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Forums - Gaming - Walkthroughs. Is It A Form Of Cheating.

The answer to the question is no it is not cheating. One cannot cheat oneself. All one can do is delude themselves. Further more most developers intentionally bring about the creation of guides. In doing so they have vanquished any expectation that they will go unused. Providing the tool is a validation of its fairness. Technically it does not meet the definition of cheating.

Further more it does not meet the requirements for self deprivation. That depends on which is the greater deprivation. Not defeating a puzzle, or not being able to access the game behind the limitation. There is no right or wrong answer for a no win situation. Which do you prefer, and which is true to yourself. Are you the person that refuses to progress if you cannot do yourself, or are you the person that refuses to not progress.

So technically we have no foul here, but the real question is how does using a guide make you feel about yourself. I do not feel any pangs myself. I use guides as sparingly as possible, and usually in the presence of legitimate reasons to do so. I will not use a guide when reasonable options are available to me, and I will not use guides for perfect completion.

My most common reasons for falling back on a guide. Incomplete or incoherent instructions. Be mindful I will reference the manual thoroughly. Prolonged period of entrapment in a linear environment. Cannot get out, and have been stuck here for hours and have simply run out of ideas. Time sinks or activities that with a massive use of time can be completed, but are just basic mind numbing repetition. Note to others my spatial orientation and mathematical skills are pretty good. My process of elimination is excellent. So when I say massive waste of time it is just that.

Finally I will occasionally use a guide to access other content after completion. Not achievements, but additional quests I might have missed. To me none of this alters the fact that I completed the game, and probably do not want to waste hours trying to trip over things. Just squeezing out a few hours more of content out of a spent game.



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Dodece that bordered on incoherent.

"Providing the tool is a validation of its fairness"? How many guides are actually made by video game production companies?



Khuutra said:
Onyxmeth said:
The Ghost of RubangB said:
Onyxmeth said:
Words Of Wisdom said:
Playing an RPG without a walkthrough these days is like saying you only feel like playing half the game.

Reminds me of Tales of Symphonia where you'd only get certain titles between certain periods of time in the game when you had certain characters with you and when the sun, moon, and stars aligned.

Pretty much this. Anyone else want to tell me how it's possible to get the Zodiac Spear in FF XII without knowing in advance which four chests in the game you can't open? The game does not give you hints. It's not possible. There's many other instances where you can miss out on so much that is timed in the game.

I'd call that shitty design and not even get that stupid item.

It's like making a game or a movie and leaving the plot out, and making people buy a book later to explain it.

It is shitty design, and most RPGs are exactly like this, which is why if you want to get the most out of them, a walkthrough becomes necessary reading. Other games not so much, but RPGs should basically be packaged with walkthroughs because they rely on them so much to take advantage of the secrets and easter eggs throughout the game.

About the Zodiac Spear though, it's the most powerful weapon in the game, so it's pretty desirable. Most people that want to complete the final hunts probably wouldn't want to go into them without this spear.

In defense of FFXII, you're pretty obviously not meant to get the Zodiac Spear when it becomes available by this method, as you can use it to one-shot almost anything for most of the game. It's a completely broken weapon. It was meant specifically for people who wanted to bypass challenge in the main storyline.

That doesn't make any sense, since the Zodiac Spear is located in a spot requiring your cast to be at least above level 40 minimum and get almost up to Arcadia which is more than halfway through the game. Also this is the only method available to get the Zodiac Spear, and two of the chests required to not be opened are in the very early hours of the game. Even if one were to wait until late in the game, they very likely could have opened a chest that would negate the Zodiac Spear's appearance in it's chest later on. It's not that it's so difficult, it's that it's meant to be missed unless one already knows what to not do. There's really no reason to defend the game at all, because even you must know that was a poor choice on their part considering many RPG fanatics love getting the final weapon in their games.

Also it's meant to assist in the final hunts, where I hear it becomes more of a necessity instead of "bypassing challenge".

 



Tag: Became a freaking mod and a complete douche, coincidentally, at the same time.



It's actually more of a liability in the final hunts because of its slow rate of attack and low combo rate. The Masamune becomes much more important because of its astronomical combo rate.

Also, it's not the only method of getting the spear - there is another 1/1000 chest that will contian the spear. Sometimes.

I think the fact that you have to go through that weird rigamarole shows that you weren't really supposed to get the spear. I'm okay with that - it's an easter egg, and it's absurdly powerful to the point that it doesn't fit well into the storyline.

Wait, we're in agreement that you aren't supposed to get the spear.

In that case, I see nothing wrong with sticking in something that 99% of playes will never see.



try to get the Tournesoul sword in FFXII without a walthrough, haha



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@Khuutra

Almost all official guides are licensed by a games publisher. They sell the rights to say a Prima which creates, and prints the guide using information provided by the publisher. This is how they are able to be on the shelf on release day.

Which part is incoherent exactly? I think it was clear cut that they have no right to the expectation that their customers would not use these. When they are in fact the ones encouraging the use. How can any gamer consider it to be technical cheating when they are being advised to use guides.

How often do we get this offer when we buy the game in the store. Would you like to buy the guide with that? I assure you it is not accidental. Just another way for the publisher to make a little more green. If they will not consider it cheating then who am I to argue with that.



The question was "how many guides are created by video game production companies", not "how many guides are licensed out by video game publishers". You failed to answer the question.

The part that is incoherent is where you seem to be confused as to what constitutes cheating. The fact that you can operate outside the normal rules and knowledge base of a game is in itself cheating. Metaknowledge operates outside of the knowledge provided to you in the context of the game, ergo it is cheating.

I don't know why you think the desires of the developer has anything to do with publishing.

Or why you think clerks in Gamestop have anything to do with whether or not it's cheating.

"We can buy it, so it isn't cheating" is a very weak argument.



Do I use them? Yes.

Is it cheating? Yes.

Do I care? No.

I use them for RPGs. I figure, in the end, as long as I enjoy the game, that's all that matters, if I have to cheat to enjoy the game, then so be it. :) I've never played a puzzle game but I can't see myself using a walk through for a puzzle game since the entire point is to find the solution to the puzzle. Walkthroughs are nice for RPGs because I don't want to have to back track because I apparently didn't do a certain task to collect a certain object, or didn't get enough of some object.



I do normally seek them, but that just to confirm that I am not missing out on things or when I am really stuck.

For example, once in Cryostasis I was stuck and when I looked at the walkthrough I found that a door should have opened a while ago so the game was stuck itself. Without it I would still be there trying to figure out what to do.



PLAYSTATION®3 is the future.....NOW.......B_E_L_I_E_V_E

Yes it is and I don't do it unless I've tried and tried for weeks and am totally stuck.
As in life, when you're in need of help you look to somsone that has more knowledge on that particular subject than you do!

But on WOW (currently level 75) I cheat a lot by using online guides for completing quests quicker.
Time is money, real money on wow, so I want to get to level 80 as quickly as possible, then I can suspend my account again!