suspect he'll keep ignoring this. You and I know, hell just about everyone at this point knows the WIi U is doing bad becasue it is not desirable. Price has little to do with it as we have two consoles who are crapping all over it sales wise for much higher prices. He will ignore this becasue he cannot accept that the product he loves is not loved by most gamers. I mean the evidence is right there.

I would say the inflation argument is invalid personally.  Consumers don't compare inflation adjusted prices.  They compare MSRP.  When compared by MSRP as customers would you can clearly see that Nintendo has never had such a high MSRP for any of their home consoles or handhelds as the Wii U and 3DS(In both cases a full $100 more than ever before).  So while inflation may say that it isn't that much more expensive or cheaper that isn't going to be consumer reaction.  

Even if Wii U is cheaper if it doesn't get or play the games that PS360 customers want it doesn't offer the same value in comparison.  The problem is Nintendo trying to be directly comparable when they obviously aren't.  

$299.99 really isn't unreasonable for a brand new console in this day and age. It's the cheapest of the three consoles ... everyone makes such a big fuss about the PS4 being $100 cheaper than the XB1 as being a huge factor (and it is) ... but the Wii U seems to get no bounce from being a further $100 cheaper than the PS4, lol. 

To be honest too it's really not all that difficult to find Wii U's at many retailers marked down from that $299.99 price point too ... my local Best Buy has a ton of Skylanders/Nintendo Land Wii U bundles collecting dust on the shelves at $239.99. And we hear about mark down deals on the console all the time. 

The difference is people don't want what Nintendo is offering, so there I agree with your second point. The price really doesn't matter if what Nintendo is offering holds minimal value to the consumer. 

No one wants a niche console, any more than someone wants a video format that only gets 4-5 good movies every year. 



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oniyide on 01 April 2014
nitekrawler1285 said:
oniyide said:
Soundwave said:
curl-6 said:
oniyide said:

its says high as well, lets throw xone in the mix. PS3 was STILL doing better than WIi U in the same time frame so i dont evne know why you brought that up

Because PS4 is the exception to the rule. Generally a more expensive console, like the PS3/360/Wii U, will not hit its real stride until it drops in price.


System's today really are not as expensive as people make them out to be. 

The Super NES when inflation is taken into account was the equivalent of $337 at launch. The original Game Boy would be $183. The Playstation clocks in at $451. The GameCube $264. 

$400 today or less in today's market for a relatively high end piece of electronics is a fairly affordble price. 

By and large most electronics are cheaper today actually than they used to be back in 80s/90s. If you wanted a really high end TV back then you have to pay a good $3000 to get one, DVD players were $1000+ at launch and for quite a while, a nicely speced PC also cost a lot more back then. 

i suspect he'll keep ignoring this. You and I know, hell just about everyone at this point knows the WIi U is doing bad becasue it is not desirable. Price has little to do with it as we have two consoles who are crapping all over it sales wise for much higher prices. He will ignore this becasue he cannot accept that the product he loves is not loved by most gamers. I mean the evidence is right there.

I would say the inflation argument is invalid personally.  Consumers don't compare inflation adjusted prices.  They compare MSRP.  When compared by MSRP as customers would you can clearly see that Nintendo has never had such a high MSRP for any of their home consoles or handhelds as the Wii U and 3DS(In both cases a full $100 more than ever before).  So while inflation may say that it isn't that much more expensive or cheaper that isn't going to be consumer reaction.  

Even if Wii U is cheaper if it doesn't get or play the games that PS360 customers want it doesn't offer the same value in comparison.  The problem is Nintendo trying to be directly comparable when they obviously aren't.  


fair enough, this is what i was trying to ask Curl but he kept ducking the question. So when its all said and done. People just dont thinkg Ninty systems are WORTH the higher price. THats a problem one I dont know how Ninty could fix.



nitekrawler1285 on 01 April 2014
Soundwave said:

$299.99 really isn't unreasonable for a brand new console in this day and age. It's the cheapest of the three consoles ... everyone makes such a big fuss about the PS4 being $100 cheaper than the XB1 as being a huge factor (and it is) ... but the Wii U seems to get no bounce from being a further $100 cheaper than the PS4, lol. 

To be honest too it's really not all that difficult to find Wii U's at many retailers marked down from that $299.99 price point too ... my local Best Buy has a ton of Skylanders/Nintendo Land Wii U bundles collecting dust on the shelves at $239.99. And we hear about mark down deals on the console all the time. 

The difference is people don't want what Nintendo is offering, so there I agree with your second point. The price really doesn't matter if what Nintendo is offering holds minimal value to the consumer. 

No one wants a niche console, any more than someone wants a video format that only gets 4-5 good movies every year. 


If you are looking for a PS360 style console even at 299 Wii U makes the worst option.  You can get an actual PS360 for a 199. Many times alot less than that with the kinds of games you are looking for and more variety among those genres.  If you have to have the latest and greatest games Wii U doesn't have them.  So even at 100 less than PS4 it's not really a worthwhile comparison.  Wii U fights Wii game enjoying customers the same way PS360 does being massively cheaper and having more of the relevant types of titles.  Rock-WiiU-HardPlace 

There will always be 15-20 million people whom will jump on board for some classic Nintendo games without much 3rd party support. I think Gamecube and Wii U illustrate that quite clearly.  I was one of the 20 million and I'm now excluded because I really only want 1 game on the system. I'm not doing it at 240 for one game. I did for Smash alone @ 99 last time with the GC.  

Because of my tastes in most years as of late I probably couldn't count more than 4-5 great games or movies a year. I buy niche consoles when they have experiences I know that I will enjoy. I prefer older games to newer ones generally. So VC and PSN classics mean a lot more to me than most.   



nitekrawler1285 on 01 April 2014
oniyide said:

fair enough, this is what i was trying to ask Curl but he kept ducking the question. So when its all said and done. People just dont thinkg Ninty systems are WORTH the higher price. THats a problem one I dont know how Ninty could fix.

The Wii raised the standard Nintendo home console price by 50 and no one seemed to care. They can create this value.   It's by making compelling, accessible experiences that compete on different values.  The Wii U can be seen as a substitute product of the PS360.  If you can be seen that way you are competing on the same values.  There was no substitute product for the Wii.  The Wii often sold for Wii U's price due to forced retailer bundling it's first 2 years. Even using superior technology and better graphics and eventually consoles that were just as cheap MS and Sony could not compete with the Wii.  



oniyide on 01 April 2014
nitekrawler1285 said:
oniyide said:

fair enough, this is what i was trying to ask Curl but he kept ducking the question. So when its all said and done. People just dont thinkg Ninty systems are WORTH the higher price. THats a problem one I dont know how Ninty could fix.

The Wii raised the standard Nintendo home console price by 50 and no one seemed to care. They can create this value.   It's by making compelling, accessible experiences that compete on different values.  The Wii U can be seen as a substitute product of the PS360.  If you can be seen that way you are competing on the same values.  There was no substitute product for the Wii.  The Wii often sold for Wii U's price due to forced retailer bundling it's first 2 years. Even using superior technology and better graphics and eventually consoles that were just as cheap MS and Sony could not compete with the Wii.  

so it comes down to either Ninty pull a Wii every gen (which as we can see is impossibe) or they will be relegated to niche console status? Thats messed up for them and seem to be two very big extremes.



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nitekrawler1285 on 01 April 2014
oniyide said:
nitekrawler1285 said:
oniyide said:

fair enough, this is what i was trying to ask Curl but he kept ducking the question. So when its all said and done. People just dont thinkg Ninty systems are WORTH the higher price. THats a problem one I dont know how Ninty could fix.

The Wii raised the standard Nintendo home console price by 50 and no one seemed to care. They can create this value.   It's by making compelling, accessible experiences that compete on different values.  The Wii U can be seen as a substitute product of the PS360.  If you can be seen that way you are competing on the same values.  There was no substitute product for the Wii.  The Wii often sold for Wii U's price due to forced retailer bundling it's first 2 years. Even using superior technology and better graphics and eventually consoles that were just as cheap MS and Sony could not compete with the Wii.  

so it comes down to either Ninty pull a Wii every gen (which as we can see is impossibe) or they will be relegated to niche console status? Thats messed up for them and seem to be two very big extremes.

We don't know if it's impossible because Nintendo never intended the Wii U to be like the Wii. Even Nintendo admitted it was at first reaching for a higher end consumer.  So of course Wii U failed to pull a Wii.  Not to mention that things that make the console more attractive to that audience actively pushes away Wii style customers. More processing power brings up system costs, and the controller also made it not just less accessible but more actively intimidating.  It would be actively repulsive to most of the Wii customers  initially. As I figured it didn't compete with PS360 or PS4X1 it never sold enough for them to bring costs down swiftly enough to even try to effectively get Wii customers. Not that it would have worked.    

I know that Nintendo can't build a machine to parity with whatever Sony and MS will be offering without spending through their war chest.  That means  3rd party support isn't really something they can count on. Hell even if they did they can't count on 3rd parites.   I also know that outside of a few outstanding games their online isn't amazing.  We can continue comparing them to Sony and MS's strenghts but you see what a losing battle that is.  

The way I look at it Nintendo only has one option and that is to actually try to Wii every gen.  Nintendo has the same choice that any business providing a product has to face. It is also extreme: Make what the market wants or die.  They can do that by making consoles that can be profitable in their niche or they can seek new markets.   

 



curl-6 on 01 April 2014

Go to sleep, go to work, come home, about 5 replies to my posts from different people.



JGarret on 01 April 2014
curl-6 said:

Go to sleep, go to work, come home, about 5 replies to my posts from different people.


Well, your thread turned out to be quite popular, and it´s a nice debate.



curl-6 on 01 April 2014
JGarret said:
curl-6 said:

Go to sleep, go to work, come home, about 5 replies to my posts from different people.


Well, your thread turned out to be quite popular, and it´s a nice debate.

Thank you. The intent was to stir discussion.



Conegamer on 02 April 2014

3DS isn't cannabalizing Wii U, they're aimed at totally different audiences. The reasons the Wii U is struggling are brand recongition and too few games in its first few months after launch to keep momentum going. The 3DS has nothing to do with that IMO.

Also, I've noticed a fair few people with Quote Trees above 2 quotes. Please keep them below that in future posts.



 

Here lies the dearly departed Nintendomination Thread.