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Forums - Sales - A possible reason 3rd parties ignore the Wii...

astrosmash on 20 May 2009
mjc2021 said:
Core gamers that own a Wii are dying for games like GTA and Assassin's Creed. So I'll ignore that.

I'm looking at your Wii collection and I'm not seeing many top selling 3rd party games in there. Obviously you're a core gamer so you should just admit the top selling 3rd party games on the Wii are a joke.

Your Smash Bros analogy is completely different. Snake just made a cameo in that game. Mario & Sonic is a game that relies entirely on Mario to be a success, Nintendo collects a paycheck, Nintendo probably had some sort of creative control whether they did or not, and Nintendo published the game in Japan. It's hard to make a comparison with some other game because I can't think of any other similar comparisons.

Nintendo does not collect a paycheck. Nintendo was allowed to use Sonic in SSBB in exchange for Sega using Mario in Mario and Sonic at the Olympics. 

 



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mjc2021 on 20 May 2009
griffinA said:
mjc2021 said:
MaxwellGT2000 said:
mjc2021 said:
MaxwellGT2000 said:
coolestguyever said:
That's some good information you put together. I never realized how poorly the 3rd party software sold on Wii.

Everyone looks at the massive sales of Nintendo's first party games and assumes its a big software mover, but in reality its not. Only the well known franchises (like Guitar hero, and the big Nintendo franchises) have great sales on the Wii with of course a few exceptions

And keep in mind the Wii has over double the PS3 userbase and its getting owned!

 

Dude he only put the top ten sellers on the big three consoles third party wise and even left out SEGAs top seller on top of it.  Nintendo Wii killed the other two consoles in third party software sales last year (with little quality support) and it shows with the support they're finally giving Wii this year, period.  You're taking the OP completely wrong.

 

Obviously I left out Sega's top seller because Nintendo had a hand in it and it's using their most popular franchise. It's not like Sega had the option to put that game in any console of their choice. But you're smart enough to realize that.

The upcoming Wii games look lackluster but that's my opinion. Also it doesn't matter if the upcoming Wii games are of higher quality. They will be ignored for party games and more shovelware. Did you notice the 10 Wii games on that list are garbage while the 360 games are riddled in awesome?

As a Wii owner you should be angry at Wii sales trends, not me for pointing it out.

 

You realize I've played most of those games on the top 10 on the 360s list right?  GTA is terrible, Assassins Creed was average, and madden hasn't been good in a while.  So what is it, 360 fans just have terrible tastes in games and you want to gloat about it?

No the fact of the matter is quality and what you think is good is subjective, I could easily say that all top 10 360 games are shovelware because my personal feeling is the developers put very little effort into them and quality is poor, I personally don't believe that but you seem to believe all that sells on Wii is shovelware, the normal games you seem to call shovelware is clearly not, just a different type game then what you like playing so get over yourself.

As for Mario and Sonic, that was developed from the ground up on Wii by SEGA, Nintendo's only hand in the game was lending out the name and likeness of Mario, that's like saying I could count Super Smash Brothers Brawl as third party because Konami had Solid Snake in the game and even Kojima gave his ideas about the game.  It's a double standard.

 

Core gamers that own a Wii are dying for games like GTA and Assassin's Creed. So I'll ignore that.

I'm looking at your Wii collection and I'm not seeing many top selling 3rd party games in there. Obviously you're a core gamer so you should just admit the top selling 3rd party games on the Wii are a joke.

Your Smash Bros analogy is completely different. Snake just made a cameo in that game. Mario & Sonic is a game that relies entirely on Mario to be a success, Nintendo collects a paycheck, Nintendo probably had some sort of creative control whether they did or not, and Nintendo published the game in Japan. It's hard to make a comparison with some other game because I can't think of any other similar comparisons.

And im sure they're plenty of gamers on the 360 (the ones that probably bought the arcade) that want a wii sports or wii fit game. What's your point?

 

I'm sorry, but I cant see how a third-party developed and published game can be considered a first-party game.

 


Some 360 owners probably do want Wii Fit and Wii Sports. But that has nothing to do with what I was saying. You were just quick to defend the Wii for some reason.

Mario & Sonic uses a 1st party franchise and the game was published in Japan by Nintendo. Nintendo has their hand in that game period.



mjc2021 on 20 May 2009
astrosmash said:
mjc2021 said:
Core gamers that own a Wii are dying for games like GTA and Assassin's Creed. So I'll ignore that.

I'm looking at your Wii collection and I'm not seeing many top selling 3rd party games in there. Obviously you're a core gamer so you should just admit the top selling 3rd party games on the Wii are a joke.

Your Smash Bros analogy is completely different. Snake just made a cameo in that game. Mario & Sonic is a game that relies entirely on Mario to be a success, Nintendo collects a paycheck, Nintendo probably had some sort of creative control whether they did or not, and Nintendo published the game in Japan. It's hard to make a comparison with some other game because I can't think of any other similar comparisons.

Nintendo does not collect a paycheck. Nintendo was allowed to use Sonic in SSBB in exchange for Sega using Mario in Mario and Sonic at the Olympics. 

 


Did you just make that up and does that sound like a fair trade?

MaxwellGT2000 on 20 May 2009
mjc2021 said:
MaxwellGT2000 said:

 

The point of the thread was to have the top 10 selling third party titles, if you're trying to stick to your own logic it's best you put it up there since it's third party not because you don't feel it belongs... it basically ruins any point you tried to make about third parties and the Wii.

As for core gamers that own the Wii wanting GTA and Assassin's Creed I haven't heard much of that, and if they actually played those games they'd know they don't want them either.  The fake GTA on Wii deal made a little noise until about 10 posts in every core Wii player busted it as fake.  Now if they brought Chinatown Wars to Wii Ware that could be pretty awesome since the top down GTAs are the best.

 

Okay... its not 3rd party. It's a 3rd party game that uses a 1st party franchise, Sega could never release it on another console, and Nintendo obviously has a hand in it. Bearing all that in mind it should obviously be amongst 3rd party games.

Wii owners get excited when any game that doesn't look like crap comes to the Wii. Conduit is a great example. GTA and Assassin's Creed would get a lot of hype on the Wii although I don't know if they'd live up to sales expectations. DS owners were boasting about Chinatown Wars and Wii owners want a GTA as well.

 

It's third party, SEGA makes the money off the game, it was made by SEGA, if what you say should go then Fallout 3/GTAIV should be taken off the list since MS had a hand in bringing exclusive DLC to the 360, they make money off selling DLC on their system, they're making a check, therefore it no longer counts as third party.

The Wii owners are more excited about an exclusive shooter, built from the ground up, and has amazing PC-ish controls.  Not because it's supposed to look as good or better then a HD game, period.  Not many boasted about Chinatown wars until the videos started to come out and reviews started to describe how awesome it is, at first people didn't know what to make of it...



MaxwellGT2000 - "Does the amount of times you beat it count towards how hardcore you are?"

Wii Friend Code - 5882 9717 7391 0918 (PM me if you add me), PSN - MaxwellGT2000, XBL - BlkKniteCecil, MaxwellGT2000

mjc2021 on 20 May 2009
Bobbuffalo said:

"Core gamers that own a Wii are dying for games like GTA and Assassin's Creed"

Actually that's far from truth. Yes we like to hear those games coming but we don't die for them. And actually we would prefer  other BETTER games of course, like RE5. I won't deny that there are many wii owners that would love to see one of those but not as you describe it. That's just typical HDfanboy BS.

For example, my friend who owns an xbox360 loves Mario Kart and he would like to see a simmilar game on his console but he is not dying for it. He can choose from other games. The same with Wii owners. If we don't have one of those titles we have lots of better games to chose. Just because YOU like those games doesn't means everybody should.


And yes MAYBE 1st party games sell better than 3d parties....but if I have to chose between the retarded Madworld and the great Galaxy..well that¡s not that hard to think ;)

The logic behind your list and topic is too dellusional. You try to make a point twisting the facts. You don't like the wii? fine. Life goes on. What's the deal with all these wiihate threads (yes it is don't hide it you don't fool anyobody).

Grow up.


I'm gonna ignore most of you post because it seems pointless to debate.

This thread points out the Wii doesn't move out much more 3rd party software than the HD consoles even though it has a larger userbase. The best selling 3rd party games are mostly crap that you don't care about either. I'm pointing out 3rd party companies shouldn't bother putting AAA games for guy like you when the majority will buy the games you hate. I'm not twisting facts, I'm showing you how it is.



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mjc2021 on 20 May 2009
MaxwellGT2000 said:
mjc2021 said:
MaxwellGT2000 said:

 

The point of the thread was to have the top 10 selling third party titles, if you're trying to stick to your own logic it's best you put it up there since it's third party not because you don't feel it belongs... it basically ruins any point you tried to make about third parties and the Wii.

As for core gamers that own the Wii wanting GTA and Assassin's Creed I haven't heard much of that, and if they actually played those games they'd know they don't want them either.  The fake GTA on Wii deal made a little noise until about 10 posts in every core Wii player busted it as fake.  Now if they brought Chinatown Wars to Wii Ware that could be pretty awesome since the top down GTAs are the best.

 

Okay... its not 3rd party. It's a 3rd party game that uses a 1st party franchise, Sega could never release it on another console, and Nintendo obviously has a hand in it. Bearing all that in mind it should obviously be amongst 3rd party games.

Wii owners get excited when any game that doesn't look like crap comes to the Wii. Conduit is a great example. GTA and Assassin's Creed would get a lot of hype on the Wii although I don't know if they'd live up to sales expectations. DS owners were boasting about Chinatown Wars and Wii owners want a GTA as well.

 

It's third party, SEGA makes the money off the game, it was made by SEGA, if what you say should go then Fallout 3/GTAIV should be taken off the list since MS had a hand in bringing exclusive DLC to the 360, they make money off selling DLC on their system, they're making a check, therefore it no longer counts as third party.

The Wii owners are more excited about an exclusive shooter, built from the ground up, and has amazing PC-ish controls.  Not because it's supposed to look as good or better then a HD game, period.  Not many boasted about Chinatown wars until the videos started to come out and reviews started to describe how awesome it is, at first people didn't know what to make of it...


Brilliant, I can't debate you in regards to Mario & Sonic. MS doesn't own GTA or Fallout 3, those games are also on a competing console, those downloads may eventually be found on a competing console, but MS paying for their EXCLUSIVE RIGHTS is exactly the same. I felt like I proved you wrong... but you always manage to pull something out that makes complete sense. Kudos for you my friend.

Why are you so excited about a game built from the ground up? I'd be more impressed if they used the UT3 engine on the Wii. You think this new IP for The Conduit will be more advanced than that?

When people heard GTA was coming to the DS they got excited. Good reviews obviously get more people interested. End of discussion on that.



MaxwellGT2000 on 20 May 2009
mjc2021 said:
MaxwellGT2000 said:
mjc2021 said:
MaxwellGT2000 said:

 

The point of the thread was to have the top 10 selling third party titles, if you're trying to stick to your own logic it's best you put it up there since it's third party not because you don't feel it belongs... it basically ruins any point you tried to make about third parties and the Wii.

As for core gamers that own the Wii wanting GTA and Assassin's Creed I haven't heard much of that, and if they actually played those games they'd know they don't want them either.  The fake GTA on Wii deal made a little noise until about 10 posts in every core Wii player busted it as fake.  Now if they brought Chinatown Wars to Wii Ware that could be pretty awesome since the top down GTAs are the best.

 

Okay... its not 3rd party. It's a 3rd party game that uses a 1st party franchise, Sega could never release it on another console, and Nintendo obviously has a hand in it. Bearing all that in mind it should obviously be amongst 3rd party games.

Wii owners get excited when any game that doesn't look like crap comes to the Wii. Conduit is a great example. GTA and Assassin's Creed would get a lot of hype on the Wii although I don't know if they'd live up to sales expectations. DS owners were boasting about Chinatown Wars and Wii owners want a GTA as well.

 

It's third party, SEGA makes the money off the game, it was made by SEGA, if what you say should go then Fallout 3/GTAIV should be taken off the list since MS had a hand in bringing exclusive DLC to the 360, they make money off selling DLC on their system, they're making a check, therefore it no longer counts as third party.

The Wii owners are more excited about an exclusive shooter, built from the ground up, and has amazing PC-ish controls.  Not because it's supposed to look as good or better then a HD game, period.  Not many boasted about Chinatown wars until the videos started to come out and reviews started to describe how awesome it is, at first people didn't know what to make of it...

 

Brilliant, I can't debate you in regards to Mario & Sonic. MS doesn't own GTA or Fallout 3, those games are also on a competing console, those downloads may eventually be found on a competing console, but MS paying for their EXCLUSIVE RIGHTS is exactly the same. I felt like I proved you wrong... but you always manage to pull something out that makes complete sense. Kudos for you my friend.

Why are you so excited about a game built from the ground up? I'd be more impressed if they used the UT3 engine on the Wii. You think this new IP for The Conduit will be more advanced than that?

When people heard GTA was coming to the DS they got excited. Good reviews obviously get more people interested. End of discussion on that.

 

LOL love you've missed the sarcasm this whole time... the points I made were more of mocking the asinine logic you used to exclude a third party from your top 10 list that supposedly shows how thrid parties shouldn't put their best efforts on Wii.  Good job.

Why would you be impressed by using the UT3 engine on Wii?  The engine has yet to put out a real visually satisfying game outside of Gears and UT3 :P

Anyway, you simply cannot justify your own logic or exclusion of a game that had 7 million in sales, the reason I assume you will not do this is because it would destroy your argument that third parties cannot achive the record breaking sales they can with a GTA or a Call of Duty 4... it's all very backwards stupid and pointless.  This argument has been put down many times before, Wii had the most software sold for third parties last year despite the huge AAA HD exclusives, and now teams and budgets are moving to Wii, your argument is moot in the large scheme of things...



MaxwellGT2000 - "Does the amount of times you beat it count towards how hardcore you are?"

Wii Friend Code - 5882 9717 7391 0918 (PM me if you add me), PSN - MaxwellGT2000, XBL - BlkKniteCecil, MaxwellGT2000

mjc2021 on 20 May 2009

@ MaxwellGT2000
And I was pointing out why that game in particular shouldn't be included. Either way people bought it because it has a Nintendo franchise. I don't think it should be included, you disagree. Lets leave it to that.


I believe the Wii sold the most 3rd party games last year. I also bet it had the most 3rd party games thanks to a flooded market of shovelware. Sales get spread out, crappy games top the charts, and great games get ignored. That works out perfectly for you and other core gamers.


Do you know how many games use the Unreal 3 Engine? Some other games worth mentioning are Bioshock, Mass Effect, Rainbow Six Vegas, Lost Odyssey, Mirrors Edge, and Too Human. Frankly if you're okay with Wii graphics than you shouldn't be complaining about these games visually. Here's a complete list if you're interested http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Unreal_Engine_games



MaxwellGT2000 on 20 May 2009
mjc2021 said:
@ MaxwellGT2000
And I was pointing out why that game in particular shouldn't be included. Either way people bought it because it has a Nintendo franchise. I don't think it should be included, you disagree. Lets leave it to that.

 

 How do you know this, did you interview each and every person that bought it, did you take a survey?  Do you have any proof at all??? Didn't think so...

 

As for the rest of your post, visuals does not mean how much technology goes into it, something on the SEGA Gen can be more visually pleasing to the eye then some of the games now...  As for the games you listed they're noteworthy for their gameplay, their visuals look generic HD games...



MaxwellGT2000 - "Does the amount of times you beat it count towards how hardcore you are?"

Wii Friend Code - 5882 9717 7391 0918 (PM me if you add me), PSN - MaxwellGT2000, XBL - BlkKniteCecil, MaxwellGT2000

Esa-Petteri on 20 May 2009
MaxwellGT2000 said:
mjc2021 said:
@ MaxwellGT2000
And I was pointing out why that game in particular shouldn't be included. Either way people bought it because it has a Nintendo franchise. I don't think it should be included, you disagree. Lets leave it to that.

 

 How do you know this, did you interview each and every person that bought it, did you take a survey?  Do you have any proof at all??? Didn't think so...

I guess you think it would have sold that much without mario? :)