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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - Third Party Devs have made up their minds about the Wii.

Demotruk on 16 January 2010
Johann said:
Demotruk said:
I made a mistake in my previous post.

It's the top 119 games out of ~1450 on Wii that sell 130Mill out of all ~190 mill third party sales,
and the top 152 games out of ~800 on 360 that sell 217Mill out of all ~277 mill third party sales.

So around 8% of the Wii 3rd party games count for 68% of the sales.

And around 19% of 360 3rd party games count for 78% of the sales.

 

Hmmmm...  actually they're both top heavy aren't they?

They are, but 360 gets both a much higher proportion of games (19% compared to 8%) and a significantly higher number in absolute terms (152 compared to 119) that are able to make 500K, despite Wii being the market leader, and it being clear it would be early on.



A game I'm developing with some friends:

www.xnagg.com/zombieasteroids/publish.htm

It is largely a technical exercise but feedback is appreciated.

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jammy2211 on 16 January 2010
LordTheNightKnight said:
BTW, this could explain something.

http://kotaku.com/5449175/dylan-cuthbert-game-funding-model-is-fundamentally-broken (and a comment shows that EA's boss made a lot more than Fahey thought).

The thing is that following that model, stock options and revenue matter over profit. The HD systems and games make those more than the Wii games, despite the rising costs. But by the actions of those CEOs those rising costs don't matter to them. They will still be rich when those companies go under, same as the heads of Midway got away with millions as the company sunk.

I think that's pretty much it.



NJ5 on 16 January 2010
MaxwellGT2000 said:
Procrastinato said:
Khuutra said:
Procrastinato said:
The "because of HD graphics" is pretty vague statement. Gears 2 cost $10M to develop. Lots of people claim it has some of the X360's best graphics.

Almost every Wii game in existance probably derived from a pre-existing GameCube engine, since the architectures are next to identical, outside of clock -- so how did Gears 2 get so cheap?

I'm not calling your honesty into question here, but could you source that? I'm really curious, now.

It's pretty easy to find.  Here's the first thing I came up with in Google:

link 

My point was to illustrate that 3rd parties were comparing re-used engines (GameCube engines, which are basically Wii engines) to brand new PS3/360 engines, when those "1/4th to 1/3rd" quotes were made.  That's no longer the case.

That wasn't that long ago, around the time you made your new account after Groucho was banned for you trying to refute that claim from EAs own mouth.

During the summer they also made the claims that most HD games take 1.1 million copies sold on average to break even, again not that long ago, funny how the quote you use is from Epic games, which as others posted that was the cost taking out the cost of the engine, which is also one of the most used engines on HD consoles with royalties paid to Epic games for its use. 

And not to call your realiability into question but you claim "that's no longer the case" but I really can't just take your word for it after some of your previous claims you've yet to back up with evidence and facts... so in short, instead of just claiming something and finding random google links, can you show me something that proves "that's no longer the case" its only been a year since EA made that claim, and about 6 months since the 1.1 million claim, and they're one of the biggest in the business with a lot more clout so than some random forum guy.  Especially after 2009 saw so many developers making HD games go under, which also happened in 2008.

 

I agree with everything you wrote, I'll just add that I never understood Groucho's/Procrastinato's focus on the engine part when discussing costs. Engine LICENSING costs may play a significant part, but those would exist both for old and new engines, and no way they would triple the costs of distributing/developing a game.

But more importantly, tons of developers mention the graphics as the real reason for the cost. The current standard of PS3 and 360 games requires a lot of attention to detail from artists, and this costs time and money.

 



My Mario Kart Wii friend code: 2707-1866-0957

Siko1989 on 16 January 2010

developers complain when there games don't sell well and they try to make nintendo fans feel guilty and they act like we are the bad guys for not buying it.. and plus half of the good games gets negative reviews from critics because they hate the motion controls (and yes they even admit it) and the good game negative reviews turns alot of people away...




NoCtiS_NoX on 16 January 2010
psrock said:
NJ5 said:
routsounmanman said:
psrock said:
It's just stupid to ignore the fastest selling console ever. It's the choice of the people, the mainstream. Company SHOULD DO ANYTHING to get a piece of all that money Nintendo is making. They wont leave it alone, 67 million userbase is a goldmine.

Precisely. Even if the cores aren't there, you MAKE them migrate! You just cannot ignore such an istalled base! Instead, most companies insult their own target audience, they put out "tests" or crappy games, then accuse the platform of being incapable / inhospitable >_>

But they are there...

For example, why didn't capcom make RE5 for the Wii? Certainly not because the demographics aren't there, as evidence by RE4:Wii's sales. If anything it was about graphics and the developer's wishes.

This is why I don't think it's about sales or demographics, for most publishers at least.

 

And they also get some support ($) from MS and Sony which Nintendo won't ever do. Nintendo is not the nicest company to deal with either.

I think Nintendo already did it. Remeber RE4 and all other RE games going exclusively to to the GC because I am sure that those will sell more on the PS2 but why it was release exlusively on GC instead of multi with PS2?

PS(Well, I am not so sure though so sorry if am wrong.)



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jarrod on 16 January 2010
MRFENIX said:
Wii gets a lot of support from third parties. If I remember correctly Wii has the most released third party games. That IS support. Is it the support YOU would like? Maybe not.

I am not going to McDonald's demanding for a kebab and get pissed if they don't sell me a kebab. That is not what the majority of people who go to McDonald's want. Instead I will go to a kebab place and get what I want.

McDonald's doesn't offer 3rd party food.

Wii owners seem to have no issue buying AAA core and bridge Nintendo games in significant numbers (Super Mario, Zelda, Metroid, Mario Kart, Smash Bros, etc), in fact it could argued that a large portion of the base bought the system specifically for these sorts of games and the upper tier stuff even hits in the same general ballpark as the top selling 360 games.  So why are 3rd parties lopsidedly throwing C-tier casual shovelware at it?  Where are the AAA 3rd party core and bridge games?



Beuli2 on 16 January 2010

"MRFENIX said:
Wii gets a lot of support from third parties. If I remember correctly Wii has the most released third party games. That IS support. Is it the support YOU would like? Maybe not.

I am not going to McDonald's demanding for a kebab and get pissed if they don't sell me a kebab. That is not what the majority of people who go to McDonald's want. Instead I will go to a kebab place and get what I want."

A big amount of crap selling something isn't better than some games selling good.



Above: still the best game of the year.

11ht11 on 16 January 2010

wii has gotten 3rd party games, but they get ignored



Demotruk on 16 January 2010
11ht11 said:
wii has gotten 3rd party games, but they get ignored

They get ignored because they suck.

I "supported" third party games, but I got burned by them often. The Conduit, Little King's Story, among others. I'm not going to keep doing it just so that third parties can feel a little safer on Wii. I apply to them the same standard I apply to Nintendo these days.



A game I'm developing with some friends:

www.xnagg.com/zombieasteroids/publish.htm

It is largely a technical exercise but feedback is appreciated.

Ail on 16 January 2010

With so many people on this site knowing so much more than existing game companies executives, why don't you guys band together and start your own company ?

Oh wait, it's because you are random anonymous people talking out of your ass on an internet forum with no real experience at all working in the software industry, even less the gaming industry...



PS3-Xbox360 gap : 1.5 millions and going up in PS3 favor !

PS3-Wii gap : 20 millions and going down !