I don't see it as vital that natural selection is taught in primary school but it certainly should be taught early in secondary education.

The question here is whether creationism or the story of creation is taught in primary school to children in this age range and if it is then the teaching of natural selection should be given equal weighting.

The story of creation is taught in primary schools from a religious prospective, creaton theory isn't. But that's good because that's the way it should be IMO, the story of creation should be taught in R.E. (religious education) and evolution should be taught in science.

Mind you back when I was in primary school we had to listen to stories from the bible and the quran in assembly every morning, I don't agree with that, but I think they have got rid of that now anyway (this is going back 12 years).

@ The debate people are having about the literal meaning of the bible.

I don't want to sound like I'm having a go here, and I really don't want to be, so I'll try and make this as friendly as possible, but I do think that the literal meaning of the bible is a bit of a pick and choose to suit affair.

I recall having a conversation once where the guy I was debating evolution with claimed that the reason some fossils are buried so deep is because Noahs flood buried them. I said I cant believe that a flood of that scale occurred and that every creature could fit on one boat and he replied saying the story wasn't meant to be taken literally. So the same story can be taken literally in one sense but not in another? That's one example of dozens I've heard.

I understand that much debate exists within the Christian community about what is supposed to be taken literally and what is not, so it is fair to give the debate the benefit of the doubt in that situation of what is literal. But sometimes it is a little confusing lol.

I've been taught minor evolution things in primary school, such as dinosaurs, fossils and primitive ancestors. Of course, the theory itself was very simplified, as it is too complex for kids but I see no reason to why it shouldn't be taught like the things I've learned at that time. Kids like those things, it isn't very hard to grab their attention when it comes to this.

The Hebrew's and Babylonians are closely related, and as such many of their stories and ideas (incluidng Creation and the Flood).  The Babylonians believed the world the be a circle, with God/gods seperating the two waters (fresh and salt) and a firmament (Heaven) above.  There are numerous mentions of flat Earth and the firmament, and to try to 'explain them away,' as well as other modern day ridiculous ideas to believe, is to ignore a major portion of the Bible's teachings. 

I saw, and behold a tree in the midst of the earth, and the height thereof was great.  The tree grew, and was strong, and the height thereof reached unto heaven, and the sight thereof to the end of all the earth.  - Daniel 4:10-11

He has fixed the earth firm, immovable. - 1 Chronicles 16:30

Consume them in wrath, consume them, that they may not be: and let them know that God ruleth in Jacob unto the ends of the earth.                        - Psalm 59 : 13

And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters. And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so. And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day. - Genesis 1: 6-8

And let them be for lights in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth: and it was so. And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also. And God set them in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth. - Genesis 1:15-17

And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.  And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.  And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains; And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb. - Revelation 6:13-16

The word Firmament means to spread out. 

Your probably one of those people that think people expected Christopher Columbus was going to fall off the "ends of the earth".

There really isn't a debate though.

It's like saying their is a debate among muslims whether or not the religion means everyone should be terrorists against the west.

There is only a small group of the experts that believe in literealism.

Basically evangelicals, jehovah's witnesses, mormans and that's it.

Every other Priest or Rabbi will tell you it's not litereal.

No, the educated in the Middle Ages knew that the world was round.  The only people in opposition to the idea was some in the Church and the general population.  Also, the word firmament doesnt mean 'to spread out' in many cases of the Bible since it is an actual place where God puts stars, the sun, the moon, and uses to seperate sea water from the fresh water in the sky.

I'd probably ignore the Bible verses too if it made my argument look bad.

In my opinion, I feel conflicted on biblical literalism. On one hand, it's obviously absurd and loony to take the bible as the unadulterated literal account of history of the world. There was not a flood 4000 years ago that left seven people and a small group of animals to create every civilization, culture, language, and biological diversity that we have today. You'd have to be incredibly ignorant of so many fields of study to believe that. And while it's grossly ignorant and absurd, at least it's relatively consistent intellectually within it's own bizarre world. It is an unflinching world view.

On the other hand, I think biblical allegory is really an intellectually dishonest position. Because it essentially is just a constant state of cutting up the bible into that which is socially and scientifically acceptable for modern times. It has nothing to do with what the bible says, it only has to do with what you can make the bible say. What liberal Christians believe now is nothing like what Christians believed a hundred years ago, or two hundred years ago, or further back. And is influenced almost entirely by the moral and scientific zeitgeist of the day. It is the act of making the bible into a hand puppet.

But on the other hand, while taking a non-literalist position I think is intellectually dishonest, it is greatly preferable morally and socially. Because it's the ones that take it literally that kill abortion doctors, think homosexuals are abominations and atheists are all immoral murderers, and want to dissect our education system and take out all of the stuff they feel contradicts their world view. It's the ones that believe it's not to be taken so literally that you can go have a beer with, and they just want to be a good person.

Personally, for me at least, beer wins out of intellectual honesty, so I'd much rather hope that American christians move towards a more liberal view of the bible than the revert to believing what they believe hell or high water. Who wants a beer? I want a beer.

Just as a boring FYI on the whole 'Earth is round vs flat thing'

Eratosthenes was I believe the first known person to calculate the circumference of the world in around 200bc

Pythagoras I believe mentioned the idea the world was round even earlier and with the context that implied the idea had already been around a while.

Aristarchus I believe, just a tad earlier than Eratosthenes but I could be wrong on this, was the first to put forward the idea the Earth orbited the sun, etc.

So basically a bunch of really smart mathematicians and astronomers (can there be any other kind?) worked out all this stuff pretty accurately ages ago, but the knowledge got buried and forgotten due to suppression.

I can't help wondering where we'd all be now if knowledge and advancement had continued unimpeded since that time without all the turmoil in between.

I've also wondered what is was in the water back in ancient Greece, etc. that made all those fellows so damn clever!

Final point - it's probably a fair assumption that some bright sailor must have wondered at the curved horizon, changing angle of view, the fact the moon looked like a sphere, etc. during their travels and thought... maybe it's round.