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Forums - Sales Discussion - Capcom: Zack and Wiki sold only 126,000 units

honestly, nothing could have "saved" zack and wiki, its a great puzzle game. many a great puzzle game have bombed, on all the platforms. another one that just comes to mind is henry hatsworth.

to be honest, 120k for a game like this, in the u.s.... isn't bad at all given what it is.

many of these "quality" wii games that have bombed, understandably "bombed". you have to question some of these companies business sense. i don't know how capcom could have expected huge things from a kiddie styled puzzle game that really offers no appeal to kids outside of a pirate and a monkey on the cover.

given the system it was on, the best they could have done was maybe marketing the game like other puzzle/object games on the wii/ds which have been somewhat successfull; sell it to adults. the game had the story/presentation and challenge level to do it.

instead capcom wasted money on stickers, 3d puzzle inserts and ad's featuring kids waggling wii motes around and screaming.



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tjallern said:

Oh, sorry. I thought I said I was talking about GOOD games which also were received well by the critics, not titles like Carnival Games, LEGO-games, Game Party, Sonic and the secret rings, My fitness Coach, High School musical: Sing it, MySims, Cooking Mama, We Ski, etc etc. If you take a look at the list you provided, how many decent games are there? Should developers be forced to make these kinds of games just so they can sell games on the Wii??? The thing is Zack and Wiki was received well by critics and is a good game, still it gets massively outsold by High School Musical and shit like that. IMO there are maybe 5 3rd party games of the 50 first games that I would ever play, but NEVER buy. But if you feel that Carnival games and High School Musical are the games wii developers should make, then it's fine by me. the thing is, aside from Nintendo games, the 3rd party games on that list is mostly shitty games for kids and housewifes. And of course you have COD, Guitar hero, etc, but these games are not for Wii only and they sell (even more) on ANY OTHER platform as well. Games for GAMERS gets lost on the wii... If I was a developer, I would never lower myself to develop titles like MySims or Carnival games if I wanted to make something like Madworld or No More Heroes just so my games would sell...

 

I'm talking about GOOD, SERIOUS games for gamers here! Really, to think I was to be provided with a list of shovelware... Sorry, but I can't agree with 3rd party success on the Wii when these are the games that sell...

Well, aren't you just about the cutest troll I've ever seen! You even have an adorable little club to go along with your absolutely wrong opinion!

 

Awwwww!



The BuShA owns all!

Kenryoku_Maxis said:
tjallern said:
Kenryoku_Maxis said:
tjallern said:
3rd party needs too abandon the Wii. Sad but true... We see this soooo many times. Just abandon the Wii and let Nintendo take care of themselves. How many successful (and good) 3rd party games are there on the Wii? MH3? Help me out here !

http://vgchartz.com/games/index.php?&results=50&name=&console=Wii&keyword=&publisher=&genre=&order=Sales&boxart=Both&showdeleted=&region=All&alphasort=

Try looking it up yourself.  As it has been stated by Iwata himself, something like 34 of the top 50 best selling titles on the Wii, all million sellers, are from third party publishers.  And Monster Hunter 3 isn't even near there yet.

Oh, sorry. I thought I said I was talking about GOOD games which also were received well by the critics, not titles like Carnival Games, LEGO-games, Game Party, Sonic and the secret rings, My fitness Coach, High School musical: Sing it, MySims, Cooking Mama, We Ski, etc etc. If you take a look at the list you provided, how many decent games are there? Should developers be forced to make these kinds of games just so they can sell games on the Wii??? The thing is Zack and Wiki was received well by critics and is a good game, still it gets massively outsold by High School Musical and shit like that. IMO there are maybe 5 3rd party games of the 50 first games that I would ever play, but NEVER buy. But if you feel that Carnival games and High School Musical are the games wii developers should make, then it's fine by me. the thing is, aside from Nintendo games, the 3rd party games on that list is mostly shitty games for kids and housewifes. And of course you have COD, Guitar hero, etc, but these games are not for Wii only and they sell (even more) on ANY OTHER platform as well. Games for GAMERS gets lost on the wii... If I was a developer, I would never lower myself to develop titles like MySims or Carnival games if I wanted to make something like Madworld or No More Heroes just so my games would sell...

 

I'm talking about GOOD, SERIOUS games for gamers here! Really, to think I was to be provided with a list of shovelware... Sorry, but I can't agree with 3rd party success on the Wii when these are the games that sell...

As it has been stated many times before, games that have been 'recieved well by crtitics' are not always the pinnacle of greatness.  And one persons perception of 'serious games for gamers' may be different than others.  Its obvious that Wii is getting a ton of shovelware, but not every game on the Wii from third parties is bad, as you are making it out to be.

I know, and I don't give a rats ass about critics. The thing is, they can give some impression about a game's quality. There are a lot of critically well received games that I hate, for instance MW2. However, 3rd party games have problems selling on the Wii if they're not games like Carnival Games etc, and even then 3.74 million for Carnival Games (highest selling EXCLUSIVE Wii game, not counting GH as they sell on ANY system and MARIO and Sonic at the Olympic Games) out of a userbase of 65 million is nothing to brag about. Where are games like MURAMASA (I see you like it and it sold 0.18 million), Little King's Story, No More Heroes, Drawn to life (good or bad), Madworld, Okami (sold crap on PS2 aswell), Bully, Fire Emblem, A boy and his Blob, Fatal Frame IV, The Conduit (good or bad), Silent Hill: SM, Tales of Symphonia/Graces, Dead Rising (don't know about this one), de Blob (sold 0.77 million / 65 million though), Boom Blox (1m/65m), Manhunt 2 (not saying it is good or bad), Fragile (Japan only, but 0.06 million?)... (some of) These are games I could easily see do very well on the other platforms, maybe not 1m sellers, but definitely more than what they have sold on the Wii (except de Blob, drawn to life of course). I'm NOT saying ALL 3rd party titles on the Wii that sell are BAD, but it seems that developers (that are not able to include Nintendo characters into their games) are forced into a certain development pattern to be able to sell their games on the Wii. I really understand why certain developers don't want this and as a result stops their support. This is not the case with the PS360 where a LOT of different games/genres (even though mostly FPS and 3PS) are able to sell based on their quality alone, be it disc based or through XBLA/PSN.



Vertigo-X said:
tjallern said:
 

Oh, sorry. I thought I said I was talking about GOOD games which also were received well by the critics, not titles like Carnival Games, LEGO-games, Game Party, Sonic and the secret rings, My fitness Coach, High School musical: Sing it, MySims, Cooking Mama, We Ski, etc etc. If you take a look at the list you provided, how many decent games are there? Should developers be forced to make these kinds of games just so they can sell games on the Wii??? The thing is Zack and Wiki was received well by critics and is a good game, still it gets massively outsold by High School Musical and shit like that. IMO there are maybe 5 3rd party games of the 50 first games that I would ever play, but NEVER buy. But if you feel that Carnival games and High School Musical are the games wii developers should make, then it's fine by me. the thing is, aside from Nintendo games, the 3rd party games on that list is mostly shitty games for kids and housewifes. And of course you have COD, Guitar hero, etc, but these games are not for Wii only and they sell (even more) on ANY OTHER platform as well. Games for GAMERS gets lost on the wii... If I was a developer, I would never lower myself to develop titles like MySims or Carnival games if I wanted to make something like Madworld or No More Heroes just so my games would sell...

 

I'm talking about GOOD, SERIOUS games for gamers here! Really, to think I was to be provided with a list of shovelware... Sorry, but I can't agree with 3rd party success on the Wii when these are the games that sell...

Well, aren't you just about the cutest troll I've ever seen! You even have an adorable little club to go along with your absolutely wrong opinion!

 

Awwwww!

ok if i'm so wrong and just a troll, then prove i'm so wrong and just a troll! if not, the only troll with wrong opinion here is you. where are all the good selling 3rd party game son the Wii out of their 65 million userbase? Seriously, excluding MARIO & Sonic at the Olympics, Guitar Hero III: Legends of Rock is at 4.37 million... And out of a 65 million userbase I don't find that IMPRESSIVE AT ALL. And to your information it sold 4.35 million on the X360 with almost HALF the userbase.. LOL



tjallern said:
Kenryoku_Maxis said:

As it has been stated many times before, games that have been 'recieved well by crtitics' are not always the pinnacle of greatness.  And one persons perception of 'serious games for gamers' may be different than others.  Its obvious that Wii is getting a ton of shovelware, but not every game on the Wii from third parties is bad, as you are making it out to be.

I know, and I don't give a rats ass about critics. The thing is, they can give some impression about a game's quality. There are a lot of critically well received games that I hate, for instance MW2. However, 3rd party games have problems selling on the Wii if they're not games like Carnival Games etc, and even then 3.74 million for Carnival Games (highest selling EXCLUSIVE Wii game, not counting GH as they sell on ANY system and MARIO and Sonic at the Olympic Games) out of a userbase of 65 million is nothing to brag about. Where are games like MURAMASA (I see you like it and it sold 0.18 million), Little King's Story, No More Heroes, Drawn to life (good or bad), Madworld, Okami (sold crap on PS2 aswell), Bully, Fire Emblem, A boy and his Blob, Fatal Frame IV, The Conduit (good or bad), Silent Hill: SM, Tales of Symphonia/Graces, Dead Rising (don't know about this one), de Blob (sold 0.77 million / 65 million though), Boom Blox (1m/65m), Manhunt 2 (not saying it is good or bad), Fragile (Japan only, but 0.06 million?)... (some of) These are games I could easily see do very well on the other platforms, maybe not 1m sellers, but definitely more than what they have sold on the Wii (except de Blob, drawn to life of course). I'm NOT saying ALL 3rd party titles on the Wii that sell are BAD, but it seems that developers (that are not able to include Nintendo characters into their games) are forced into a certain development pattern to be able to sell their games on the Wii. I really understand why certain developers don't want this and as a result stops their support. This is not the case with the PS360 where a LOT of different games/genres (even though mostly FPS and 3PS) are able to sell based on their quality alone, be it disc based or through XBLA/PSN.

I already stated, multiple times, why most third party games on the Wii don't sell well.  A complete lack of advertising and support.  Yay, many of those games you mentioned were something besides a quick casual title.  But what did their production company do to help them sell?  They just released about 10,000-50,000 copies of each title to limited venues with no marketing support and said 'okay, we expect it to sell like hotcakes!'

Are you kidding me?  Even Kameo on the 360 and Naruto: Storm on the PS3 got advertising.  Why are all these games that third parties are 'taking a risk' on the Wii having absolutely no advertising?  The FIRST rule of making a game sell is to advertise it.  Its common business sense.  No one will buy a game if they don't know its outthere.  Its like they're trying to just make up excuses for themselves to say 'see, SEE, I told you the Wii was a stupid risk!  No one can make money on the Wii but Nintendo!'  Simply by doing every possible wrong move on the Wii they can think of.



Six upcoming games you should look into:

 

  

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Sales for the Other Point and Click games have been millionaire?



@tjallern So you're another one of those that keep moving the goal post, good for you. But, to use your language, though of course they would have wanted their games to sell by the ton (just like I would like to win the lottery), companies don't give a rat's ass about your standards for what is "impressive". All companies care about is profits (NOT revenues - but profits). And so, just for illustrations sake, if Guitar Hero 3 sold about as much on the 360 but cost twice as much to make/market, guess which situation the company would prefer to be in? NMH sales were not IMPRESSIVE, but this became SUDA51's best selling game on any platform.



Currently Playing: Shin Megami Tensei: Devil Survivor Overclocked, Professor Layton and the Curious Village

Anticipating: Xenoblade, The Last Story, Mario Kart 7, Rayman Origins, Zelda SS, Crush3D, Tales of the Abyss 3DS, MGS:Snake Eater 3DS, RE:Revelations, Time Travellers, Professor Layton vs. Ace Attorney, Luigi's Mansion 2, MH TriG, DQ Monsters, Heroes of Ruin

Kenryoku_Maxis said:
tjallern said:
Kenryoku_Maxis said:

As it has been stated many times before, games that have been 'recieved well by crtitics' are not always the pinnacle of greatness.  And one persons perception of 'serious games for gamers' may be different than others.  Its obvious that Wii is getting a ton of shovelware, but not every game on the Wii from third parties is bad, as you are making it out to be.

I know, and I don't give a rats ass about critics. The thing is, they can give some impression about a game's quality. There are a lot of critically well received games that I hate, for instance MW2. However, 3rd party games have problems selling on the Wii if they're not games like Carnival Games etc, and even then 3.74 million for Carnival Games (highest selling EXCLUSIVE Wii game, not counting GH as they sell on ANY system and MARIO and Sonic at the Olympic Games) out of a userbase of 65 million is nothing to brag about. Where are games like MURAMASA (I see you like it and it sold 0.18 million), Little King's Story, No More Heroes, Drawn to life (good or bad), Madworld, Okami (sold crap on PS2 aswell), Bully, Fire Emblem, A boy and his Blob, Fatal Frame IV, The Conduit (good or bad), Silent Hill: SM, Tales of Symphonia/Graces, Dead Rising (don't know about this one), de Blob (sold 0.77 million / 65 million though), Boom Blox (1m/65m), Manhunt 2 (not saying it is good or bad), Fragile (Japan only, but 0.06 million?)... (some of) These are games I could easily see do very well on the other platforms, maybe not 1m sellers, but definitely more than what they have sold on the Wii (except de Blob, drawn to life of course). I'm NOT saying ALL 3rd party titles on the Wii that sell are BAD, but it seems that developers (that are not able to include Nintendo characters into their games) are forced into a certain development pattern to be able to sell their games on the Wii. I really understand why certain developers don't want this and as a result stops their support. This is not the case with the PS360 where a LOT of different games/genres (even though mostly FPS and 3PS) are able to sell based on their quality alone, be it disc based or through XBLA/PSN.

I already stated, multiple times, why most third party games on the Wii don't sell well.  A complete lack of advertising and support.  Yay, many of those games you mentioned were something besides a quick casual title.  But what did their production company do to help them sell?  They just released about 10,000-50,000 copies of each title to limited venues with no marketing support and said 'okay, we expect it to sell like hotcakes!'

Are you kidding me?  Even Kameo on the 360 and Naruto: Storm on the PS3 got advertising.  Why are all these games that third parties are 'taking a risk' on the Wii having absolutely no advertising?  The FIRST rule of making a game sell is to advertise it.  Its common business sense.  No one will buy a game if they don't know its outthere.  Its like they're trying to just make up excuses for themselves to say 'see, SEE, I told you the Wii was a stupid risk!  No one can make money on the Wii but Nintendo!'  Simply by doing every possible wrong move on the Wii they can think of.

^This. Wii naysayers keep discounting arguments like marketing, but if anything, advertising for games on the Wii is probably more important than for PS360 since a huge part of the Wii market does not frequent review sites.

Some people look at COD WaW sales (1.4 million, maybe not IMPRESSIVE by some people's standards but gave the company very very nice profits) and take them for granted, but at the time, no one (except some people who go to gaming sites) knew there was a Wii version, and so sales initially were so so - until the game started getting, guess what people, actual advertising...



Currently Playing: Shin Megami Tensei: Devil Survivor Overclocked, Professor Layton and the Curious Village

Anticipating: Xenoblade, The Last Story, Mario Kart 7, Rayman Origins, Zelda SS, Crush3D, Tales of the Abyss 3DS, MGS:Snake Eater 3DS, RE:Revelations, Time Travellers, Professor Layton vs. Ace Attorney, Luigi's Mansion 2, MH TriG, DQ Monsters, Heroes of Ruin

http://news.vgchartz.com/news.php?id=6490

The Source made my argument for me. And put it nice pretty colors and charts too.



The rEVOLution is not being televised

damn, capcom and sega are really taking jabs at wii lately