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Forums - Nintendo - Solution for 3rd party Wii quality titles

jarrod on 30 November 2009
Procrastinato said:
jarrod said:

Real solution: Release AAA games, not budget spinoffs and niche new IPs. It worked for Monster Hunter.

 

The "problem" with 3rd party Wii "efforts" is 100% content, 0% pricepoint.  If they did it on PS2, they should be doing it on Wii.

Games don't profit at $50/unit to a demographic (which is not the overall ownership) base smaller than what the PS360 have.  That's the problem.  The budget for those games has to be small to compensate.  Budget is the most reliable indicator of eventual game quality -- obviously there are many exceptions, but there are no other factors, other than developer rep (and reputable devs usually demand a high budget..), that are a good estimator of game quality for a publisher.

3rd parties have reaped what they sow.  The reason DSE didn't profit at $50/unit is because it was low budget, genre divergent, spinoff of a not-so-hot IP.  If a full budget Dead Space 2 had released on Wii, then that'd be a different story.... but we've NEVER had a full budget AAA game fail on Wii so far.

Low budgets (and frankly, low efforts) aren't a result of low sales, they're what's driving them.  AAA games already get AAA sales on Wii at $50, be it Mario or Monster Hunter.  And extra $10 added to DSE2 or MadWorld 2 isn't going to change anything.  You're looking at the "problem" backwards...

The key to success on Wii is to treat it like a PS2.  That's what the market did, the industry needs to catch up.



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Dr.Grass on 30 November 2009
Khuutra said:
Procrastinato said:
Dr.Grass said:
Ok I already posted, but I reread it all and I'm confused:

RAISING the price of 3rd party games will increase their quality!?

WTF!?

So... you think Wii games should be lowered to $20, and that will make them higher quality?

Procrastinato, this is not how reducto ad absurdum works.

I admit the emphasis in his second sentence was very peculiar, but you know that he was not suggesting that prices should be lowered.


In fact, I am of the opinion that changing the price of a game will not change its quality.

Is this theory of mine completely absurd, or will it bring about a revolution in how we view our entertainment?

:P



Dr.Grass on 30 November 2009

@Myself

NEITHER YOU DUMBASS! The price doesn't have anything to do with the quality. Dr.Grass is an idiot!



Khuutra on 30 November 2009
Procrastinato said:

Not taking the sum total picture in account is your argument's major flaw.  Not only is the per-unit price a problem, but the untargettable demographics are a serious, serious issue.  You can't deny that games like CoD:WaW, or The Conduit, are good games... yet they didn't hit anywhere near the HD numbers for those titles, or like titles.

They uh

They don't have to, is the thing.



Procrastinato on 30 November 2009
Dr.Grass said:
Khuutra said:
Procrastinato said:
Dr.Grass said:
Ok I already posted, but I reread it all and I'm confused:

RAISING the price of 3rd party games will increase their quality!?

WTF!?

So... you think Wii games should be lowered to $20, and that will make them higher quality?

Procrastinato, this is not how reducto ad absurdum works.

I admit the emphasis in his second sentence was very peculiar, but you know that he was not suggesting that prices should be lowered.


In fact, I am of the opinion that changing the price of a game will not change its quality.

Is this theory of mine completely absurd, or will it bring about a revolution in how we view our entertainment?

:P

Changing the price point will not address the demographics issue, is my point.

It will only affect the income of the game, to the demographic willing to purchase it.  In particular, I am addressing the "less casual" style of games that Reggie has recently referred to as games he wants to see on the Wii.  The demographics for those games would pay $60 for them, if they were good, and the Wii was their system of choice.



 

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Procrastinato on 30 November 2009
Khuutra said:
Procrastinato said:

Not taking the sum total picture in account is your argument's major flaw.  Not only is the per-unit price a problem, but the untargettable demographics are a serious, serious issue.  You can't deny that games like CoD:WaW, or The Conduit, are good games... yet they didn't hit anywhere near the HD numbers for those titles, or like titles.

They uh

They don't have to, is the thing.

Yeah, they do.

Otherwise they aren't worth the investment.  Publishing games is business.  You don't support low profit products if you want to make money, plain and simple.



 

Khuutra on 30 November 2009
Procrastinato said:
Khuutra said:
Procrastinato said:

Not taking the sum total picture in account is your argument's major flaw.  Not only is the per-unit price a problem, but the untargettable demographics are a serious, serious issue.  You can't deny that games like CoD:WaW, or The Conduit, are good games... yet they didn't hit anywhere near the HD numbers for those titles, or like titles.

They uh

They don't have to, is the thing.

Yeah, they do.

Otherwise they aren't worth the investment.  Publishing games is business.  You don't support low profit products if you want to make money, plain and simple.

And yet the Wii continues to get Call of Duty games?



Procrastinato on 30 November 2009
Khuutra said:
Procrastinato said:
Khuutra said:
Procrastinato said:

Not taking the sum total picture in account is your argument's major flaw.  Not only is the per-unit price a problem, but the untargettable demographics are a serious, serious issue.  You can't deny that games like CoD:WaW, or The Conduit, are good games... yet they didn't hit anywhere near the HD numbers for those titles, or like titles.

They uh

They don't have to, is the thing.

Yeah, they do.

Otherwise they aren't worth the investment.  Publishing games is business.  You don't support low profit products if you want to make money, plain and simple.

And yet the Wii continues to get Call of Duty games?

MW: Reflex is a two-year-long port.  In other words, a budget title.

Note how CoD:WaW came out with its HD contemporaries, and there is no MW: Reflex 2 (yet)... but there will be, in another year or so, if MW: Reflex sells a good 500K+.



 

Khuutra on 30 November 2009
Procrastinato said:
Khuutra said:

And yet the Wii continues to get Call of Duty games?

MW: Reflex is a two-year-long port.  In other words, a budget title.

Note how CoD:WaW came out with its HD contemporaries.

The explanation for that being that it was necessary to establish the Modern Warfare brand?

I don't think I get your point, here. Clearly Call of Duty games do not have to sell HD numbers on the Wii, because the Wii continues to get them.

And yes, World at War was released at the same time as its HD contemporaries, but its production values are about on level with (maybe less than) Reflex.



Procrastinato on 30 November 2009
Khuutra said:
Procrastinato said:
Khuutra said:

And yet the Wii continues to get Call of Duty games?

MW: Reflex is a two-year-long port.  In other words, a budget title.

Note how CoD:WaW came out with its HD contemporaries.

The explanation for that being that it was necessary to establish the Modern Warfare brand?

I don't think I get your point, here. Clearly Call of Duty games do not have to sell HD numbers on the Wii, because the Wii continues to get them.

And yes, World at War was released at the same time as its HD contemporaries, but its production values are about on level with (maybe less than) Reflex.

You are way way off with that bolded statement, if you are referring to dev cost.  Reflex was much cheaper to make than WaW on Wii.

I can see the CoD franchise continuing as ports on the Wii -- now that the engine exists (which was the major expense with WaW), that can continue ad infinitum.

The question is, are other dev teams willing to take that first hit, and port their engine/game to the Wii?  CoD has shown that, as one of the world's most popular franchises, its barely profitable -- moreso if you plan to churn out sequels using a very similar engine (aka CoD).