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Forums - General - Better for all, Capitalism or Socialism?

vlad321 on 12 April 2009
Kasz216 said:
NintendoMan said:
You don't make anyone happy. Happiness is a lie, one of those words that doesn't really mean anything. Being happy is useless, it doesn't help.

All research done in regards to productivity would prove you wrong there.

Improving happiness is one of the biggest ways to improve productivity.

 

 

Too bad people in the US aren't happy at all:

http://www.theroadtothehorizon.org/2009/01/worlds-most-happiest-countries-and.html

Didn't people in Denmark pay close to 75% of their income to taxes?



Tag(thx fkusumot) - "Yet again I completely fail to see your point..."

HD vs Wii, PC vs HD: http://www.vgchartz.com/forum/thread.php?id=93374

Why Regenerating Health is a crap game mechanic: http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=3986420

gamrReview's broken review scores: http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=4170835

 

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TheRealMafoo on 12 April 2009
tombi123 said:
TheRealMafoo said:
tombi123 said:
"A Resource-Based Economy is a system in which all goods and services are available without the use of money, credits, barter or any other system of debt or servitude. All resources become the common heritage of all of the inhabitants, not just a select few. The premise upon which this system is based is that the Earth is abundant with plentiful resource; our practice of rationing resources through monetary methods is irrelevant and counter productive to our survival."

 

Just out of curiosity, in this system, how would anything get done, and who would do it?

What's the motivation to work?

 

The majority of work is done by robots. Money isn't the only motivator. (Proper) Scientists don't work for the money, its finding out the unknown that motivates them.

 

Even if the Scientist doesn't work for money, the tools he uses only exist because someone does.

A computer today allows us to calculate things that would take a thousand years without one. Without capitalism, those computers would not exist.

 

As for the robot thing...

you must be talking about a futuristic world with technology we have yet to discover. That technology would only be discovered in a Capitalistic society. (or at a minimum, orders of magnitude sooner)



Kasz216 on 12 April 2009
vlad321 said:
Kasz216 said:
NintendoMan said:
You don't make anyone happy. Happiness is a lie, one of those words that doesn't really mean anything. Being happy is useless, it doesn't help.

All research done in regards to productivity would prove you wrong there.

Improving happiness is one of the biggest ways to improve productivity.

 

 

Too bad people in the US aren't happy at all:

http://www.theroadtothehorizon.org/2009/01/worlds-most-happiest-countries-and.html

Didn't people in Denmark pay close to 75% of their income to taxes?

You missed "one of".

Note that the USA is still a major leader when it comes to technological advancments in a lot of fields.  For example medical technology.

Also comparing relative happiness is a silly thing to do.  Happiness studies can only really done interperson.

As people have different definitions of "Happy".

Edit: (also looking at the report... a lot of socialist states are below the US even if you wished to judge happiness like that.  Which is stupid.)



tombi123 on 12 April 2009
Kasz216 said:
tombi123 said:
TheRealMafoo said:
tombi123 said:
"A Resource-Based Economy is a system in which all goods and services are available without the use of money, credits, barter or any other system of debt or servitude. All resources become the common heritage of all of the inhabitants, not just a select few. The premise upon which this system is based is that the Earth is abundant with plentiful resource; our practice of rationing resources through monetary methods is irrelevant and counter productive to our survival."

 

Just out of curiosity, in this system, how would anything get done, and who would do it?

What's the motivation to work?

 

The majority of work is done by robots. Money isn't the only motivator. (Proper) Scientists don't work for the money, its finding out the unknown that motivates them.

That used to be the case.

Nowadays i'd highly disagree with you. The monetary gains of science have far outweighed the scientific discovery aspects in most scientists today.

Very few scientists work in theoretical unprofitable fields compared to the ones that produce money making stuff.

 

I blame capitalism



NintendoMan on 12 April 2009

@therealmafoo - see you chickened out there, go on, who gets to be in the 80% that live and live and who gets to be the 20% that dies, don't be so pathetic, choose. I personally would go for either everyone gets off somehow (ad hoc lifeboats, take turns in them) or everyone dies. Now you choose, and why is not picking worse? Why do 20% on board get condemned to death just because of a lack of lifeboats. I bet you'd try to save your own skin.



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luinil on 12 April 2009

I am feeling some pent up anger in NintendoMan's world view... everything is meaningless unless it can be shared equally with all.

Kasz does make at least me happy from time to time with his awesomeness in debates. Happiness is not meaningless. Without it there is no motivation. You have to have the pursuit of happiness in order to make progress. Without that pursuit, there will be no progress as people will not be motivated to make themselves or others happy.


OT: I agree with Mafoo and Kasz on this issue.



Luinil - Marisa (FE:SS). She's calm, collected, and really likes swords. (Courtesy of Words of Wisdom)
Tag: luinil - "Liberalism is a mental disorder." - Thanks fkusumot!
Kasz216 on 12 April 2009
tombi123 said:
Kasz216 said:
tombi123 said:
TheRealMafoo said:
tombi123 said:
"A Resource-Based Economy is a system in which all goods and services are available without the use of money, credits, barter or any other system of debt or servitude. All resources become the common heritage of all of the inhabitants, not just a select few. The premise upon which this system is based is that the Earth is abundant with plentiful resource; our practice of rationing resources through monetary methods is irrelevant and counter productive to our survival."

 

Just out of curiosity, in this system, how would anything get done, and who would do it?

What's the motivation to work?

 

The majority of work is done by robots. Money isn't the only motivator. (Proper) Scientists don't work for the money, its finding out the unknown that motivates them.

That used to be the case.

Nowadays i'd highly disagree with you. The monetary gains of science have far outweighed the scientific discovery aspects in most scientists today.

Very few scientists work in theoretical unprofitable fields compared to the ones that produce money making stuff.

 

I blame capitalism

Yeah.  Its annoying.

On the one hand science advances a LOT quicker despite being more complicated.

On the other hand... you wonder if it's going towards the right fields.  Medical technology is rapidly rapidly improving... but when was the last time anything was cured?



TheRealMafoo on 12 April 2009
vlad321 said:
Kasz216 said:
NintendoMan said:
You don't make anyone happy. Happiness is a lie, one of those words that doesn't really mean anything. Being happy is useless, it doesn't help.

All research done in regards to productivity would prove you wrong there.

Improving happiness is one of the biggest ways to improve productivity.

 

 

Too bad people in the US aren't happy at all:

http://www.theroadtothehorizon.org/2009/01/worlds-most-happiest-countries-and.html

Didn't people in Denmark pay close to 75% of their income to taxes?

 

It does not say what the difference is between #1 and #23. Based on the color chart, we are in the maximum category. not sure how that says we are unhappy.

 



vlad321 on 12 April 2009
Kasz216 said:
vlad321 said:
Kasz216 said:
NintendoMan said:
You don't make anyone happy. Happiness is a lie, one of those words that doesn't really mean anything. Being happy is useless, it doesn't help.

All research done in regards to productivity would prove you wrong there.

Improving happiness is one of the biggest ways to improve productivity.

 

 

Too bad people in the US aren't happy at all:

http://www.theroadtothehorizon.org/2009/01/worlds-most-happiest-countries-and.html

Didn't people in Denmark pay close to 75% of their income to taxes?

You missed "one of".

Note that the USA is still a major leader when it comes to technological advancments in a lot of fields.  For example medical technology.

Also comparing relative happiness is a silly thing to do.  Happiness studies can only really done interperson.

As people have different definitions of "Happy".

 

 

Nice way of invalidating the study, thugh without going into psychology you won't be able to get out just by saying it's intangible. Read the short summary of the study, it explains a bit how it works. Currently more socialitic governments have happier people. Go figure. Also maybe you didn't see that SWB stood for subjective well-being meaning that yes, everyone depends on their own type of "Happy."



Tag(thx fkusumot) - "Yet again I completely fail to see your point..."

HD vs Wii, PC vs HD: http://www.vgchartz.com/forum/thread.php?id=93374

Why Regenerating Health is a crap game mechanic: http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=3986420

gamrReview's broken review scores: http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=4170835

 

TheRealMafoo on 12 April 2009
NintendoMan said:
@therealmafoo - see you chickened out there, go on, who gets to be in the 80% that live and live and who gets to be the 20% that dies, don't be so pathetic, choose. I personally would go for either everyone gets off somehow (ad hoc lifeboats, take turns in them) or everyone dies. Now you choose, and why is not picking worse? Why do 20% on board get condemned to death just because of a lack of lifeboats. I bet you'd try to save your own skin.

 

I am the one that wants 8 more out of 10 to live then you, and I am the one that wants to save my own skin? If I was in that situation, I would make sure the most people who could get on a life boat could. Then i would look at how to save my own life.

I say it does not mater how you pick, because I don't care what 8 out of 10 live. Pick it based on race, age, sex, height, hair color, random number, who gives a shit.

More people living is better. Period.