exactly.. while i agree there will be an affect on console sales.. we just saw Wii break the record for consoles sold in a non-Holiday month last month (ie. October)..

While I agree economy and people struggling for cash is an important factor, i'd like to add another to the mix.. 

The Wii is consistently selling out, and my feeling is, despite quite a large proportion of people struggling with the economy atm, there are still enough people out there with a stable enough income to spend $250 on a console this Christmas.. however, this is all on the basis that there is more than enough demand for the product in comparison to the supply, which has yet to be seen. 

To be honest, my opinion and prediction is that there will easily be at least 3,000,000 prospective buyers in America with stable enough incomes to purchase a Wii this Christmas

@Squilliam:

 I'll have to read your response more carefully, later. Right now I have to go. So, don't expect any more responses from me anytime soon.

I still say sales of a direct competitor matter. If you were running a gaming company, you wouldn't think they didn't matter. You'd want to exploit any angle you could. It seems like we might be on the same page on some issues. Like online vs offline. I really think online should always be seen as a an extention of offline and not a superior alternative. It sounds like maybe you prefer PC gaming.  For me, I get my Ninty gaming and motion gaming from the Wii (and the DS for that 1st part) and the PC has it's own gaming plus most of the same style of gaming that's found on HD systems. Which is really too bad. I think they try so hard to be tv pc's, that they forget what makes consoles so great.

1. The legitimate issue with the HD consoles is that they really did launch immature. However thats been the model of console development for a long time so you can hardly fault them for that. The tools were simply not there and quite frankly the PS3 would have floundered completely if the tools and software used on the 360 were incompatible with it. Im more for pushing development and striking forward whenever possible and in fact I considered the ideal Nintendo console next generation could very well run on Microsoft developed tools and console hardware with the consumer side being developed by Nintendo. Whilst it may not happen, the thought of a Wii HD using 1gb of GDDR5 memory, a 4 core Power PC architecture with the cache/memory subsystems tweaked and utilizing a more modern direct3d 11 compatible GPU (The current 360 GPU is somewhat direct 3d 11 and 10 compatible but its best described as direct3d 9.5 in terms of features.) would answer the HD question with most likely the most efficiency and still give Nintendo their desired packaging constraints and would require a chassi no bigger than the current Wii so long as a flash based system was used.

2. My TV is mounted on a swivel arm, and its at a particular height and the seats are aranged so the only good angles available are from seats which require me to point my arm at an odd angle as they are too close to the TV. Whilst its brilliant for movie watching, its not so hot for the Wii. Still don't get the whole idea of Blu-Ray though, I download bootleg episodes at 350 mb each from torrents (no local tv unfortunately) and I still don't feel like im missing out on any detail over DVD/Blu Ray.

And yes, I don't need anyone to answer for me.

They have been played the most because they have sold the most, and there are lots of people who never move past those games.  It's like, why is Halo 3 always in the top 2 or 3 Xbox Live games?  Because the most people own it.  it doesn't mean people don't like it or that they don't hate it.  There's just more of them.

And I don't like the insinuation that people who don't think Wii Sports/Play/Carnival Games are particuarly good software are elitist snobs who think only the hardcore is good.

I buy like every Popcap game and play them to death - currently Bejeweled Twist owns my existence. 3 of my top 10 favorite 360 games are very casual XBLA games. I thought Peggle should have been Game of the Year.

The point is that those games are good, while Wii Sports baseball blows. Wii tennis is wildly inconsistent in terms of translating Wiimote motions to the screen. 6 of the 9 Wii Play games are virtually unplayable.

The Wii-mote is fun when used well by its software. Wii Tennis is fun. Wii Bowling is ok. Boxing is fun, if tiring. (LOL) But much of the content of both those discs genuinely sucks.

And isn't it strange that nobody ever disqualifies Halo 3 or GTA IV because so many people own them? These double standards only seem to get applied to one console.

Also, your assumption is wrong. Wii Play's information is on a per person basis, which means it doesn't matter how many units it has sold. According to the Nintendo Channel, the average Wii Play owner has played the game for 9 hours. Pretty good value for $10, and more play time than some full-priced titles get.

@famousringo

No one's disqualifying Halo or GTA.

You're missing the point. Take the Wii-fan glasses off for a second, because I am not dissing the system. I have one.

You and I are saying the same thing. Yes. People play Wii Play a lot. My point is exactly that. There are a lot of people who play it forever and don't buy more stuff.

And that's bad for gaming, because that game is not even close to what games can be or do, on that system or any system. And instead of companies trying to nudge those people to explore further, they are often just trying to make the next clone of that Wii Play and to cash in on the non-discerning buyer.

These developers would have, in the past, been working on something that took a bit more thought to reach a a market.

The Atari 2600 once was thought to be untouchable too, until shovelware buried it like a dead family pet.

 No, you are missing a very large point here. If Halo and Wii Play are comparable in terms of lasting appeal, then they are comparable in terms of effect on other games sales. If you assume people playing it forever is bad for the industry, then you must assume any game that has a similar effect would also be bad for the industry. In other words, you are arguing that Halo 3 is bad for the industry because people play it forever and never move on. If you disagree with that sentiment, then you also disagree with Wii Play being bad since it is the exact same effect.

 Edit: Atari 2600 was not killed by shovelware. The games released simply did not work which made consumers wary of buying games and the console. The reason the draconian rules Nintendo enforced were tolerated early on was because that was what saved the industry by insuring every game worked.

I think you're missing the point fastyxx.  Someone pointed out to you already that the Wii has a higher attach rate than the PS3.  If what you say is true about people playing Wii Play forever and not buying more stuff, why is the attach rate so high!? 

But you're comparing it to the PS3.  Why not compare it to the 360 in this regard, then?  

It also depends on which attach rate we are looking at.  Many published attach rates are games PLUS accessories.  Other attach rates, like the one posted on VGChartz each week, includes Wii Sports, which inflates the rate by 1 for every user.

@Gnizmo

Halo 3 is an entirely different beast than Wii Sports/Play.  It's not packed in, for one.  And if you look at the gamercards of the people playing, they are playing other games too - other than the estimated 15-20k "alt accounts" Bungie estimates are double ups in a given week - people playing under two or more distinct tags.  The people playing that forever are online gamers that are going to play other games - they just keep coming back to Halo a few times a week.  It's a different breed.

Wii has a high attach rate because people ARE buying first party games, GH3, Legos and Sonic and Mario.  We already established that.  

The original point that led to all this discussion was that it's amazing that there really are no breakout hits on a platform with 16 million American users.  There are good games that should appeal to a wider audience and no one (relatively speaking) buys them.

Worldwide what are the biggest selling 3rd party new IP exclusive (or originally exclusive) for Wii?

Carnival Games (2.3 million), We Ski (730k), and Game Party(1.4 million)

Isn't that a little sad?  Here's the list.

There's just nothing on there - for a system that's supposed to revolutionize how we play games?  That list sucks in content and 3rd party sales.  We can agree to disagree but that list just does suck for anyone not getting a piece of the profits.