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Forums - Gaming Discussion - First AAA JRPG of this generation?

I would have to say Lost Odyssey is the first triple-AAA JRPG of this generation.
I would say FFXIII but we know nothing of this game yet, so currently its Lost Odyssey or now Valkyrie Chronicles.



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Impulsivity said:
shio said:
The JRPG sub-genre is dieing. In the 90's it was far more popular than WRPGs, but now it is below WRPG and way below MMORPGs.

Even if you count handheld JRPG sales, it will still be below WRPGs. And MMORPGs trounce both JRPGs and WRPGs.

 

  Its because WRPGs are BETTER now.  It used to be they were different but that ship has sailed.  Now they are just flat out better.  Games from Bioware are the best RPGs available and have been for years, followed closely by Bethesda and sometimes Obsidian (who picks up Bioware's leftovers).  There just aren't any JRPGs from the last 5 years that compete at ALL with games like Fallout 3, Oblivion, the Witcher, Jade Empire, KOTOR ect ect ect.  Grind and stats just don't do it any more.  What makes WRPGs great is the addition of CHOICE.  branching character options, multiple dialogue options, moral choice and repercussions...every game I listed has those things and it is a huge boon.  Once you've played KOTOR and games that adopted the light/dark morality dynamic its so hard to go to preset canned dialogue and stories without any real branching choice.  

 

   In a game like Eternal Sonata, which I DO like, everything is set and you just follow a path leveling up your character in a pretty set way.  In Fallout 3 you arrive at a new town and can either help the sheriff out or take a 500 cap payout from a sleezy character and nuke the town.  JRPGs really need to evolve into something more then grind and repetition of what made FF1 a hit in 1988.  You'd think over 20 years they would be able to make something better consistently.

 

   I do LIKE JRPGs but I hold no illusions about them being the best thing out there these days.  WRPGs are just so good thanks largely to Bioware and Dungeons and Dragons games like Baldurs gate as a trailblazer its really hard to justify JRPGs as anything near the best out there.

There are more developer studios making WRPGs than it was in the 90's-early 00's - that's the only reason why you can say WRPGs are better today, because many of the big wRPG studios like Bioware and Bethesda are just a shadow of what they were in the past:

- Bioware is worse than when they were developing Baldur's Gate (Kotor and ME are just average compared to BG2's brilliance)
- There's no Black Isle (Obsidian is still great though)
- Bethesda has turned to mediocre with Oblivion, and Fallout 3 is nowhere near the quality of it's predecessors.

On the up side, there's great companies like CDProjekt, ArenaNet, etc... making modern wRPGs.

 



naznatips said:
shio said:
The JRPG sub-genre is dieing. In the 90's it was far more popular than WRPGs, but now it is below WRPG and way below MMORPGs.

Even if you count handheld JRPG sales, it will still be below WRPGs. And MMORPGs trounce both JRPGs and WRPGs.

 

That's a ridiculous statement.  First of all, Pokemon has outsold every WRPG this gen.  Almost combined. It also outsold WoW.  Signifficantly. It also sold far more than the Pokemon games last gen, showing a strengthening of that franchise in the genre.  There are also far more million selling JRPGs this gen than WRPGs counting handhelds, and no JRPG franchise or genre has sold less this gen than it did last gen.  There is an even larger difference between million selling JRPGs and million selling MMORPGs, of which there is only one with more than a million players right now. 

Your ignorance is showing.  You might want to cover that up.

Pokemon did outsell every WRPG this gen, but the other jRPGs didn't follow Pokemon. There are considerably more wRPGs coming out than jRPGs - the strength is in numbers. jRPGs have handhelds under wraps, but wRPGs have PC and Consoles.

As for MMORPGs. don't delude yourself, MMOs are machines. Do you know how many total subscribers Lineage 2 had? Over 14 millions. Not bad for a MMORPG with only a tenth of WoW's success. Everquest, which peaked at 500k active subscribers, sold 3.5 millions copies.
There are dozens of millions of gamers playing mmos every month, and will get bigger with the boom in continental Asia and more MMO acceptance in the west. Also go check gamerankings and you'll notice the vast amount of mmos coming out compraed to jrpgs and wrpgs.



shio said:
naznatips said:
shio said:
The JRPG sub-genre is dieing. In the 90's it was far more popular than WRPGs, but now it is below WRPG and way below MMORPGs.

Even if you count handheld JRPG sales, it will still be below WRPGs. And MMORPGs trounce both JRPGs and WRPGs.

 

That's a ridiculous statement.  First of all, Pokemon has outsold every WRPG this gen.  Almost combined. It also outsold WoW.  Signifficantly. It also sold far more than the Pokemon games last gen, showing a strengthening of that franchise in the genre.  There are also far more million selling JRPGs this gen than WRPGs counting handhelds, and no JRPG franchise or genre has sold less this gen than it did last gen.  There is an even larger difference between million selling JRPGs and million selling MMORPGs, of which there is only one with more than a million players right now. 

Your ignorance is showing.  You might want to cover that up.

Pokemon did outsell every WRPG this gen, but the other jRPGs didn't follow Pokemon. There are considerably more wRPGs coming out than jRPGs - the strength is in numbers. jRPGs have handhelds under wraps, but wRPGs have PC and Consoles.

As for MMORPGs. don't delude yourself, MMOs are machines. Do you know how many total subscribers Lineage 2 had? Over 14 millions. Not bad for a MMORPG with only a tenth of WoW's success. Everquest, which peaked at 500k active subscribers, sold 3.5 millions copies.
There are dozens of millions of gamers playing mmos every month, and will get bigger with the boom in continental Asia and more MMO acceptance in the west. Also go check gamerankings and you'll notice the vast amount of mmos coming out compraed to jrpgs and wrpgs.

 

First of all, there are absolutely not more WRPGs than JRPGs in development.  In fact, the difference is well over 2 to 1 in JRPG favor. It's foolish to look to gamerankings for JRPGs releasing because A) They screw up on the genres (often completely missing SRPGs among the JRPGs), and B) They only record those being released in America, which the majority of JRPGs are not.

Second, MMOs are notorious for reporting trial accounts in their subscribers.  Even Blizzard does it.  They consider that an "active subscription."  Also, lineage never topped 3 million active subscribers.  But again, this is all besides the point:  You said popularity.  You said that WRPGs and MMORPGs are becomming more popular, but this simply is not true.  MMORPGs make more money (well the ones that don't flop anyway, and when an MMO flops its a massive flop), but they are not the better selling genre.  You have to dig all the way back to a 1998 MMORPG to find one besides WoW which even remotely competed in sales.



Impulsivity said:
outlawauron said:
Impulsivity said:
Seriously? How can you not like Jade Empire or the original KOTOR? (NOT KOTOR 2, that was Obsidians fault)

More recently Mass Effect is without a doubt the best RPG on the market from the last 3 years. I don't know...everything about their games is more or less spot on, I can't think of a bad game they've made offhand. There aren't many companies I can say that about (maybe Naughty Dog).

I liked the first KOTOR, I haven't finished Jade Empire, and Mass Effect was biggest overrated game of 2007. It filled with tons pop-in, textures issues, slowdown, and huge load times. And I really hated that once you got til the last two hours of the game, you couldn't go back and explore more.

 

   Try the PC version, its VASTLY superior.  All the problems caused by the 360s inadequate hardware are solved and the game looks glorious.  Yes there were some limitations on end game explorations, but I never really had a problem since I tended to go to new places the second they were available and wait on continuing the main quest.  

 

   As to Mass Effect being over rated, if you're talking about the PC version that is 100% untrue.  The PC version of Mass Effect is the best RPG I've played since....well Bioshocks LAST great RPG, Jade Empire.  I'm sure it will be the best RPG out there until Dragon Age comes out, which will hold the crown until Mass Effect 2.  The only game to really give Bioshock a run for its WRPG money is probably the Witcher, which was flat out awesome (if you haven't played it go get the extended version now!!! It is just so very very awesome).

I am talking about the 360 version. I got for that and have no desire to buy it again for PC. And Bioshock isn't a RPG. Just because it has a good story doesn't make it a RPG. The Witcher is good though.

I wouldn't waste time on me though. You won't be able to convince me to think WRPGs are as good as JRPGs.



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naznatips said:
shio said:
naznatips said:
shio said:
The JRPG sub-genre is dieing. In the 90's it was far more popular than WRPGs, but now it is below WRPG and way below MMORPGs.

Even if you count handheld JRPG sales, it will still be below WRPGs. And MMORPGs trounce both JRPGs and WRPGs.

 

That's a ridiculous statement.  First of all, Pokemon has outsold every WRPG this gen.  Almost combined. It also outsold WoW.  Signifficantly. It also sold far more than the Pokemon games last gen, showing a strengthening of that franchise in the genre.  There are also far more million selling JRPGs this gen than WRPGs counting handhelds, and no JRPG franchise or genre has sold less this gen than it did last gen.  There is an even larger difference between million selling JRPGs and million selling MMORPGs, of which there is only one with more than a million players right now. 

Your ignorance is showing.  You might want to cover that up.

Pokemon did outsell every WRPG this gen, but the other jRPGs didn't follow Pokemon. There are considerably more wRPGs coming out than jRPGs - the strength is in numbers. jRPGs have handhelds under wraps, but wRPGs have PC and Consoles.

As for MMORPGs. don't delude yourself, MMOs are machines. Do you know how many total subscribers Lineage 2 had? Over 14 millions. Not bad for a MMORPG with only a tenth of WoW's success. Everquest, which peaked at 500k active subscribers, sold 3.5 millions copies.
There are dozens of millions of gamers playing mmos every month, and will get bigger with the boom in continental Asia and more MMO acceptance in the west. Also go check gamerankings and you'll notice the vast amount of mmos coming out compraed to jrpgs and wrpgs.

 

First of all, there are absolutely not more WRPGs than JRPGs in development.  In fact, the difference is well over 2 to 1 in JRPG favor. It's foolish to look to gamerankings for JRPGs releasing because A) They screw up on the genres (often completely missing SRPGs among the JRPGs), and B) They only record those being released in America, which the majority of JRPGs are not.

Second, MMOs are notorious for reporting trial accounts in their subscribers.  Even Blizzard does it.  They consider that an "active subscription."  Also, lineage never topped 3 million active subscribers.  But again, this is all besides the point:  You said popularity.  You said that WRPGs and MMORPGs are becomming more popular, but this simply is not true.  MMORPGs make more money (well the ones that don't flop anyway, and when an MMO flops its a massive flop), but they are not the better selling genre.  You have to dig all the way back to a 1998 MMORPG to find one besides WoW which even remotely competed in sales.

There are also many small, european wrpgs that aren't listed in gamerankings.

I have never heard of people listing trial accounts as subscribers, but I wouldn't put it past some. However Blizzard does NOT do that:

World of Warcraft's Subscriber Definition
World of Warcraft subscribers
include individuals who have paid a subscription fee or have an active prepaid card to play World of Warcraft, as well as those who have purchased the game and are within their free month of access. Internet Game Room players who have accessed the game over the last thirty days are also counted as subscribers. The above definition excludes all players under free promotional subscriptions, expired or cancelled subscriptions, and expired prepaid cards. Subscribers in licensees' territories are defined along the same rules.

Lineage 2 "only" had 3 millions active subscribers at one point, but over 14 millions people paid to play the game. Just look at the massive growth the MMORPG genre is having:

The MMORPG scene increased over 1500% in the last 8 years. And this chart is a compilation of sources, not an estimate, so there are still dozens of MMORPGs that weren't taken into account in the chart (it measures paying costumers only).



Lost Odyssey should have been IMO. FFXIII will get there easily, if WKC doesn't beat it there.



Famitsu has rated The Last Remnant with a 38/40 score. But Famitsu seems to rate almost every Square Enix rpg very high.



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Ajax said:

Famitsu has rated The Last Remnant with a 38/40 score. But Famitsu seems to rate almost every Square Enix rpg very high.

You're joking, right?  OXM gives the game a 7/10 yet TLR gets the best scores of any 360 JRPG in Famitsu.  Famitsu better be giving SOTLH atleast a 36/40 if TLR gets a 38/40.  BTW, I read somewhere that Famitsu actually gave TLR a 34/40.

 



Riachu said:
Ajax said:

Famitsu has rated The Last Remnant with a 38/40 score. But Famitsu seems to rate almost every Square Enix rpg very high.

You're joking, right?  OXM gives the game a 7/10 yet TLR gets the best scores of any 360 JRPG in Famitsu.  Famitsu better be giving SOTLH atleast a 36/40 if TLR gets a 38/40.  BTW, I read somewhere that Famitsu actually gave TLR a 34/40.

 

 

 Since when OXM is a reliable source for jRPG reviews?