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Forums - Gaming Discussion - OMG! it the next ZELDA!!!!

BTW...does this mean link is nakkid!!!

...o_o



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Gnizmo said:

Khuutra said:

I did, though. I was primarily referring to the first paragraph because the second one has nothing to do with puzzle difficulty except for the assertion that they're all solved with the same item in a given dungeon.

"$10 says that the next Zelda won't be any harder. Having the game solve every puzzle for you would suck. It would be demeaning, demoralizing, and probably force most people to stop playing. Why anyone would suspect an increase in difficulty to come from this is beyond me."

Hence my question. The game doesn't solve every puzzle for you. You have an option to see how it's done, to keep players who can't do it from being frustrated. How does this not free them up to bump the difficulty, exactly?

I'm not exactly sure where you got the implication that I hadn't read your post.

 Because you ignore the part I highlighted. The hint system is widely accepted as being a concession to the casual player so they can help beat the game. Currently the game is, presumably, not so easy that the target audience for thsi change could beat the game without some form of help. Why then would you make it even more difficult and risk them not being able to solve the majority of puzzles? The hint system is an appeal to casuals, but if you bump the difficulty too much you force them to use the system constantly, and they are no longer playing the game.

Why would the average player even care?



like I said before, Zelda has had a hint system since Ocarina, I wouldent be surprised if in the final version HINT is repalced with NAVI



Sky Render said:
You know, I never have understood people complaining about the inclusion of entirely optional hint systems or Easy modes. It's not like the presence of those options somehow reduces the value of the game. You're not obligated to use it if you don't want to. And of course, saying that a game shouldn't have these sorts of options because you don't want to see more people getting into the game is just plain counter-logical and selfish.

 It is the same logic that is used to whine about casual games being made in general. If it is no targetted at them specifically then it is worthless. People should conform to their standards and skill level. Otherwise they can't be as elitist and use the excuse of "they just suck," to explain why someone might not like the same hobbies/style of game.



Starcraft 2 ID: Gnizmo 229

Khuutra said:

Why would the average player even care?

 I am in awe at your ability to ask questions that make absolutely no sense at all. What on earth are you refering to exactly? Where did the average player caring about a hint system come into play? Are you asking why the average player wouldn't care about having the game played for them?



Starcraft 2 ID: Gnizmo 229

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Gnizmo said:

Khuutra said:

Why would the average player even care?

 I am in awe at your ability to ask questions that make absolutely no sense at all. What on earth are you refering to exactly? Where did the average player caring about a hint system come into play? Are you asking why the average player wouldn't care about having the game played for them?

There's a difference between being shown how to do something and actually having something done for you; the patent outlines the former, not the latter.

So, yes. The average player is the kind of person who would use a strategy guide for a really tough puzzle anyway. Why would they care about clicking an in-game box to have it shown to them rather than going elsewhere for the hint?



Khuutra said:

There's a difference between being shown how to do something and actually having something done for you; the patent outlines the former, not the latter.

So, yes. The average player is the kind of person who would use a strategy guide for a really tough puzzle anyway. Why would they care about clicking an in-game box to have it shown to them rather than going elsewhere for the hint?

 You would have a point if the average player had been using strategy guides to beat Zelda games. The current line of thinking at Nintendo is that is not happening. It is not happening because the games are too hard, by their logic. So where in this does it become a good idea for Nintendo to up the difficulty of the game?



Starcraft 2 ID: Gnizmo 229

Gnizmo said:

Khuutra said:

There's a difference between being shown how to do something and actually having something done for you; the patent outlines the former, not the latter.

So, yes. The average player is the kind of person who would use a strategy guide for a really tough puzzle anyway. Why would they care about clicking an in-game box to have it shown to them rather than going elsewhere for the hint?

 You would have a point if the average player had been using strategy guides to beat Zelda games. The current line of thinking at Nintendo is that is not happening. It is not happening because the games are too hard, by their logic. So where in this does it become a good idea for Nintendo to up the difficulty of the game?

According to Nintendo, the average player never beats Zelda games in th first place, they just give up partway through.

What say you now?



Khuutra said:

According to Nintendo, the average player never beats Zelda games in th first place, they just give up partway through.

What say you now?

It is absolutely uncanny. Everytime you try to ask a question it makes almost no sense. It is absolutely remarkable. What I would say is how is that even close to a point against what I said? I almost included that exact line of text in my last reply. I would further say given the expanding nature of the hint system that difficulty would be seen as a primary cause of why people quit. Nintendo isn't in the business of making hard games save for the Fire Emblem series. They make fun games that tend to get easier to get into with each iteration.

 



Starcraft 2 ID: Gnizmo 229

Gnizmo said:

Khuutra said:

According to Nintendo, the average player never beats Zelda games in th first place, they just give up partway through.

What say you now?

It is absolutely uncanny. Everytime you try to ask a question it makes almost no sense. It is absolutely remarkable. What I would say is how is that even close to a point against what I said? I almost included that exact line of text in my last reply. I would further say given the expanding nature of the hint system that difficulty would be seen as a primary cause of why people quit. Nintendo isn't in the business of making hard games save for the Fire Emblem series. They make fun games that tend to get easier to get into with each iteration.

I know. At this point I'm messing with you: the ease with which you become exasperated with me is almost uncanny.

However, in the first place, giving people an option which will allow them to complete a game is much more likely to get them to finish, especially when it's easy-access. If they can see how it's done without making any particular effort, they're mcuh more likely to try to finish it for themselves. That's reflexive - and if it's applied to puzzles, it doesn't matter how hard they are, if we assume that about half the userbase would never finish the gamee anyway because they're too hard at their curent level. If you think they're adding in a hint system and making the puzzles easier, I don't know what to tell you except for "this seems very unlikely".

And no, Nintendo's games don't tend to get easier with each iteration. The environmental puzzles in every Zelda since Ocarina of Time... well, actually, since the first one (I am amazed by how much easier the puzzles in LttP were) have been much harder, and Phantom Hourglass harder still. The same holds true for Mario games, and pretty much every other series: they've been getting progressively harder since the N64 days, not easier.