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Forums - Sony - Predict what Sony will announce on the 18th!

greenmedic88 said:
Hardware PS2 BC is gone for good.

The EE CPU emulation meant the deletion of the EE in the original 80GB SKU, but as of now there is no GS GPU emulation and I see ZERO chance of this chip being re-engineered back onto the PS3 chipset/motherboard for the simple reason that the mobo is currently smaller and squarer (largely due to the deletion of the EE and GS), and likely due for another shrink/reduction with the next/current hardware revision.

What I can see happening down the line (no guess as to when) is that PS2 BC will return to the PS3 via PSN downloads with individually code tweaked soft BC.

What's the difference? PS2 disc games wouldn't play on non-GS equipped PS3s. Every PS2 game that SCE wants to play on later PS3s would require additional coding on an individual game basis, much like Xbox games on the Xbox 360 (only certain games were retroactively coded for BC).

While the updates could easily be downloaded, the main incentive for individually coding PS2 game compatibility would be so that they could sell the games again on PSN.

But if SCE can do GS emulation without having to recode individual games; hats off. It would be a great service for retro gamers and those who already have collections of PS2 games.

But as one of those gamers, I'd be satisfied just to see PS2 games being sold on PSN.

It's obvious they're working on firmware BC, and I think they'll get it working eventually.  Remember, this is the company that got 99% of PS1 games working entirely via software on the PSP of all devices - at a time when PS1 games still had issues via PC emulation.

Much like with the PS1, they have a large incentive to get full PS2 BC working.  First of all, so that PS2 owners have a reason to upgrade to a PS3 instead of a 360 or Wii, and secondly, so that they can easily sell PS2 games on the PSN with little to no work involved on a per title basis. 

Third parties (even Sony themselves) wouldn't be so keen on porting individual PS2 titles to PS3.  Just look at how the Xbox Originals dried up.  The ability to do a quick and dirty transfer job on PS1 titles has lead to even crap like 2Xtreme making their way to the PSN, because it's so easy to do so.  Third parties view it as easy money, and this in turn makes Sony money.

Sony definitely wants to do this, and it's apparent that they are working on this to some degree.  I don't think we'll see anything on this front until next year at the earliest, however, given the difficulties of such a task, even for Sony.

Interesting note: All ps3s have ps2 BC to a degree, on a firmware level, however it is currently disabled.  Info surfaced on gaf about this awhile back from a few devs that had access to this feature via devkits.  However, the emulation is very mediocre, as from what I heard games ran at like 1/3rd the proper framerate, among other issues.

Edit:

I can't find the original thread on this last bit, but I can find some later references to it:

Ps3 is capable to run ps2 games with 100 % software emulation but the performance and compatibility is really poor... the emulator is present in every ps3 in the market (since 2.10 if I remember correctly) but is "deactivated". If you can "see" the ps3 flash you will see some interesting files on it.

...

In the flash there is one emulator for every model of ps3 out in the market. There is a file for models with EE and GS, a file for EE only models, and a file for models without any ps2 component.



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Yeah I'm 99% sure PS2 BC is coming. Sony said it before the PS3 launched. But they originally didn't plan to remove the hardware BC. Once they have it up and running, they can also launch a 'trade in your ps2, get a discount on the ps3' campaign. I don't know how big the effect would be, but I remember they did it back in the PS2 days.



I think they planned to gradually phase out PS2 hardware BC overtime, eventually moving to a full software solution near the end of the gen, much like how slim ps2s had software BC for ps1 games. However, their slow sales forced them to speed up the process so they could drop the price of the ps3 sooner, and software BC just wasn't near ready yet.



Exactly!

Also, do fat PS2's have hardware BC for PS1 games? I thought all PS2's had software BC.



The biggest incentive for SCE to implement PS2 BC would still be so that they could sell PS2 games on PSN.

As for the hardware BC, it should have been pretty obvious that removing the EE and GS would be the easiest way to drop the cost of the overall chip set, which has really been one of the biggest challenges since their Day 1 $840 manufacturing cost debut.

Hardware PS2 BC is gone for good; there's no rolling back the clock on that issue.

But it is very safe to say that people will be able to buy PS2 games via PSN in the future that will play on every PS3.

If it works with PS2 disc games, great; but by that time they may not even be in wide production and distribution and I see little reason for SCE wanting to improve the market for used PS2 games that they don't make a cent off of.

The soft BC on the 360 was not a concerted effort; it was merely to ease the transition of weaning gamers off the original Xbox following its premature demise. As for selling Xbox classics through XBL, I'm not sure what the point of that was other than as a DD market test, seeing as how that effort was even more half-assed than the previous game disc emulation.



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Zuhyc said:
Exactly!

Also, do fat PS2's have hardware BC for PS1 games? I thought all PS2's had software BC.

It might have been lost in the transition between the PS2 and the PS2 Slim, seeing as how the chip set was greatly reduced by that time. I'd look it up to confirm, but I really wouldn't be surprised if hardware support was originally in there.



Sony's press is tommorow?



Firmware 3.0 and GT5 releasing this year.



 

 

 

 

greenmedic88 said:
Zuhyc said:
Exactly!

Also, do fat PS2's have hardware BC for PS1 games? I thought all PS2's had software BC.

It might have been lost in the transition between the PS2 and the PS2 Slim, seeing as how the chip set was greatly reduced by that time. I'd look it up to confirm, but I really wouldn't be surprised if hardware support was originally in there.


it was i have a PS2 , and the original fat one that is.



As for the US I think they announce the current fat ones are $300 while supplies last. Slim gets added at $400. Later once the plentiful supply of old stock dries up (don't tell me that its depleted because my local Best Buy has had two full pallets of the 80 GB PS3 sitting on the floor for months) the slim lowers to the $300 price point.