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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - Am I the only one worried about the future of Wii U?

Mr Khan on 12 April 2012
Slimebeast said:
Jumpin said:
Since all other points (save 2) have been effectively refuted.

Let me ask about point 2; what is a "hardcore gamer" and why do "Microsoft and Sony own them"?

This doesn't really make a lot of sense to me. As in the next generation, the definition of a "hardcore gamer" will be different or might not even exist; because the term is a little ridiculous as 1337 gamer was before it - and it also means something different now than it did a few years ago.

Second, Sony and Microsoft don't "own" anybody; gamers own Sony and Microsoft systems. Next generation is a new ballpark - people who may use Sony and Microsoft consoles now could easily buy a Nintendo console if it is enticing enough. Less than half of the PS2 audience bought a PS3, and many of those bought Wii and Xbox 360. I see no reason why it would be any different now. Nintendo has the greatest potential user base going into next generation considering 250 million pieces of Nintendo hardware have sold between Wii and DS this generation.

Do you really believe this?

I think there definitely exists such a thing as hardcore gamers who make up the majority of the user base on PS3 and X360. And these guys are more or less locked to next gen Sony and MS (thanks to being hooked with their respective online infrastructures and whatnot).

I believe Wii U will be quite successful, they'll be all fine. They have their unique games and their loyal hardcore base, the Wii U will launch first in a new gen which is always an advantage and the projected launch price of $300 is amazing, and most importantly with that special controller they will be able to attract a big portion of the casual gamers and family gamers in the coming gen.

But the typical hardcore gamer for the most part still belongs to PS and Xbox I believe (note, I see it as there are two types of hardcore gamers - the HD gamer and the traditional Nintendo gamer). All the millions of gamers who play lots of HD games in this gen, all the Halo and Assassin's Creed guys, and the millions of semi-casual gamers, the COD and FIFA guys, they will mostly buy a PS4 and Nextbox.

Still as I say, the Nintendo Wii U will be fine. +50 million units lifetime is a reasonable goal.

The semi-casuals can handily be converted, especially if the Wii U better meets the needs of other individuals in the households. If the third parties actually make versions of FIFA, Madden, and Call of Duty that have the same features as the PS360 versions, then there would be no specific reason to buy it for any one system, then it comes down to: who meets a broader set of needs?



Monster Hunter: pissing me off since 2010.

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Slimebeast on 12 April 2012
Mr Khan said:
Slimebeast said:
Jumpin said:
Since all other points (save 2) have been effectively refuted.

Let me ask about point 2; what is a "hardcore gamer" and why do "Microsoft and Sony own them"?

This doesn't really make a lot of sense to me. As in the next generation, the definition of a "hardcore gamer" will be different or might not even exist; because the term is a little ridiculous as 1337 gamer was before it - and it also means something different now than it did a few years ago.

Second, Sony and Microsoft don't "own" anybody; gamers own Sony and Microsoft systems. Next generation is a new ballpark - people who may use Sony and Microsoft consoles now could easily buy a Nintendo console if it is enticing enough. Less than half of the PS2 audience bought a PS3, and many of those bought Wii and Xbox 360. I see no reason why it would be any different now. Nintendo has the greatest potential user base going into next generation considering 250 million pieces of Nintendo hardware have sold between Wii and DS this generation.

Do you really believe this?

I think there definitely exists such a thing as hardcore gamers who make up the majority of the user base on PS3 and X360. And these guys are more or less locked to next gen Sony and MS (thanks to being hooked with their respective online infrastructures and whatnot).

I believe Wii U will be quite successful, they'll be all fine. They have their unique games and their loyal hardcore base, the Wii U will launch first in a new gen which is always an advantage and the projected launch price of $300 is amazing, and most importantly with that special controller they will be able to attract a big portion of the casual gamers and family gamers in the coming gen.

But the typical hardcore gamer for the most part still belongs to PS and Xbox I believe (note, I see it as there are two types of hardcore gamers - the HD gamer and the traditional Nintendo gamer). All the millions of gamers who play lots of HD games in this gen, all the Halo and Assassin's Creed guys, and the millions of semi-casual gamers, the COD and FIFA guys, they will mostly buy a PS4 and Nextbox.

Still as I say, the Nintendo Wii U will be fine. +50 million units lifetime is a reasonable goal.

The semi-casuals can handily be converted, especially if the Wii U better meets the needs of other individuals in the households. If the third parties actually make versions of FIFA, Madden, and Call of Duty that have the same features as the PS360 versions, then there would be no specific reason to buy it for any one system, then it comes down to: who meets a broader set of needs?

Some semi-casuals might get tricked over, all thanks to Wii U having the important one year advantage, but I still feel that the vast majority of the COD and FIFA guys will ignore the Wii U as they're already hooked to their current online echosystems and not until the nextgen PS and Xbox starts to reach the masses these guys will be ready to move to nextgen.



JGarret on 12 April 2012
Mr Khan said:
Slimebeast said:
Jumpin said:
Since all other points (save 2) have been effectively refuted.

Let me ask about point 2; what is a "hardcore gamer" and why do "Microsoft and Sony own them"?

This doesn't really make a lot of sense to me. As in the next generation, the definition of a "hardcore gamer" will be different or might not even exist; because the term is a little ridiculous as 1337 gamer was before it - and it also means something different now than it did a few years ago.

Second, Sony and Microsoft don't "own" anybody; gamers own Sony and Microsoft systems. Next generation is a new ballpark - people who may use Sony and Microsoft consoles now could easily buy a Nintendo console if it is enticing enough. Less than half of the PS2 audience bought a PS3, and many of those bought Wii and Xbox 360. I see no reason why it would be any different now. Nintendo has the greatest potential user base going into next generation considering 250 million pieces of Nintendo hardware have sold between Wii and DS this generation.

Do you really believe this?

I think there definitely exists such a thing as hardcore gamers who make up the majority of the user base on PS3 and X360. And these guys are more or less locked to next gen Sony and MS (thanks to being hooked with their respective online infrastructures and whatnot).

I believe Wii U will be quite successful, they'll be all fine. They have their unique games and their loyal hardcore base, the Wii U will launch first in a new gen which is always an advantage and the projected launch price of $300 is amazing, and most importantly with that special controller they will be able to attract a big portion of the casual gamers and family gamers in the coming gen.

But the typical hardcore gamer for the most part still belongs to PS and Xbox I believe (note, I see it as there are two types of hardcore gamers - the HD gamer and the traditional Nintendo gamer). All the millions of gamers who play lots of HD games in this gen, all the Halo and Assassin's Creed guys, and the millions of semi-casual gamers, the COD and FIFA guys, they will mostly buy a PS4 and Nextbox.

Still as I say, the Nintendo Wii U will be fine. +50 million units lifetime is a reasonable goal.

The semi-casuals can handily be converted, especially if the Wii U better meets the needs of other individuals in the households. If the third parties actually make versions of FIFA, Madden, and Call of Duty that have the same features as the PS360 versions, then there would be no specific reason to buy it for any one system, then it comes down to: who meets a broader set of needs?

Mr Khan, the 'COD crowd' (apparently, the dream of every developer and publisher nowadays -_- ) might not be so easy, given (I may be wrong here,I don´t know for sure) that maybe a big part of that crowd plays online and is, by now, heavily invested in XboxLive/PSN.



davidd_err18 on 12 April 2012
JGarret said:
Mr Khan said:
Slimebeast said:
Jumpin said:
Since all other points (save 2) have been effectively refuted.

Let me ask about point 2; what is a "hardcore gamer" and why do "Microsoft and Sony own them"?

This doesn't really make a lot of sense to me. As in the next generation, the definition of a "hardcore gamer" will be different or might not even exist; because the term is a little ridiculous as 1337 gamer was before it - and it also means something different now than it did a few years ago.

Second, Sony and Microsoft don't "own" anybody; gamers own Sony and Microsoft systems. Next generation is a new ballpark - people who may use Sony and Microsoft consoles now could easily buy a Nintendo console if it is enticing enough. Less than half of the PS2 audience bought a PS3, and many of those bought Wii and Xbox 360. I see no reason why it would be any different now. Nintendo has the greatest potential user base going into next generation considering 250 million pieces of Nintendo hardware have sold between Wii and DS this generation.

Do you really believe this?

I think there definitely exists such a thing as hardcore gamers who make up the majority of the user base on PS3 and X360. And these guys are more or less locked to next gen Sony and MS (thanks to being hooked with their respective online infrastructures and whatnot).

I believe Wii U will be quite successful, they'll be all fine. They have their unique games and their loyal hardcore base, the Wii U will launch first in a new gen which is always an advantage and the projected launch price of $300 is amazing, and most importantly with that special controller they will be able to attract a big portion of the casual gamers and family gamers in the coming gen.

But the typical hardcore gamer for the most part still belongs to PS and Xbox I believe (note, I see it as there are two types of hardcore gamers - the HD gamer and the traditional Nintendo gamer). All the millions of gamers who play lots of HD games in this gen, all the Halo and Assassin's Creed guys, and the millions of semi-casual gamers, the COD and FIFA guys, they will mostly buy a PS4 and Nextbox.

Still as I say, the Nintendo Wii U will be fine. +50 million units lifetime is a reasonable goal.

The semi-casuals can handily be converted, especially if the Wii U better meets the needs of other individuals in the households. If the third parties actually make versions of FIFA, Madden, and Call of Duty that have the same features as the PS360 versions, then there would be no specific reason to buy it for any one system, then it comes down to: who meets a broader set of needs?

Mr Khan, the 'COD crowd' (apparently, the dream of every developer and publisher nowadays -_- ) might not be so easy, given (I may be wrong here,I don´t know for sure) that maybe a big part of that crowd plays online and is, by now, heavily invested in XboxLive/PSN.

Exactly, they have spend years in this fully formed networks and with hundreds of friends, why are they going to BUY another console just to play the next Call Of Duty? These guys are not going to get a Wii U, and ask their friend to get a Wii U just to play together :P, they already can do it with their own console. Ports of 360/PS3 games will not make a big impact in that market, of course, if a person already decided to buy a Wii U, they can get these games, but dont expect people to switch to the opposite team because of FIFA/COD/Madden.



Mr Khan on 12 April 2012
Slimebeast said:
Mr Khan said:

The semi-casuals can handily be converted, especially if the Wii U better meets the needs of other individuals in the households. If the third parties actually make versions of FIFA, Madden, and Call of Duty that have the same features as the PS360 versions, then there would be no specific reason to buy it for any one system, then it comes down to: who meets a broader set of needs?

Some semi-casuals might get tricked over, all thanks to Wii U having the important one year advantage, but I still feel that the vast majority of the COD and FIFA guys will ignore the Wii U as they're already hooked to their current online echosystems and not until the nextgen PS and Xbox starts to reach the masses these guys will be ready to move to nextgen.

One has to think defensively, not offensively, which is something i've said several times in this thread (and this applies to JGarret and Davidd_err as well). These people are passive receptors merely of PlayStation and Xbox products, and when it comes time to move on, what if Wii U has captured a good deal of momentum by then? Or what if someone else in a semi-casual's family wants their Wii U Fit, and this convinces them to get a Wii U and only a Wii U because it has the same versions of Call of Duty and FIFA as the other guys?

I'll agree that very few people will buy Wii U expressly for such games, but the parity of the Wii U could prevent people from buying other systems expressly for these games, which is something that happened this generation.

We also heavily overestimate the impact of an online community in this case. Just as piss-poor online gaming really didn't hurt the Wii that much, so the finer points of online networks are a non-factor in the bigger picture now.



Monster Hunter: pissing me off since 2010.

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davidd_err18 on 13 April 2012

 

This is a nice little mock up someone made in another thread :P, I hope nintendo can make something that looks like this, only better, but I am not too confident in them xD



PSwii60 on 13 April 2012
davidd_err18 said:

This is a nice little mock up someone made in another thread :P, I hope nintendo can make something that looks like this, only better, but I am not too confident in them xD

I kinda like that little Mii with Samus' Power Suit on. I hope Nintendo does stuff for our Miis like Avatars' costumes, suits, etc...



KeptoKnight on 19 April 2012
Mr Khan said:
chocoloco said:
Mr Khan said:
 

1. Sony and Microsoft are only going as far as holiday 2013 before bringing their successors out. This is becoming more and more clear as time proceeds

2. Exclusives do win generations, and always have, but you need the right exclusives. The relationship between 3D Mario and 2D Mario, as well as some of the other missteps Nintendo took with their own games in the N64 and GC era shows simply that Nintendo lost their way, not that the rules of the game changed. The Wii U will stand or fall by presence or absence of Wii and NES-type titles.

3. Third parties need the Wii U just as much as Wii U needs third parties. Skyrocketing develoment costs mean they need somewhere to put their games. Whether they put them there well or shortchange the machine as they did with the GameCube is what remains to be seen. However, with the likelihood of third party parity increasing, then we have a playing field where the only competition is in exclusives, one in which (see point 2) Nintendo can utterly dominate if it so chooses.

A) I am clear that this seems probable they will come in 2013 and only furthers my point. The Wii U will be competing more closely with the 360 and PS3 than the PS4 nextbox because I see the Wii U being more like those consoles graphically. Once the PS4 and nextbox are out I presume they will be far superior in power to the Wii U as history has left me with no reason to think otherwise. At that point, I think the graphics whores and sony and MS fans will be ready to move on. The Wii U will be stuck competing with 4 consoles, PS3, 360, PS4, 720 and will not be that different to come anywhere close to dominating like they did early on this gen.

B) This is not the same rules. Times change. People are looking for devices that do many things. The Wii does the least of all the consoles during the current time period and was doing well before the big hitters you mention like 3D Mario and 2D Mario, not to mention Mario Kart came out. The Wii's initial seller was it's motion controls which were fairly unique and as I said easier to pick up. The early sales of the wii were driven by this freshness and uniqueness and not a strong 1st party lineup othee than wii sports. What I am saying is many things sold the wii, but early on it was not it's exclusives alone it was the controls. How can exclusives sell a product more than a minor amount if they have not come out or been announced?

C)Third parties will only need the Wii U if it sells very  well and quickly. If this does not happen it will probably be abandoned. This once again will be made worse after the PS4 and nextbox arrive and many graphics whore eager developers are ready to spend more of their capital on the MS, Sony combo.

Nintendo can only win by being fres. And the tablet is nothing new and not fresh. Just look at what the Vita PS3 can do. The wii U is a redundancy in the industry until the Nextbox and PS4 arrive.

Why does a 1-year-gap further your point? There was a one-year gap between 360 and PS3, or between PS2 and Xbox/GameCube. If anything history suggests a 1-year gap is a good thing so long as you are able to support your platform (remember folks, Dreamcast was an anomaly. It was still doing well for itself when Sega pulled the plug because Sega was messed up as a company as a whole. Dreamcast would have outsold the GameCube and the Xbox if Sega had kept it going at least until 2004, because hell, with 2 years on the market, Dreamcast sold 50% of what the GC did in 5, and GC was only 2 million behind Xbox at the end of the day)

The Wii's initial seller was Wii Sports. Enabled by motion controls, sure, but we need to keep this fact foremost. Features NEVER significantly sell consoles. Games do. If the features enable console-sellers, good for them, but the games are at the root of all things.

The third party thing i'll grant can go either way, but only if we acknowledge the massive irrational conspiracy that exists against Nintendo platforms. If the publishers got their heads out of their asses, however, they know that porting costs are negligible (in terms of making a profit simply on the port, and adding revenue for the costs of the game as a whole), that the Wii U is deliberately easy to port to, and that (in all likelihood) Durango/Orbis are not going to be so insanely far ahead as to bring Wii U out of their league. If Durango/Orbis are that far ahead, even then third parties may still look to as many platforms as possible, because those games will be hella expensive to make.

And are we really suggesting that Vita/PS3 combo will have any impact on the Wii U? I don't even know how to begin deconstructing how wrong that is. It requires a 3,000-word answer or none.

^ and the online plans.

The Wii-U/controller will act co-dependent while the PS3/Vita will act independent. So it will effect games. Philosophically, I dont see PS3/Vita impacting the WII-U.



o_O.Q on 19 April 2012

being worried at this point is pointless as we don't have a clear picture of what the wii u will be like



NJ5 on 19 April 2012

I've been absent for a while but I was worried about the Wii U since I learned that it only supports one of its own controllers. Nintendo is in the console business and consoles are supposed to support multiple controllers. And no, supporting multiple Wiimotes does not count...

Has any information come out to contradict this?



My Mario Kart Wii friend code: 2707-1866-0957