the images on the rright (which I assume are GT5) have the edge in gfx 2 me

sorry to say it but the only reason Unreal Engine 3 is so wellknown is because of Gears of War. This was the first game to use the engine, making it a completely new engine at time of development and release. The only real difference between these two games is one is being developed 2 years after the other one on a completely different system.

I dunno about the whole comparing two different games. The best way for me is comparing the same game to itself. It will be interesting to see which Madden 09 looks and plays better. 

.....So why are we expecting a game coming out 1-2 years after another racer to be *gasp* better than the previous contender?

Such stupidity by you Sony fanboys. Fact is, Forza Motorsports 3 will be even better than GT5. Why? It'll come out a year after GT5, and incorporate more into it - merely because it'll be 2009.

Why aruge about year old games, and games released versus unreleased games? Why aren't we comparing current games to eachother?

Also, to me, it's pretty bad when you have to troll another console's forum (of which you've never posted positive comments about), trying to justify your console's game selection (that isn't out yet), against a cheaper system.

What's next? Shots of Gran Turismo 4 versus 5 to show that the Cell can render things better? Or a ingame shot of Madden 08 Wii versus Madden 07 PS3 to show that an older Madden on PS3 is better, graphically than a newer Wii version? Give me a break. Stop trolling threads aruging invalid points.

Gears of War *will* be less visually impressive than KZ2 because it'll be nearly 2 years old at that point, and the developer will have spent less than half the cash on a game that will sell about 2x better than KZ2. Impressive for KZ2, eh?

on the picture of the dodge viper, you can more clearly see the trees in the background on fm2 than gt5, anyways driving real cars is a lot more fun

To me, the biggest difference is the grass. In GT is is sublime and luschous, in Forza just looks a bit bare

I'll see your Gran Turismo graphics and raise you Ace Combat 6.

GT5 looks better to me. This is the game that is going to make me buy a PS3.

gt5 looks better, but I would think this is better to compare to games out in the same year..

Dude... lets stop the fighting and like... hold hands :)

Let's also remember that FM2 was based on the same engine as the original, just a beefed up version. Let's wait and see what the next one will looks like with a completely new engine running..I am sure alot better. The environments need some work in the new GT5 demo though, and some things just arent as nice, but I am sure that will be fixed before final release. Gameplay wise forza is better, and more enjoyable personally...definitely more realistic, and for those who say otherwise obviously have never taken a fast car to a track in real life.  All of that withstanding, the new demo is absolutely amazing, and looks incredible, also plays better than the previous incarnations.  One complaint, why is the tire squeal that same since the original, I mean COME ON!!! You think they could improve the sound just a LITTLE, blue-ray people, HELLO!! Sheesh