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Forums - Nintendo - The Malstrom thread

Demotruk said:
sethhearthstone said:

To get back to Malstrom for a moment, why is he still saying Other M is about "Maternal Instincts"?  It's pretty clear now that Other M is most certainly not about maternal instincts, which would consist of protecting something and defending it with your life, caring for it, and exhibiting maturity and determination to be a good role model for what you are protecting.  Instead the game appears to be about being a scared little girl who is completely incapable of growth.  That is immaturity, and not the maturity the marketing materials suggested the game would be about.

Maternal instincts would have been an interesting topic for a Metroid game, but they clearly did not accomplish this goal.  Had they done what they said they would do, they would have written a much more interesting story for their otherwise mediocre game.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WBpxH4G6vLI&p=6938E1360A388166&playnext=1&index=69


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f8uyoeo3rnc

 

What was Malstrom thinking...?


And the writing and voice acting is flatter than steamrolled playing cards. It's like all the wooden acting of Attack of the Clones, Heavy Rain, and the dub of Banner of the Stars. I don't know which is worse.

Now I agree that She-Ra is more entertaining to watch. It's stupid, but of the "So bad, it's good" variety.



A flashy-first game is awesome when it comes out. A great-first game is awesome forever.

Plus, just for the hell of it: Kelly Brook at the 2008 BAFTAs

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wfz said:
LordTheNightKnight said:
sethhearthstone said:

To get back to Malstrom for a moment, why is he still saying Other M is about "Maternal Instincts"?  It's pretty clear now that Other M is most certainly not about maternal instincts, which would consist of protecting something and defending it with your life, caring for it, and exhibiting maturity and determination to be a good role model for what you are protecting.  Instead the game appears to be about being a scared little girl who is completely incapable of growth.  That is immaturity, and not the maturity the marketing materials suggested the game would be about.

Maternal instincts would have been an interesting topic for a Metroid game, but they clearly did not accomplish this goal.  Had they done what they said they would do, they would have written a much more interesting story for their otherwise mediocre game.


Well he has no interest in playing the game, so he just needs to be corrected on that.

How can he properly assess the game, point his finger at it and call it names, without ever playing it? That just doesn't make sense to me.

 

And I didn't find Samus to be wimpy or immature at all. I actually thought she was really strong and mature. She faced a few troubling issues but subsequently put them aside and kicked some major ass. That shows strength and maturity right there.


People judge whether to buy it based on what they can see of it. If what they see of it doesn't look good, they won't buy it.

Plus the game does follow the pattern of games he's seen doesn't sell, such as when the developers get pretentious. Then even if the games open big, that's due to marketing hiding the pretentiousness, but word of mouth doesn't come up and give it legs (Heavy Rain, for one).



A flashy-first game is awesome when it comes out. A great-first game is awesome forever.

Plus, just for the hell of it: Kelly Brook at the 2008 BAFTAs

wfz, if you've actually played the game, can you explain the Ridley cutscene in context?  All it looks like is Samus chickening out for no reason, and barely getting saved by someone else.  It looks like a really obtuse way to create an emotional low point, if that is its goal.

Demotruk, it appears the word "baby" is said 9 times in the whole game.  Thank you for that, but what does the word referr to in the game's story?  Such tight editing does a very poor job providing context.



sethhearthstone said:

wfz, if you've actually played the game, can you explain the Ridley cutscene in context?  All it looks like is Samus chickening out for no reason, and barely getting saved by someone else.  It looks like a really obtuse way to create an emotional low point, if that is its goal.

Demotruk, it appears the word "baby" is said 9 times in the whole game.  Thank you for that, but what does the word referr to in the game's story?  Such tight editing does a very poor job providing context.


Why did you respond to the second video but not the first, which is a full unedited cutscene where they spend most of the time talking about maternal relationships?



A game I'm developing with some friends:

www.xnagg.com/zombieasteroids/publish.htm

It is largely a technical exercise but feedback is appreciated.

sethhearthstone said:

wfz, if you've actually played the game, can you explain the Ridley cutscene in context?  All it looks like is Samus chickening out for no reason, and barely getting saved by someone else.  It looks like a really obtuse way to create an emotional low point, if that is its goal.(1)

Demotruk, it appears the word "baby" is said 9 times in the whole game.  Thank you for that, but what does the word referr to in the game's story?  Such tight editing does a very poor job providing context.(2)

1. I maintain that as well. Most people won't have that context. It's like not explaining what the hell the Sith are in the Star Wars prequels. The context might make it clear they are the evil Jedi, but there is no explanation in the movies. It's all in the expanded universe materials.

2. To me, it's 9 times too many. Plus even calling it "the baby" is just awkward. Call it the "metroidling" if you have to.

Also, I heard the full theater mode is online, so you can look it up if you want.



A flashy-first game is awesome when it comes out. A great-first game is awesome forever.

Plus, just for the hell of it: Kelly Brook at the 2008 BAFTAs

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Demotruk said:
sethhearthstone said:

wfz, if you've actually played the game, can you explain the Ridley cutscene in context?  All it looks like is Samus chickening out for no reason, and barely getting saved by someone else.  It looks like a really obtuse way to create an emotional low point, if that is its goal.

Demotruk, it appears the word "baby" is said 9 times in the whole game.  Thank you for that, but what does the word referr to in the game's story?  Such tight editing does a very poor job providing context.


Why did you respond to the second video but not the first, which is a full unedited cutscene where they spend most of the time talking about maternal relationships?


I think Seth was actually asking the context of the other times she said it.



A flashy-first game is awesome when it comes out. A great-first game is awesome forever.

Plus, just for the hell of it: Kelly Brook at the 2008 BAFTAs

Oh right. It's explained that Samus and the "baby" are supposed to have had a mother and child like relationship which the federation tries to emulate with Mother Brain. It's in the first cutscene I posted.

 

Whether or not the overall game really has a "maternal" theme, Sakamoto was still clearly trying to explore Samus' "maternal" instincts and that's still as dumb an idea as it sounded in the first place.



A game I'm developing with some friends:

www.xnagg.com/zombieasteroids/publish.htm

It is largely a technical exercise but feedback is appreciated.

Demotruk said:

Oh right. It's explained that Samus and the "baby" are supposed to have had a mother and child like relationship which the federation tries to emulate with Mother Brain. It's in the first cutscene I posted.

 

Whether or not the overall game really has a "maternal" theme, Sakamoto was still clearly trying to explore Samus' "maternal" instincts and that's still as dumb an idea as it sounded in the first place.


And there was a better way to do it. Since half the game is one, big Alien homage, have another baby metroid that Samus has sort of a Ripley and Newt relationsip with. Unoriginal, but it would work.



A flashy-first game is awesome when it comes out. A great-first game is awesome forever.

Plus, just for the hell of it: Kelly Brook at the 2008 BAFTAs

Wow this thread is moving fast.

Lord, I understand that people judge whether or not they want to buy a game based on what they already see of it, but I also know those people do not have enough knowledge to start smack-talking and labeling the game without playing it. Don't we get on people's cases here for bashing on a game they haven't played? Why should Malstrom be allowed to? I'm still just not seeing how he can make such accusations without having true knowledge of the game. I can understand him not wanting to buy it, but he can't start speaking for the game without experiencing it. I take it you feel differently about this, can you please explain in greater detail so I might understand?

 

Seth, the Ridley scene was put into the context of Samus having PTSD. For more info on what that all entails, check out this editorial: http://gamrfeed.vgchartz.com/story/81909/ptsd-or-weakness-real-experts-on-why-samus-didnt-shoot/

 

Now, in this game, I understand her reaction was very unexplained, much like the Sith are in Star Wars (as Lord pointed out). The only way you can really understand this is if you care enough of the whole metroid story to have read the manga. Samus has displayed PTSD before, and it's coming up in this game. It was questionably implemented since the developers didn't bother explaining Samus' backstory more, but that's a different issue.

 

On the other hand, when she saw Anthony sacrafice himself for her, she snapped back to her senses and regained and perhaps even found more courage, to stand up against her fears. She subsequently beat the hell out of Ridley and continued on her quest in well shape. The fact that she managed to overcome her fear in the do-or-die situation showed a lot of courage and strength, imo. It takes a LOT to be able to push back the emotions rasied by PTSD, and she managed to do it very well.

 

Was there anything else you had questions about?



wfz said:

Wow this thread is moving fast.

Lord, I understand that people judge whether or not they want to buy a game based on what they already see of it, but I also know those people do not have enough knowledge to start smack-talking and labeling the game without playing it. Don't we get on people's cases here for bashing on a game they haven't played? Why should Malstrom be allowed to? I'm still just not seeing how he can make such accusations without having true knowledge of the game. I can understand him not wanting to buy it, but he can't start speaking for the game without experiencing it. I take it you feel differently about this, can you please explain in greater detail so I might understand?

 

Seth, the Ridley scene was put into the context of Samus having PTSD. For more info on what that all entails, check out this editorial: http://gamrfeed.vgchartz.com/story/81909/ptsd-or-weakness-real-experts-on-why-samus-didnt-shoot/

 

Now, in this game, I understand her reaction was very unexplained, much like the Sith are in Star Wars (as Lord pointed out). The only way you can really understand this is if you care enough of the whole metroid story to have read the manga. Samus has displayed PTSD before, and it's coming up in this game. It was questionably implemented since the developers didn't bother explaining Samus' backstory more, but that's a different issue.

 

On the other hand, when she saw Anthony sacrafice himself for her, she snapped back to her senses and regained and perhaps even found more courage, to stand up against her fears. She subsequently beat the hell out of Ridley and continued on her quest in well shape. The fact that she managed to overcome her fear in the do-or-die situation showed a lot of courage and strength, imo. It takes a LOT to be able to push back the emotions rasied by PTSD, and she managed to do it very well.

 

Was there anything else you had questions about?


Even if he hadn't played the game, he was going off the patterns he had seen.

Basically, when the developer got these kinds of notions, odds are that the game wasn't going to work.

Then again, he even applies it to other media (like what he wrote about Star Trek, and how it kind of sucked that they had to rip off Star Wars just to revive the franchise*). You want to experiment, either do it in smaller amounts with the works you've hit it big with, or try making new works. Don't treat the big works as a laboratory or blank canvas art studio. Sure copyright and patent law allows you to do that, but it's rarely smart. Those laws just mean customers and rivals can't steal your ideas and art. It doesn't mean they have to buy whatever you give them. This is me trying to condense a lot of his points, but I believe I got the gist of them.

* Incidently, Red Letter Media (google it) says Star Trek 2009 makes a better Star Wars movie than the prequels.

EDIT: As for the Ridley scene, I still say it should have been a flashback or prequel scene. Then we could have seen that Samus was still vulnerable, but that finding the strength would have shown why she is now as strong as she is.



A flashy-first game is awesome when it comes out. A great-first game is awesome forever.

Plus, just for the hell of it: Kelly Brook at the 2008 BAFTAs