I'm SURE someone posted this, but I don't get being proud of your sexuality... I admit that I'm proud of my ethnicity and my parent's nationality, but I know consciously that it's illogical.

This is not to say that Don't Ask Don't Tell is justified, but I don't see a reason to go out and shout "I'm Hetro/Homo!!!" It's only sexual preference.

@ Hunter_Alien:
Go Away

@ Akvod
Gay people have been made to hate themselves and everything they do by conservative assholes for centuries, even though it does no harm to anyone, and is a natural inclination. I think its OK for people these days to still be happy that they can feel free to express themselves.

Gay teens still have a high rate of suicide due to bullying and family issues, and It is my DREAM for those kids to feel PROUD of who they are, rather than keeping any feelings they have bottled up inside (and the jumping of a bridge, because their mom told them they are going to burn in some sort of hellish afterlife)

Excuse me anyone who begrudges gay people for expressing themselves, but you can go fark off.

I still don't understand. How does the outside circumstances, make your sexual orientation something to take pride in? I understand that you guys were forced to feel shame, but it doesn't change homosexuality at all. All homosexuality is, is being sexually attracted to someone of the same sex. What's to be proud/shameful of that? Nothing.

And also you can go fuck off (we're adults/young adults now, no need to use words like fark. Replacing the actual word doesn't actually do anything, because I know you meant to say "fuck". That's another rant though...). I made it clear that I wasn't against homosexuals saying they're gay out in public (or more specifically, in the military). I just find it illogical to do so in the first place.

On a side note, I also find it illogical to be proud of a ethnicity and nationality. People who do celebrate these two, usually say "These people from my ethnicity/nationality, did this cool thing". And whoever did that cool thing, should be proud of themselves. But what the fuck have the other people done? Nothing. If I grew a mustache, does that mean I can take credit for what other mustached people did? No.

I find it... not necessarily paradoxical, hypocritical, etc... but there's something weird in saying there's nothing shameful about your ethnicity, sexual orientation, etc, but that there's something proud... There's nothing positive, nor negative about these things. Ethnicity is just a few common physical features, and traits. There's nothing proud about having big/small eyes, white/black skin. Sexual orientation is whether or not if you want to fuck people of the opposite, same, or both sexes.

What's there to be proud of wanting to stick your penis in a guy, as opposed to a girl (and the same thing for lesbians)? Nothing, just as there's nothing to be proud of if you're straight.

It's right to spread awareness of the sufferings and opression homosexuals had to go through, and get these people to not be ashamed anymore. But just like the Black Power movement (which I hate... I don't consider myself Japanese, even if I am ethnicly, because I was born here, socialized here [US], and have a culture and heritage here. Heritage isn't something you can just go and get, nor tied to your genes.), it's stupid for then everyone to be all emotionally riled up and be proud of it. That's the dangerous thing that leads to nationalism, and SUPERIORITY COMPLEX (we're the perfect race, and so we should eliminate sub-humans... sound familiar?... and how did it start?... after a period of depression and inferiority complex).

========================

Conclusion: Be out, be happy, and hell go shout out that you're gay. Don't be proud of the fact that you're gay, and don't start identifying with and grouping with people due to their sexuality (only hang out with gay people). That's self segregation, and only leads to prolong the divide between subcultures. It's also illogical, to adopt certain styles of clothing, philosophies, etc over being a certain sexual orientation.

I am an Atheist, but I have absolutely nothing in common with other Atheists. Some of them might be anti-theists, some of them might Marxists, some of them might be capitalists, etc. I don't take pride in my lack of belief, but rather the things I did in life... which are little, hence why I'm not that proud of myself, and strive to make something for myself, rather than being complacent and smiling over something that's not worthy of pride.

lol wut?

Uhhh, Akvod, I was trying to be congenial in my response to not upset anyone, like yourself.

Just because you, a nobody, do not agree with the pride others hold in themselves and feel that you have to express yourself accordingly on the Internet, does not make a bad thing. and saying things like "Boohoo people with pride in themselves are nazis." is just silly.

Or should I stop feeling proud because you wrote a huge ranting rigmarole in a VgChartz forum post, claiming gays are just about sex, and that ALL ethnic people are the same as you and do not feel proud about it, and that you are of superior moral fibre and we should all strive to be little Akvod clones?

I think you forget, gay people still get publicly degraded in the US and many other countries.
I can't remember the last time I saw a politician on TV talking about how they disagree with Black people, do you? It happens to gay people all the time.

I know nothing I can say will change your small minded attitude to the matter, where anyone who seemingly believes anything different to you MUST be incorrect, but I need you to understand that just because you feel strongly about something, does not make it true.

I say i am proud, and I love to see others who are. I am making no judgments on gay people who do not feel the same way. I certainly am not trying to claim that EVERYONE should be proud, BUT i can not stand by when someone claims that nobody should be proud, "because they said so (in about 400 words)". Trying to push your beliefs on others is just wrong and generally causes panties to be thoroughly twisted!

@ outlawauron

the fact that gay people could be fired, cast-off socially, lynched in the street because they are gay, and forced to hide it?

1. You were trying to be congenial, by saying "Fuck off"? (No replacing a word, censoring it, or altering it doesn't change anything).

2. If I am a nobody, but I was gay, would I have a reason to be proud of myself? See how illogical that is? And right there, that means that the gay version of me will be superior (since he has a quality to be proud of).

What do you mean?

2b. I don't think its silly. Holding pride in something such as race, and on the converse, looking down somebody based on race (or other worthless qualities) have been the basis for so many wars, genocides, and illogical tragic acts. It's not just Nazis. I can say KKK and white supremacy. I can say Black Panthers and black supremacy. Holy wars, manifest destinity, etc, etc.

3. Homosexuality IS about sex. Are you trying to say all Homosexuals are united by some other qualities and beliefs? All gays have to be dressed in "gay fashion", be liberal, etc? That's called stereotyping, and a exlusioairy attitude (I saw on CNN, a few weeks ago, a gay conservative ranting against neo cons). Homosexuality is simply being sexually attracted to the same sex. That's it. It doesn't mean you're flamboyant (hence people made up the word metrosexual... which I don't get [the -sexual] part of the word), it doesn't mean you're liberal. Just like I said, if you read my post just as I'm doing for you, how I don't share anything else in common with other Atheists, other than the lack of belief in a god.

All ethnic people ARE the same, at least in terms of their consciousness/"soul" edit: (In which I mean, they're a blank slate, and that if 2 people of different ethnicities were socialized the same way, they will be the same, and if there's 2 people of the same ethnicities, but they were socialized differently, they'll be different). Are African Americans and Africans (which themselves are diverse) the same in terms of culture, values, etc? No. They've been socialized in different socities, raised in different cultures, etc. If you would have taken an orphan baby from each respective country, and have them switch places the African baby will be an American, and the American baby would have been African, in terms of socialization.

I do agree that race, due to the fact that there is racism, and different treatment of others, due to their race (and therefore socializing some people differently from others). But it's not biological at all. Edit: If you take an African and European child, and have them grow up in the same part of America with similar parents, they'll be very similar in terms of culture, religion, values, etc.

4. I don't know where you got the moral superiority thing from... this is about LOGIC. I do strive people to be more logical. Do I consider myself to be very logical? No. I occasionaly make some irrational PS3 fanboy posts, and I have my own racist beliefs. I don't consider myself perfect. If I were to ask you to replicate me though, it would be in that you strive to be as rationale as possible, like I do.

5. I wasn't disagreeing with gay people. That's stupid, because, just like I said before, I gay people have (or should have) their own diverse philosophies and beliefs. There's no reason for a gay person to feel obligated to change his beleifs in accordance to fellow gay people (that includes pride). As for gay people being repressed, yes it still occurs, and it's tragic, and I do appreciate your intentions of making others not feel bad about themselves, for something they shouldn't be. But I disagree when you take it a step further and have them illogically make them feel good over something that isn't good (nor bad). All you're doing is an appeal to emotion, just like I (controversial statement here, please don't respond to this part, as it'll derail the thread) feel the zionist movement did with Israel after the horrific aftermath of the holocaust with the UN and Britain.

6. What do you know anything about me? Have we talked to each other before? Have you befriended me, or be close to me and know what I'm like? I'm not some fundamentalist who won't accept to be told he's wrong, nor change his beliefs.

7. There's nothing wrong in trying to say one's opinion and try to pursuade other people and having them see your position... just like what you said in 6. Now you're just being a hypocrite and adding positive adjectives and adding positive nouns/verbs to things that refer to yourself, and negative ones to me (Push your beliefs/Chang your mind). I also gave REASONS to my opinions, not because "I said so". I find it EXTREMELY rude, that you refuse to read my post, and respond to specific parts to it, when I took the time and effort to read your post and respond to it.

I thought you wanted to see every gay person to be proud of their sexual orientation? I said that people shouldn't be proud of something they didn't even work for, nor is not impressive. You're proud because you accomplished something that's hard for you (whether you were able to go to your first workout in a while, or you finally were able to hit that target weight), not because you were born with a sexual orientation, skin color, family name, etc.

No, that's not what is laughable. You just lodged the prejudice and all the bad things that have happened against gays solely on conservatives.

Which is laughable. Especially being that the meaning behind conservatives has changed half a dozen times at least.

I don't consider myself conservative (I know too little about the economy, I have to wait until college), by I feel sorry for those conservatives, the ones who were in the North East, considered high class, intellectual, and calm, are lumped together with the Neo-conservatives.

There never was an issue that has split so many groups like homosexuality has. I feel you're also wrong to say that all Neo-conservatives (I'm assuming you're talking about hardcore Christians and church people) but that still isn't a fair representation. There are many churches and Christians that stand against the "God Hates Fags" people. (Not to mention the rise of gay preists in the Catholic church)