Forums - Mobile Discussion - Nokia's share prices took a dive today

dallas said:
kowenicki said:
dallas said:

Nokia is unable to give an accurate forecast of its earnings and bc it failed at this, and had to revise said forecast negatively, it's shares fell by 18% today.  

 


incorrect.

it is because they CAN forecast a fall... your OP makes no sense.


The OP was based on the fact that they had to revise their forecast, which necessitates that wall street was mislead.

mislead?   implies lying.  revising forecasts happens all the time... look at Ninty and Sony... almost a hobby for them.



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kowenicki said:

People jumping to incorrect conclusions here just to try and score some points... presumably as some kind of chance at some pay back?

Bloomberg:

“The problem is their past products, the Symbian products,” said Robert Jakobsen, an analyst at Jyske Bank A/S (JYSK). “I assume it is the high end of the Symbian phones that are not selling well. On the other hand, there is increasing momentum on Lumia, and that is the future.”


I just wanted to post the same quote. :D

I don't even know why people bring MS into this at all. The Lumia is selling pretty good and it is clear that older phones caused some trouble for them.



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DirtyP2002 said:
kowenicki said:

People jumping to incorrect conclusions here just to try and score some points... presumably as some kind of chance at some pay back?

Bloomberg:

“The problem is their past products, the Symbian products,” said Robert Jakobsen, an analyst at Jyske Bank A/S (JYSK). “I assume it is the high end of the Symbian phones that are not selling well. On the other hand, there is increasing momentum on Lumia, and that is the future.”


I just wanted to post the same quote. :D

I don't even know why people bring MS into this at all. The Lumia is selling pretty good and it is clear that older phones caused some trouble for them.

To put things in to perspective

http://seekingalpha.com/article/492391-the-nokia-news-not-surprising?source=yahoo

"the feature phone is dying but it still represents a huge chunk of Nokia's sales (EUR 2.3 billion and 71 million units as per the press release, which is a lot more than EUR 1.7 billion from smart phones, out of which a bit more than EUR 0.44 billion is coming from Lumias"

Lumia phones represent 1/4 of Nokias smartphone revenue, which represent 42% of their overall revenue. 58% of the Q1 revenue came from dumbphones...



disolitude said:
NintendoPie said:
Geez! Nokia keeps producing these really nice phones and is still failing compared to HTC (Not doing much better with %'s either), Samsung, and Motorola. Hopefully they'll pick up soon.

Motorola isn't doing very hot to be honest.

And HTC is barely clinging on profit margins. Back in 2010 HTC had 4 Windows phones, 3 Windows mobile devices and a slew of androids and they were booming. In 2012 so far they have announced 3 Android phones, 1 Windows phone 7.5 and 1 Windows Phone 8 coming in later in the year. Market is becoming a lot more competitive and everyone is re-focusing their efforts.

The truth about Nokia is that they probably need tho shed some weight. They have been a massive mobile player all these years but the times are changing. They sold 70 million dumbphones instead of 100 million anticipated which is a lot less but should be still more than anyone else.

Something Cell Phone companies also need to learn is exclusives are dumb. Just plain dumb. They get less chance of selling more of their smartphone and they anger the Cell Phone Providers and their customers when they don't get a certain phone. They need to make things more widely available. 



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NintendoPie said:
disolitude said:
NintendoPie said:
Geez! Nokia keeps producing these really nice phones and is still failing compared to HTC (Not doing much better with %'s either), Samsung, and Motorola. Hopefully they'll pick up soon.

Motorola isn't doing very hot to be honest.

And HTC is barely clinging on profit margins. Back in 2010 HTC had 4 Windows phones, 3 Windows mobile devices and a slew of androids and they were booming. In 2012 so far they have announced 3 Android phones, 1 Windows phone 7.5 and 1 Windows Phone 8 coming in later in the year. Market is becoming a lot more competitive and everyone is re-focusing their efforts.

The truth about Nokia is that they probably need tho shed some weight. They have been a massive mobile player all these years but the times are changing. They sold 70 million dumbphones instead of 100 million anticipated which is a lot less but should be still more than anyone else.

Something Cell Phone companies also need to learn is exclusives are dumb. Just plain dumb. They get less chance of selling more of their smartphone and they anger the Cell Phone Providers and their customers when they don't get a certain phone. They need to make things more widely available. 


Its the nature of the business due to carriers.

Nokia's job is to persue AT&T, Verizon, Sprint or whoever to buy their phones. Nokia would gladly make things available to everyone but the carriers don't want this. AT&T is getting beind the Lumia 900 only because this is something they can have and other carriers can't.

Carriers don't make a lot of sense to me to be honest. AT&T has ordered both HTC Titan 2 and Nokia Lumia in large quantities. HTC would not have made the Titan 2 if AT&T wasn't willing to sell it as they are the only carrier with that device. It makes absolutely no sense for AT&T to want the Titan 2. Sure the Titan was a good seller for them, but they have the Lumia 900 which they are paying 150 million to advertise themselves.Then there is a 199 dollar price VS 99 for the Lumia 900.

Lumia 900 marketing push + better hardware design + half the price = a lot of unsold Titan 2 inventory

It would have made so much more sense for Titan 2 to go to Verizon and Verizon, AT&T, Nokia, HTC and Microsoft would have been much better off for it. A 10 year old could figure this out, so I wonder why these companies couldn't put the 2 and 2 together...



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disolitude said:
NintendoPie said:
disolitude said:
NintendoPie said:
Geez! Nokia keeps producing these really nice phones and is still failing compared to HTC (Not doing much better with %'s either), Samsung, and Motorola. Hopefully they'll pick up soon.

Motorola isn't doing very hot to be honest.

And HTC is barely clinging on profit margins. Back in 2010 HTC had 4 Windows phones, 3 Windows mobile devices and a slew of androids and they were booming. In 2012 so far they have announced 3 Android phones, 1 Windows phone 7.5 and 1 Windows Phone 8 coming in later in the year. Market is becoming a lot more competitive and everyone is re-focusing their efforts.

The truth about Nokia is that they probably need tho shed some weight. They have been a massive mobile player all these years but the times are changing. They sold 70 million dumbphones instead of 100 million anticipated which is a lot less but should be still more than anyone else.

Something Cell Phone companies also need to learn is exclusives are dumb. Just plain dumb. They get less chance of selling more of their smartphone and they anger the Cell Phone Providers and their customers when they don't get a certain phone. They need to make things more widely available. 

Lumia 900 marketing push + better hardware design + half the price = a lot of unsold Titan 2 inventory

 


Uh, a price cut Is usually a bad sign, desperation and all that, Nokia is trading profit margin for revenue, which is shrinking anyway



Turkish said:
I have a little book about Nokia from 13 years ago, they were so far ahead of their time, they were predicting that in the future we would have touch based phones, they even had some 3D photos of some "prototypes", if anyone is interested I can scan them.

I'm interested, actually.  Also, here's a pic of Mickey from Snatch just to sweeten the deal.  You guys are friends, right?

Are you familiar with those AT&T "You Will" commercials from the 90's?  I like looking at those, too.  Pretty impressive how they were able to predict the future.



Twitter: @d21lewis  --I'll add you if you add me!!

d21lewis said:
Turkish said:
I have a little book about Nokia from 13 years ago, they were so far ahead of their time, they were predicting that in the future we would have touch based phones, they even had some 3D photos of some "prototypes", if anyone is interested I can scan them.

I'm interested, actually.  Also, here's a pic of Mickey from Snatch just to sweeten the deal.  You guys are friends, right?

Are you familiar with those AT&T "You Will" commercials from the 90's?  I like looking at those, too.  Pretty impressive how they were able to predict the future.

D'ya like dags?



Disconnect and self destruct, one bullet a time.

dallas said:
disolitude said:
NintendoPie said:
disolitude said:
NintendoPie said:
Geez! Nokia keeps producing these really nice phones and is still failing compared to HTC (Not doing much better with %'s either), Samsung, and Motorola. Hopefully they'll pick up soon.

Motorola isn't doing very hot to be honest.

And HTC is barely clinging on profit margins. Back in 2010 HTC had 4 Windows phones, 3 Windows mobile devices and a slew of androids and they were booming. In 2012 so far they have announced 3 Android phones, 1 Windows phone 7.5 and 1 Windows Phone 8 coming in later in the year. Market is becoming a lot more competitive and everyone is re-focusing their efforts.

The truth about Nokia is that they probably need tho shed some weight. They have been a massive mobile player all these years but the times are changing. They sold 70 million dumbphones instead of 100 million anticipated which is a lot less but should be still more than anyone else.

Something Cell Phone companies also need to learn is exclusives are dumb. Just plain dumb. They get less chance of selling more of their smartphone and they anger the Cell Phone Providers and their customers when they don't get a certain phone. They need to make things more widely available. 

Lumia 900 marketing push + better hardware design + half the price = a lot of unsold Titan 2 inventory

 


Uh, a price cut Is usually a bad sign, desperation and all that, Nokia is trading profit margin for revenue, which is shrinking anyway


No, this price is a subsidized price mening you have to sign a contract. AT&T is offering the phone for 99 dollars which they subsidize if you sign a 2 year contract and give them 1000s of dollars during this time. Or you can buy the phone for 450 with no contract. For a phone that cost 209 dollars to build, 450 is a healthy profit margin.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/47021428/ns/technology_and_science-wireless/



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disolitude said:

Its the nature of the business due to carriers.

Nokia's job is to persue AT&T, Verizon, Sprint or whoever to buy their phones. Nokia would gladly make things available to everyone but the carriers don't want this. AT&T is getting beind the Lumia 900 only because this is something they can have and other carriers can't.

Carriers don't make a lot of sense to me to be honest. AT&T has ordered both HTC Titan 2 and Nokia Lumia in large quantities. HTC would not have made the Titan 2 if AT&T wasn't willing to sell it as they are the only carrier with that device. It makes absolutely no sense for AT&T to want the Titan 2. Sure the Titan was a good seller for them, but they have the Lumia 900 which they are paying 150 million to advertise themselves.Then there is a 199 dollar price VS 99 for the Lumia 900.

Lumia 900 marketing push + better hardware design + half the price = a lot of unsold Titan 2 inventory

It would have made so much more sense for Titan 2 to go to Verizon and Verizon, AT&T, Nokia, HTC and Microsoft would have been much better off for it. A 10 year old could figure this out, so I wonder why these companies couldn't put the 2 and 2 together...

To be honest, Cell Phone Providers seem to be the stupidest parts of the business world. Seriously.





Carl is a Piplup hater and deserves to be punished eternally.