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Forums - Sales - Why the PS3 will not last long, let alone 10 years.

Smashchu2 said:
txrattlesnake said:
Rei said:
MaxwellGT2000 said:
Rei said:
MaxwellGT2000 said:
txrattlesnake said:

FF hasn't lost any steam. Both FFXIII and Versus XIII will achieve 3 to 5 million sales in Japan on PS3 this gen and GT5 will achieve 2 million + sales in Japan on the PS3 this gen. There's no doubt about it. And that means there will be a bump to at least 5 million PS3s sold in Japan following the release of FF Versus XIII there's really no doubt about it.

FFVII sold 3.97 million in Japan, X sold 3.0 million, and both of the first GTs on PS1 and PS2 sold over 2 million in Japan.

XIII is not VII... it never will be...

yes VII sold nearly 4 million X sold just 3 million and XII hasn't even sold 3 million woo! that's keeping that train chugging along...

You have statistics and facts going against you here... you haven't even come up with a plausable prediction yet...


   FFVII has not sold 4 millions in Japan and FFX has not sold 3 millions. 

 

 

 

Final Fantasy X has sold 3.02 million copies in Japan.  Look a this page (http://vgchartz.com/games/game.php?id=759®ion=All) and then find the part where it says sales history.  Then look for the column heading Japan.  It says FFX sold 1,906,152 copies in its first week in Japan and 3.02 million ltd.

If you round FFVII's sales figures upwards by the slightest of margins, then it has sold 4 million copies in Japan.  Look at this page (http://vgchartz.com/games/game.php?id=756®ion=All), follow the same steps as with FFX, and you'll see that FFVII sold 2,025,834 copies in its first week in Japan and 3.93 million copies ltd.  Virtually 4 million copies.

Didn't realize people were still posting here. It looks like the comments improved.

One thing to remeber Rattlesnake is that Final Fatasy doesn't seem to move units outside of Japan. In Japan, both FF7 and 10 increased sales, but was for a short time (usually 3-4 weeks) with it's peak being week one. Expect that when FF13 comes out for everyone to praise the PS3, only for hardware sales to come down a week or two later. It will not move the system past the 360.


     I think when PS3 hits the 5 to 7 million mark while the 360's is only about 1.5 million in Japan, then you will see less reason for most Japanese studios to make 360 games especially when they can sell many more copies of their games in Japan alone on PS3 than they can sell of  any game they would put on 360 worldwide.  So, I don't predict that the FFs and GT 5 by themselves will put the PS3 ahead of the 360 worldwide.  What I feel that they will do is put the PS3 in that sweet spot for Japanese developers where you will see more games from Japanese developers appearing on the PS3.  Those three games will also ensure that the PS3 has enough sales in the rest of the world to continue to get the same big Western third party games that the 360 does.

     One complaint you hear from people about the PS3 is that its library and the 360's game libraries are too similar to each other.  However, when the PS3 hits that sweet spot with Japanese developers which it will reach, then you will see much more differentiation between the PS3 and 360's game libraries due to the influx of more Japanese games on PS3.

     One way Microsoft could offset that would be to make stronger ties between itself and smaller Western third parties; however, I think we're too deep into this gen and they're too close to starting to put more serious thought or work into their next console that Microsoft isn't much interested in doing that with the 360. 

 



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WereKitten said:
^I can't say I have been witness to such shrinkage, but that's because here in Italy the PS3 sells slightly more hardware and software than the 360. That said, I am sure that reducing its shelf space to two thirds of the other two consoles makes sense in America for many retailers, as I said it's selling about 65% of the 360's software.

It's the whole "it's last in the console war thus we'll forfeit a sure 20% of our home console profit to make space for the NextBox" idea that I have troubles finding appropriate for a rational retailer.

You are right that they make most of their profits from software, but at the same time, retailers just do not have enough shelf space to justify keeping old consoles even if their software sales might temporarily rise due to the other competitors being released.  I'm sure retailers would love to do what you suggest and support so many different consoles, but having 4 consoles and 2 hand helds is difficult enough as it is.  With the release of 2-3 new consoles they would not be able to support all of them.  This is because retailers will want to push the new consoles.  New consoles sold ensures future software sales, while old last gen consoles sold means less future software sold since developers will also be shifting focus to the new consoles.

They will make the same profits because the new consoles will be selling out like hot-cakes and any loss in sales of the old consoles/software will be made up for by the new ones.

If anything the scenario may repeat itself with the NextBox being out first for a year and then the Wii 2 and PS4.  But regardless of how it pans out, if the PS3 is in last after the PS4 is released it will be discontinued.  It all depends on what the situation is at that point, but as I said, if it ends up this way then the PS3 will surely be first discontinued at retail (for the US).



txrattlesnake said:
Rei said:
MaxwellGT2000 said:
Rei said:
MaxwellGT2000 said:
txrattlesnake said:

FF hasn't lost any steam. Both FFXIII and Versus XIII will achieve 3 to 5 million sales in Japan on PS3 this gen and GT5 will achieve 2 million + sales in Japan on the PS3 this gen. There's no doubt about it. And that means there will be a bump to at least 5 million PS3s sold in Japan following the release of FF Versus XIII there's really no doubt about it.

FFVII sold 3.97 million in Japan, X sold 3.0 million, and both of the first GTs on PS1 and PS2 sold over 2 million in Japan.

XIII is not VII... it never will be...

yes VII sold nearly 4 million X sold just 3 million and XII hasn't even sold 3 million woo! that's keeping that train chugging along...

You have statistics and facts going against you here... you haven't even come up with a plausable prediction yet...


   FFVII has not sold 4 millions in Japan and FFX has not sold 3 millions. 

  

 

 

Final Fantasy X has sold 3.02 million copies in Japan.  Look a this page (http://vgchartz.com/games/game.php?id=759®ion=All) and then find the part where it says sales history.  Then look for the column heading Japan.  It says FFX sold 1,906,152 copies in its first week in Japan and 3.02 million ltd.

If you round FFVII's sales figures upwards by the slightest of margins, then it has sold 4 million copies in Japan.  Look at this page (http://vgchartz.com/games/game.php?id=756®ion=All), follow the same steps as with FFX, and you'll see that FFVII sold 2,025,834 copies in its first week in Japan and 3.93 million copies ltd.  Virtually 4 million copies.

   Dude, you have no clue. I have explained why vgchartz shows sales for these games like that in the  very post you quoted, but I guess it was that hard for you to properly read it.

   Regardless, I am not going to get in an argument with you, keep believing that FF games will move millinos of consoles in Japan, that's your right.



account2099 said:
PS1 and PS2 were market leaders and thus lasted 10 years.

PS3 is last place...........thus breaks up the winning formula

/THREAD

Plus I HIGHLY agree with your post. The reason why the PS1 and PS2 are still on the market is that third-parties are still supporting them (with minor games since the secondary developers have moved to PS3; Sony is a publisher and to my knowledge, doesn't have any mascots), and Sony cannot kill off the PS2 until the third-parties still want to have their way with the console and it's still profitable for Sony.



txrattlesnake said:
Smashchu2 said:
txrattlesnake said:
Rei said:
MaxwellGT2000 said:
Rei said:
MaxwellGT2000 said:
txrattlesnake said:

FF hasn't lost any steam. Both FFXIII and Versus XIII will achieve 3 to 5 million sales in Japan on PS3 this gen and GT5 will achieve 2 million + sales in Japan on the PS3 this gen. There's no doubt about it. And that means there will be a bump to at least 5 million PS3s sold in Japan following the release of FF Versus XIII there's really no doubt about it.

FFVII sold 3.97 million in Japan, X sold 3.0 million, and both of the first GTs on PS1 and PS2 sold over 2 million in Japan.

XIII is not VII... it never will be...

yes VII sold nearly 4 million X sold just 3 million and XII hasn't even sold 3 million woo! that's keeping that train chugging along...

You have statistics and facts going against you here... you haven't even come up with a plausable prediction yet...


   FFVII has not sold 4 millions in Japan and FFX has not sold 3 millions. 

 

 

 

Final Fantasy X has sold 3.02 million copies in Japan.  Look a this page (http://vgchartz.com/games/game.php?id=759®ion=All) and then find the part where it says sales history.  Then look for the column heading Japan.  It says FFX sold 1,906,152 copies in its first week in Japan and 3.02 million ltd.

If you round FFVII's sales figures upwards by the slightest of margins, then it has sold 4 million copies in Japan.  Look at this page (http://vgchartz.com/games/game.php?id=756®ion=All), follow the same steps as with FFX, and you'll see that FFVII sold 2,025,834 copies in its first week in Japan and 3.93 million copies ltd.  Virtually 4 million copies.

Didn't realize people were still posting here. It looks like the comments improved.

One thing to remeber Rattlesnake is that Final Fatasy doesn't seem to move units outside of Japan. In Japan, both FF7 and 10 increased sales, but was for a short time (usually 3-4 weeks) with it's peak being week one. Expect that when FF13 comes out for everyone to praise the PS3, only for hardware sales to come down a week or two later. It will not move the system past the 360.


     I think when PS3 hits the 5 to 7 million mark while the 360's is only about 1.5 million in Japan, then you will see less reason for most Japanese studios to make 360 games especiallye PS3 in that sweet spot for Japanese developers where you will see more games from Japanese developers appearing on the PS3.  Thwhen they can sell many more copies of their games in Japan alone on PS3 than they can sell of  any game they would put on 360 worldwide.  So, I don't predict that the FFs and GT 5 by themselves will put the PS3 ahead of the 360 worldwide.  What I feel that they will do is put those three games will also ensure that the PS3 has enough sales in the rest of the world to continue to get the same big Western third party games that the 360 does.

     One complaint you hear from people about the PS3 is that its library and the 360's game libraries are too similar to each other.  However, when the PS3 hits that sweet spot with Japanese developers which it will reach, then you will see much more differentiation between the PS3 and 360's game libraries due to the influx of more Japanese games on PS3.

     One way Microsoft could offset that would be to make stronger ties between itself and smaller Western third parties; however, I think we're too deep into this gen and they're too close to starting to put more serious thought or work into their next console that Microsoft isn't much interested in doing that with the 360. 

 

That wont happen. Right now, Japanese developers put the DS first. The Wii is probably starting in for a distant second. What you suggested wont happen becuase it is easier and produces more revenue to put it one either console. In this way, the publisher increase the number of people they can sell to. Look at games like Resident Evil 5 and Street Fighter 4. They are helped a lot by this.

The other problem with your idea (as it basically is saying "PS3 will dominate becuase more games will come") isn't fesible becuase it takes to long for a game to come out on those systems. It can be done on the DS, PSP and to a lesser degree, the Wii, but not on the 360 and PS3.

What I think many people are forgetting is that Sony will have to release a system when Microsoft does. These companies are competing on symetric values, so if they did not respond, they would lose market shares.



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@Nightsurge
You answered the wrong post, read my previous one. The NextBox won't make up for the loss of selling PS3 software for years after its inception, and it will take its market mostly out of the 360's. With the PS2 end of line, there will be no rational reason to entirely cut one out of three of the big console lines.



"All you need in life is ignorance and confidence; then success is sure." - Mark Twain

"..." - Gordon Freeman

WereKitten said:
@Nightsurge
You answered the wrong post, read my previous one. The NextBox won't make up for the loss of selling PS3 software for years after its inception, and it will take its market mostly out of the 360's. With the PS2 end of line, there will be no rational reason to entirely cut one out of three of the big console lines.

But the PS3 will be cut first based on shelf space.  The NextBox would more than makeup for any loss in PS3 software sales, that and the 360, Wii, and Wii 2.  Retailers cannot support all the shelving space and especially given the drastic situation in the US.  The PS3 would be discontinued there because of lack of shelf space and it would have the lowest software sales even when compared to the 360 and Wii after their counterparts are released.

Basically if retailers followed what you are proposing, we would still have PS1s, N64s, Gamecubes, and original Xboxes for sale....



WereKitten said:
@Nightsurge
You answered the wrong post, read my previous one. The NextBox won't make up for the loss of selling PS3 software for years after its inception, and it will take its market mostly out of the 360's. With the PS2 end of line, there will be no rational reason to entirely cut one out of three of the big console lines.

Whilst I don't doubt that an Xbox Evolution would take a lot of its sales from Xbox 360 owners. I believe that it would also take sales, especially in America from the PS3 and Wii if it follows the same lines. It would also take sales from non console owners and PS2 owners as well. According to the recent Neilson survey there are still more people who play the original Xbox than they do the PS3 or there was at the time anyway.



Tease.

nightsurge said:
WereKitten said:
@Nightsurge
You answered the wrong post, read my previous one. The NextBox won't make up for the loss of selling PS3 software for years after its inception, and it will take its market mostly out of the 360's. With the PS2 end of line, there will be no rational reason to entirely cut one out of three of the big console lines.

But the PS3 will be cut first based on shelf space.  The NextBox would more than makeup for any loss in PS3 software sales, that and the 360, Wii, and Wii 2.  Retailers cannot support all the shelving space and especially given the drastic situation in the US.  The PS3 would be discontinued there because of lack of shelf space and it would have the lowest software sales even when compared to the 360 and Wii after their counterparts are released.

Basically if retailers followed what you are proposing, we would still have PS1s, N64s, Gamecubes, and original Xboxes for sale....

You keep saying the same thing but no, the numbers tell that it won't. It doesn't matter if the PS3 is third out of three, even on the american market it sells almost two thirds as much software as the 360 (and likely going to grow as the install base ratio changes). It will take the NextBox years to reach that level of software sales with some continuity, and that will also mean that the 360 software sales will go down, making it even less profitable cutting the PS3 to allot the same space to 360 and new space to the NextBox.

PS1, N64 and other old consoles are not a good comparison simply because they would sell a tiny quantity of software in absolute and relative terms. Having a section dedicated to an old console that sells like 2% of the total might not make sense, but with the PS3 today we're talking about 20% of all the software sales on the American market. The rational way to go is to cut the PS2 space, not the PS3.



"All you need in life is ignorance and confidence; then success is sure." - Mark Twain

"..." - Gordon Freeman

Squilliam said:
WereKitten said:
@Nightsurge
You answered the wrong post, read my previous one. The NextBox won't make up for the loss of selling PS3 software for years after its inception, and it will take its market mostly out of the 360's. With the PS2 end of line, there will be no rational reason to entirely cut one out of three of the big console lines.

Whilst I don't doubt that an Xbox Evolution would take a lot of its sales from Xbox 360 owners. I believe that it would also take sales, especially in America from the PS3 and Wii if it follows the same lines. It would also take sales from non console owners and PS2 owners as well. According to the recent Neilson survey there are still more people who play the original Xbox than they do the PS3 or there was at the time anyway.

The survey is hardly relevant for a retailer, though: the week of May 9th on the american market the 360 sold 557K pieces of software, the PS3 sold 320K, and the Xbox sold 557.



"All you need in life is ignorance and confidence; then success is sure." - Mark Twain

"..." - Gordon Freeman