puffy:their ultimate goal is to get these new gamers to play the traditional Nintendo franchises i.e. they want to upstream these guys.

                               This is the overall point that I'm trying to get across. You said it perfectly. That's why I'm saying the demand for hardcore games will increase in the future and Nintendo will deliver.

Demonik, you don't need perception so much to realize where Nintento is going. I know this has been overstated, and as such people stopped taking it seriously. But here's a fact: Nintendo has changed. How have they changed?

Two things. First they are now a Blue Ocean company, and second a disruption company. Cammie Dunaway, Denise Kaigler, many of these new employees were put there because of their experience with disruptive strategies. This gives you a layout from where you can actually draw some expectation of where Nintendo is going.

I'm a big advocate of, and I've seen some other well informed people make this point as well, that 2009 will be the peak of the hardcore outcry. Bigger than 2008. The reason for that is the hardcore is still in the denial process, because Nintendo has not yet quite shown their hand, people's imaginations are running wild. And when they see what Nintendo's really working on as far as established franchises like the new Mario and Zelda, they'll probably freak out.

Nintendo is going forward, not backward. Forward, in their new paradigm, is not turning their franchises around back into a box, but to further expand them. Yes, the next step is to gradually attempt to include as many hardcore gamers as possible and create an overlap of both casual and hardcore. But, that does not include gratuitous catering of hardcore demands, on the contrary. The portion that could overlap will have to be convinced, much like casuals will have to be convinced to swim upstream. It's not necessarily that these franchises will be downgraded, but it will be a NEW kind of Core.

It's like the King of Hyrule said at the end of Wind Waker. "Give these children a land, but it will not be Hyrule". At first this will not seem like something totally desirable for the current Core, because it will be different.

Back when Wind Waker was unveiled at Spaceworld 2001 there was an outcry, but eventually when the game was shown in playable form at E3 2002, gradually the press was good, impressions were good, reviews were excellent(40/40 on Famitsu for instance), and gradually a portion of people were convinced. With Phantom Hourglass the touch controls were at first repelled, but as people got a hands-on many were convinced.

Expect that to be a microcosm of what's coming for Nintendo.

@Azelover:        You know what..... I agree with you. What you said makes absolute sense. I've heard about Nintendo being a Blue Ocean company before, but I never really took the time to dig deeper into what that meant. I appreciate your input.

@ Demonik: That's exactly what they're trying to do and that's the part of your argument in in full support of, they'll always be releasing downstream games to bring in new audiences, look at DS for example, Rhythm Heaven just released didn't it? or will soon.. but anyway yeah I think I explained it pretty well and excellent first thread might I add

@puffy: Yeah, your explanation was right on the dot. PERFECT

That was a very good first post.

I probably will be buying the Conduit. I was going to buy it for certain, then I heard that there was no splitscreen multiplayer. Now I may buy it, or I may wait for Red Steel 2

@scottie:  THANK YOU!!

You're welcome

Can anyone tell me how to put sentences and stuff at the bottom of my comments and banners and stuff? I have no clue as to how to do that. The help would be greatly appreciated!!

Is anyone still there? Can you hear me?