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Forums - General - So who's going to be the European president?

NKAJ said:
people who come to a country shoudnt expect to have laws changed to suit them,they come to a country so they follow that countrys rules

So racial, sexual and religious discrimation aren't a problem.   It's those of different races and religions who are a problem.

That's... pretty xenophobic there.

I don't think France would last too long if they got rid of everyone they discriminate against.  A population of only white men isn't sustainable... fertility just wouldn't work that well.



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Kasz216 said:
Lostplanet22 said:
Kasz216 said:
Lostplanet22 said:
Their is a solution to solve the problems of the minorities in Europe? The last years Europe has shifted to a more Centered right political climate simply because their are no solutions. Well their are but that will pick up hatred to the original born population and will make the situation to women worse.

What is your solution then?

1)How does giving equal economic oppurtunities to minorities = worse for women?

2)Or lack of religious discrimination worse for women?

3)In general, France's natural born citizen's opinion of women is shit.


1) In this case nothing. But their are not equal opportuniets? An immigrant has become president of France.  Or are you talking about those riots where a large group of (north) africans put cars in fire? You mean those (north)africans who think it is more important to be a cool gangsta then study and become something? Those (north)african who then finish school and can't find a job? And then simply blame it on not equal oppurtunities while their are others (north) africans who could made it and have a great carreer....That is typical Urban stuff for me if you ask.

2) To give you a simple example.

Moslim women betrays her husband,  husband beats her to dead (stuff that happens, I bet you can vids like that on shocking videos sites'
France police arrests him because it is obviously against the law, family of husband and 100's of friends demonstrate at a police station and end up making a fire in the P.station. Claiming that they don't respect their religion.

How can you have a sollution for that?  Do what the France law says and don't respect their religion.....or respect their religion but throw away the rights of the women in the water.

Religions have always been a problem, especially if countries have mixed religions;..It is the same in the 50's when christians said teaching children 'evolution' was the work of a satan and didn't let them go to school anymore.

 

3) Can you give an example?

1) Your blatant stereotyping proves my point here more or less.  How would you react to an American statement that the reason their is a race gap is that "Black people are lazy and thinks it's cool to be gangsta and don't study."

2) There are plenty of laws that are distinctly against Islam that aren't related to "beating your wife."  For example the headscarf law.  It's a law that's offense both to Islam and Women... as it's the french government telling women how they should dress.

3) Sure.  The above is a good example.

Look at French Sexual Harrasment laws.  They are ages behind the US, UK and other Western powers.  What is the definition of sexual harrasment in France?

"Sexual harassment is harassment by a person based on behaviour aimed at obtaining sexual favours for his or her benefit or for that of a third person."

In otherwords.  Only Quid Pro Quo sexual harrasment.  Stuff like hitting on a woman constantly or even trying to kiss someone in the workplace is not covered.

Studies have also shown that sexual harrsament is seen soley as an aspect of sexual desire.  Much like evolutionary biological opinions on rape... which are just comical.

So in otherwords... if your a woman and your being sexually discriminated against... you only get to keep your job if your boss says "Sleep with me or your fired."

There are virtually no cases of sexual harrasment filed in France despite the fact that they face just as much if not more discrimination in the workplace then places like the UK and US.

In fact, a number of people who lost sexual harrasment cases under the ridiculious france standards were given large fines and prison sentences.

In general there have been plenty of studies that show french attidues on women in the workplace are crap...

 


Other examples.

The World Orginzation Against Torture often talks about how women are mistreated in french detention centers.  Even more so then other people... france having a problem there as well.

Unemployment gaps between men an women places the EU 17th out of 25 in the EU in 2004.

A women was denied citizenshp specifically for wearing a burka... in 2008... and it was upheld by the government.

The wage gap between men and women is higher in france then the UK.

 

1)  Ah come on,  Just watch some Hollywood movies.  Their is a popular one with a teacher who is going to teach in a problem school (thought in New York). It starts with an introduction of the school.  Police officers at the entrance who control the students of weapons, then you see some scenes of the school,  one note that should made....80-90% of the students are Africans/mexicans etc  or let me rephrase that  'not white'.   Then the teacher goes to the class and met his students.. where is so far I can remember no white guy/girl in it?  Maybe one?

Criminals, drug problems, problem at home....Those are his students...And when the teacher asks why they don't try to be something they just answer 'Our people have it always harder to make it' we are only good to work in shops and fabrics as an worker;...

The end of the movie concludes that the teacher can help them to get their diplome.

Then lets take an movie about a University....Hmm lets take American Pie?  Possible the most popular university movie(s) of the last decennia? What do we see?  80-90% of those students are white.

Should I say now Hollywood is blatant stereotyping?

Hollywood movies are for foreigners (and probably USA citizens) more than just entertainment , they are also for them a reflection of how the society is in USA.  

Go to countries like Japan ask them what they think about Africans and you can get a lot of shocking comments that I and you would name racism.  Can we be shocked about it?  Probably not cause the only africans they see is on televion, american/european music vids and Hollywood movies.

And the first movie vision of a problem school is probably right.  And is how schools and his students (attitudes) are in high-minorty % schools in France.  But what I like about the first movie is how the teacher says 'You can become something if you try'.   And exactly my point. They have the chance in France many take it but many don't take it.  It is not only a France problem but are problems in many Western Countries in EU.

2) How come before 2005 it was fine to wear a scarf at a school?  Did you only saw Islam women complain about the law? Or did you also saw the Islam women who were happy with the law cause it gives finally the chance to be free? 

3)  Sadly that will not change,  to think about it I didn't have heard many moslims complain about that....In fact no French women aswell.  To be fair I never talked with a French women about the rights of women in her country.



 

Kasz216 said:
NKAJ said:
people who come to a country shoudnt expect to have laws changed to suit them,they come to a country so they follow that countrys rules

So racial, sexual and religious discrimation aren't a problem.   It's those of different races and religions who are a problem.

That's... pretty xenophobic there.

I don't think France would last too long if they got rid of everyone they discriminate against.  A population of only white men isn't sustainable... fertility just wouldn't work that well.

Even if those issues get solved their will be other problems.  If the scarf problem get solved, their are other issues.  Anyway Europe is already adapting to the Moslim community living in their countries. Moslim schools, hospitals with moslim doctors especially for the ones who don't want that their Wife gets treated by a woman/not moslim person etc.   Now we are getting a community in Europe that is cutting herself of the rest of the country wouldn't call it 'good integration'.



 

1) You ignore the whole point of those movies. Which are that underprivileged children are just as competent as any other children SO LONG AS PEOPLE GIVE A DAMN. The problem is that such children often get lesser teachers and people who don't give a shit unlike more privileged people. Inherent racism is what holds these people down. Inherent racism and ignorant stereotyping like yours.

It's not these children who have failed until the teacher arrived. It's about how society failed the children up to this point by ignoring them.

2) It's a sexist law... that's why most women's groups are against it. To ban it doesn't "Free" anybody. If a woman is being forced to wear a headscarf (which not even remotely all are... or even half) do you think that one law accomplishes... ANYTHING to make that woman's life better?

No. No it doesn't. All it does is make it so the french can do what they ALWAYS do on equality rights. Laws to ban the headscarf are even more sexist because instead of some women being dictated to what they can wear, instead all women are told what they can't wear. It's even more discrimination then the previous law.

The problem is that the French don't do anything to protect Muslim women. Because they only publish pamphlets about abuse in french... even though a lot of women who were forced to move there are intentionally withheld from learning french. It would take minimal effort to translate this stuff to the correct languages for the suburbs.

3) There are plenty of women who complain. Simply check out the french womens movement group the AFVT.

The problem with the French is that they prefer to hide and ignore there problems rather then confront them. They pass token laws with no real teeth and that don't solve problems but instead only symptoms of said problems.

In the end they pretend to be a lot more progressive then they really are.

I wouldn't say there is no chance of it changing though. Ironically the EU is a great chance for the increase of women and religious freedoms... assuming France and to a lesser extent Germany don't actively derail it... hence the shame that the UK hasn't stepped forward more. It'll be up to the Scandinavian states.

I know there have been proposals to take the US laws as a model.



95% of the people in my university are white. Give or take a few %.

It's a well known fact that immigrants have a harder time in school then people who were born in that country.