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Forums - General - FBI Official Involved in Torture Interrogations Says They Did Not Work

pakidan101 on 30 April 2009
akuma587 said:

Even if it does work, IT DOESN'T MATTER. Its wrong. Nuking the Middle East would be a great way to solve a lot of our problems. But you know why we don't do it? Because it is wrong.

And does it even make us safer?  How many people, including those who are not terrorists, have we encouraged to hate America because of things like this?  How many terrorists did these policies help create?  Is that effective counter-terrorism?  Is making people hate us more a good way to prevent future terrorist attacks?

 

No, it doesn't make us safer. But it sure did increase the profits of the arms market...



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Legend11 on 30 April 2009
MrBubbles said:
i think it does matter. this article asserts that it wasnt working. but if it wasnt, the logical course would be to find something that did.(the same reasoning that would have brought them to this in the first place)

 

The fact that the FBI doesn't use it (even when they had the chance like in this case) and their level of professionalism says a lot.



akuma587 on 30 April 2009
MrBubbles said:
i think it does matter. this article asserts that it wasnt working. but if it wasnt, the logical course would be to find something that did.(the same reasoning that would have brought them to this in the first place)

You are assuming that the choice to use torture in the first place was a logical one.

 



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The Ghost of RubangB on 30 April 2009

The article says there are 2 ways to get information. One works and is not torture, and one doesn't work and is torture. This is written by a man who has personally used both methods.



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MrBubbles on 30 April 2009

perhaps a few individuals would be interested in making those people suffer just to have them suffer. but the suggestion that policy makers and an intelligence agency to continue to authorize/use something that wasnt being effective seems absurd.

its one thing to make absurd comments trying to justify the actions as something other than what they are(intent making something they had defined as torture become not torture), but to commit the actions is different.



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hsrob on 30 April 2009
Legend11 said:
Tyrannical said:
The Russians could have made him talk.


Waterboarding and similar techniques go against everything good that America is supposed to stand for and yet you support them.  If you hate it so much why don't you move to China or Russia or whatever country that it more in line with your thinking (no offence to any good Chinese and Russians citizens reading this that are against torture).

I agree but i have to say that at least the Chinese government isn't hypocritical about it.  When it comes to human rights it's China's belief that other countries should just mind their own business when it comes to it's own internal affairs, and in turn they don't preach to other countries.  You can't openly criticise other countries for human rights violations on one hand and then try to justify torture on the other.



MrBubbles on 30 April 2009
akuma587 said:
MrBubbles said:
i think it does matter. this article asserts that it wasnt working. but if it wasnt, the logical course would be to find something that did.(the same reasoning that would have brought them to this in the first place)

You are assuming that the choice to use torture in the first place was a logical one.

 

 

i think its very logical.  use all means at your disposal to best protect your people.  the nukes, for example... in this situation, would definitely be something of a last resort.



"I like my steaks how i like my women.  Bloody and all over my face"

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pakidan101 on 30 April 2009
MrBubbles said:
perhaps a few individuals would be interested in making those people suffer just to have them suffer. but the suggestion that policy makers and an intelligence agency to continue to authorize/use something that wasnt being effective seems absurd.

its one thing to make absurd comments trying to justify the actions as something other than what they are(intent making something they had defined as torture become not torture), but to commit the actions is different.

 

This is what happens when fear clouds one's judgement...you commit actions you shouldn't have done, even when your reasons is because you want to protect that which you love.



Explanation of sig:

I am a Pakistani.....my name is Dan....how hard is that? (Don't ask about the 101...apparantely there are more of me out there....)

Tyrannical on 30 April 2009
akuma587 said:

Even if it does work, IT DOESN'T MATTER. Its wrong. Nuking the Middle East would be a great way to solve a lot of our problems. But you know why we don't do it? Because it is wrong.

And does it even make us safer?  How many people, including those who are not terrorists, have we encouraged to hate America because of things like this?  How many terrorists did these policies help create?  Is that effective counter-terrorism?  Is making people hate us more a good way to prevent future terrorist attacks?

 

 Instead of keeping related posts in one topic, you decide to create a new one claiming torture doesn't work. I disagree.

Now you say it doesn't matter if it does work. Well, which is it? Any point discussing the morality of torture relies on wether it does or does not work.

And, you are stealing my hard earned VG chartz money by needlessly making duplicate topics.



Yet, today, America's leaders are reenacting every folly that brought these great powers [Russia, Germany, and Japan] to ruin -- from arrogance and hubris, to assertions of global hegemony, to imperial overstretch, to trumpeting new 'crusades,' to handing out war guarantees to regions and countries where Americans have never fought before. We are piling up the kind of commitments that produced the greatest disasters of the twentieth century.
 — Pat Buchanan – A Republic, Not an Empire

Galaki on 30 April 2009

Torture works on TV shows. It must work IRL, too!

It's the politicians' experience on torture.



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