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Forums - Gaming - Malstrom: Shysters posing as ‘analysts’

JaggedSac said:
I made no attempts in my post to assume that motion controls would do anything for the HD consoles, and in fact, I think motion controls will not help expand the userbase at all for either HD console. They will be neat, but they will not be a marketshare changer.

I was just merely stating that they were quite obviously vital to the Wii's success. Sure there were other elements in there(such as Nintendo software), but the motion control element is quite obviously the main grabber for the Wii's market share.

You said that Malstrom didn't think motion controls were vital to the success of the Wii. So we clarified, that's not what he was saying. The analyst thinks that motion controls are all that's needed, but there's more to it than that. And if you look at the success of the DS, the same thing was achieved without motion controls.



A game I'm developing with some friends:

www.xnagg.com/zombieasteroids/publish.htm

It is largely a technical exercise but feedback is appreciated.

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Alterego-X said:
JaggedSac said:
He seems to think motion controls did not the vital role in Wii's success. That is odd.

He believes that the motion controller is just the surface, and Nintendo's strategy is much deeper than that. Like in the birdmen fallacy:

Centuries ago, men attempted to fly by putting wings on their arms and flapping really hard. Logically, in their minds, it should have worked. Birds fly. Birds have wings. Therefore, having wings should mean man will fly.

The gentlemen, puffed with pride, failed every time. Had they examined the nature of flight, as opposed to the nature of birds, they would have realized the concept of lift (as Bernoulli did). One must examine the physics of the flight rather than putting feathers on one’s arms in imitation of birds. The descendants of these birdmen are with us today. In the gaming industry, they represent some of the highest gaming executives and esteemed analysts.

He stole that from Clayton M Christensen, the author of 'The Innovators Dilemma' funnily enough..

The book that Nintendo based their DS and Wii strategy around for people who aren't aware :P

So yeah.. It's a good analogy



 

Demotruk said:
JaggedSac said:
I made no attempts in my post to assume that motion controls would do anything for the HD consoles, and in fact, I think motion controls will not help expand the userbase at all for either HD console. They will be neat, but they will not be a marketshare changer.

I was just merely stating that they were quite obviously vital to the Wii's success. Sure there were other elements in there(such as Nintendo software), but the motion control element is quite obviously the main grabber for the Wii's market share.

You said that Malstrom didn't think motion controls were vital to the success of the Wii. So we clarified, that's not what he was saying. The analyst thinks that motion controls are all that's needed, but there's more to it than that. And if you look at the success of the DS, the same thing was achieved without motion controls.

Do they really believe that motion control schemes were what attracted the Expanded Market in the first place?

 

That was his statement.  And the answer is yes.  Without motion controls, the Wii is just a GameCube.  The expanded market wasn't looking for the next GameCube.  They were looking for this neat little console that had motion controls.

 

As for the DS.  It is a nice little touch two screen Gameboy following handheld device.  Innovative and fun.  That is how it got so big.  All massive products have a hook.  DS has innovative gameplay mechanics, as does the Wii with motion controls.



There's a reason Nintendo abandoned their original plan to release the wii remote with the Gamecube and design a brand new console around the new values.



A game I'm developing with some friends:

www.xnagg.com/zombieasteroids/publish.htm

It is largely a technical exercise but feedback is appreciated.

So someone's angry that analysts can be wrong?



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@ JaggedSac


he is saying its the different control scheme that made the wii popular, not the fact it was motion motion. The DS has a large casual audience but that doesnt have motion control



 nintendo fanboy, but the good kind

proud soldier of nintopia

 

@woopah
Actually, I think he's only pointing out that they are both successful with the same market. Despite the DS not using disruptive innovations. Also it is games that tie both successes together.



woopah said:
@ JaggedSac


he is saying its the different control scheme that made the wii popular, not the fact it was motion motion. The DS has a large casual audience but that doesnt have motion control

Actually, I think his position is that both DS and Wii are disruptors as in proposing games, peripherals, control schemes that lead to easy "pick up and play" experiences.

That's why he says that having the motion control hardware doesn't level the field, and that it will take some time for the blue ocean to become red: it will take a certain kind of software. In that, I think he's being very reasonable. On the other hand:

"Disruption says that the Wii would grow to the ‘high market’ as well."

not so much... he sounds like someone who embraced an empirical theory -or his version of it- so much that he's ready to bend factual evidence around its kinks and misses. A bit like he does with his all-encompssing theories about Mario games and their fantasy worlds and settings.

To all of those who enjoyed Christensen's works and might be tempted to see disruption everywhere I also suggest "The Black Swan" by Nassim Nicholas Taleb, for a radically different point of view on, among other things, economic theories.



"All you need in life is ignorance and confidence; then success is sure." - Mark Twain

"..." - Gordon Freeman

It's almost as though the hardware was built around these new games as opposed to just buying some fancy new tech and then throwing game ideas at it.



Nov 2016 - NES outsells PS1 (JP)

Don't Play Stationary 4 ever. Switch!

liquidninja said:
@woopah
Actually, I think he's only pointing out that they are both successful with the same market. Despite the DS not using disruptive innovations. Also it is games that tie both successes together.

Yes the DS is a disruptive product. It isn't a sustaining technology as much as the PSP is.

Compare the Gameboy -> DS line and Gameboy -> PSP line and tell me which you think looks more like an evolution in terms of product design and which looks like a step back (weaker, cheaper and focusing on an off the shelf technology to offer new values)

An example of a disruptive product is flash memory. The hardware itself is readily available off the shelf, has less capacity, is cheaper (not per mb but that doesn't matter here) and is slowly moving upmarket to replace hard drives in laptops and PC's. Now the reason why we can say it's cheaper is because the products that use flash memory only need a small amount of memory in general.

Flash memory has different values to HDD's such as being more reliable and small and light. The touch screen and the motion controls are merely ways for Nintendo to offer new values. These are; accessability, social and lifestyle values among others. Instead of the industries values of high power, longer, more engrossing gaming.

In essence while motion control was vital for Wii, would you call the balance board motion control? How about that vitality sensor? It's about the values that motion control delivers that is important. I hope this clears it up a little for you.