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Forums - Microsoft Discussion - i know u hate windows, but...

Domicinator on 24 October 2008
Bitmap Frogs said:
Domicinator said:

The Inquirer is not a good source of information.  Them saying Vista is like ME in my opinion is just like Joe Schmoe on a web forum saying it.  ME was unstable.  Most people around here seem to think that unstable means something has incompatibilities.  Unstable means an OS crashes a lot and throws up a lot of error messages.  ME did that for pretty much its entire lifespan.

Vista, on the other hand, is almost built NOT to crash.  If a driver has a conflict or stops working, 99% of the time Vista can actually just stop and restart the driver without a full system reboot or BSoD.  In fact, I've never had a BSoD in Vista once!  I can count on one hand how many times Vista has locked up on my on both my Vista machines combined.  The same could definitely not be said for XP.  That's not to say that XP was bad.  I love XP.  But it's not as stable as Vista by a long shot.

If the Inquirer is talking about drivers, I wonder how old their information is and I wonder how much of this is being blamed on MS.  Nvidia, ATi, HP, etc. had plenty of time to get launch Vista drivers ready to go and fully operational.  They dropped the ball and it took them about 2 months to get caught up.  After about 2 months of bad ForceWare drivers, my gaming performance in Vista, at least to my naked eye, was similar if not close to identical to what I was getting in XP.  Granted, I had just built myself a quad core machine with 2 gigs of RAM and an 8800GTS, so that's plenty of power to do what I need to do on Vista. 

This is, of course, all anecdotal and only unique to me.  But on my Pentium Dual Core (budget line dual core) laptop with 1 GB of RAM and a run of the mill stock Intel video card, I'm having the same experience with Vista.  It boots up slower than my gaming tower and definitely can't run the high end games, but Vista-wise, it runs just fine with Aero Glass turned on and everything.

I consider my own experiences a lot more reliable than the Inquirer.  They have been considered kind of a joke for quite some time now.  Their outlandish predictions and "news" about video cards alone has made them kind of a pariah in some circles.  So I'll go ahead and trust my own experiences. 

BTW, my own experiences include my wife's G4 Macbook that crashes about every 5 minutes.

 

 

Hey you, do not dodge the questions. You laid out pretty bold accusations and you've been questioned on them - so I ask again, where is the proof Jobs can stop programs from running on mac computers please?

I also demand you expand your comments about Vista being more open than Mac OS X... open-source kernel, openGL vs DirectX, WebKit...

You either admit you were tossing up lies just to feed your emo rage against Apple or get out of this thread.

And as far as anecdotal evidence goes, the whole internet is chock full of them against Vista so don't pull out "uh my wife g4 crashes a lot" crap please. I just need to google "vista sucks" to get thousands of pages worth of casual evidence. While talking about this issue, your wife's problem are either faulty hardware or he messed with things she shouldn't have messed with. Mac OS X is rock solid but is not uncareful-user-proof. Not even the best designed software will protect someone from sudo rm -rf /

 

A) I never said Vista was more open than Mac OS.  I simply said that they are both proprietary and that there are a lot more software options for Windows than Mac.

B) I could also Google "Mac sucks" or "Apple sucks" and get all kinds of hits.  Not everyone drinks the kool aid like you have, in fact there are quite a few people out there who don't fall for Apple's false marketing.

C) My wife's Macbook is a school computer.  She is locked out of doing anything damaging to the system.  They use all Macs in her school, and there are LOTS of problems with them.  They are NOT infallible.  My last job required me to visit about 50 public and private schools a week.  About 10 of those schools that I visited were on Macs, and just about all of them complained of problems every bit as much as the schools who use PCs. 

D) I will not "get out of this thread" just because some douche bag tells me to.  First you claim that I just use Windows because I can't admit that Windows sucks and then you make demands that I leave the thread?  Why don't YOU leave the thread, you #$%#ing moron?  Do you really think that because you use all software that starts with "i" and because you use a computer whose shiny plastic casing is supposedly manufactured on Mt. Olympus that you have a monopoly of the truth on what people should and shouldn't use?  Get over yourself!!!  Stereotypical Mac zealot.  Go make some tracks on Garage Band or iMusic or iDick or whater you like using.  I don't care what you use, and I don't care to convince you otherwise.  Go roll around in your pile of grossly priced Apple hardware and then suck a bag of dicks.




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TheRealMafoo on 24 October 2008

I have had 5 Windows mobile devices. They were all great. I currently have an iPhone and it's far better for my needs, but that does not diminish the fact that MS makes a good mobile platform (as a developer, I like the integration of .Net on the mobile platforms).

As for the windows hate, it's because for people who use all systems, Vista offers nothing that has not been seen for years on OSX or Linux, yet runs slower then XP, and does not run on many systems it's supposed to run on.

We don't hate Windows (I love XP), we hate Vista.



MDMAniac on 24 October 2008

@Dociminator

whoa, that's a lot of blood pressure



TheRealMafoo on 24 October 2008
Bitmap Frogs said:
endimion said:

woawoawoa wait a second.... iPhone only ???? let me add something to the list.... you can add iTune.... iPod..... and iMac.... iSight and so on so forth..... come on there isn't a single sustainable argument that justify the price of any apple hardware... not a single one... beside design and still there IMHO it's still over priced.... and don't throw at me MACOS X first it's the OS that doesn't justify the price of the hardware... I can run a distro of linux on a PC that equal or outrun the qualities of OS X... then more stable... yeah well I crash about as often macs than PCs.... and to finish.... when people tell me more secure my ass.... OS X at the last bench mark took less time to be over taken than vista.... so even there the myth is not true... apple is a Fing scam pricewise FULL STOP.... now when they'll have a mac book pro air at less than $1500 we'll talk

 

Mac OS X is awesome. In fact it's so awesome the guy who won that hacking competition uses macs for everything.

Interview link: http://securitywatch.eweek.com/apple/mac_hacked_via_safari_browser_in_pwn2own_contest.html

He went on record saying he'd use the money prize to buy a Mac Pro =D

 

He must be an idiot then :p. I love how the argument is always that Mac users are just somehow uneducated as to what they are buying.

I was at a .NET developers conference a few months back, and the Architect of Microsoft Visual Studio was talking. A brilliant man. We asked him a question that he wanted to demonstrate to us. He opened up file explorer to navigate to a directory, and one of his folders said "MacBook Pro Backup". The Mac fans in the audience chuckled, and when he realized what we were laughing at, he just smiled and gave us one of those looks you give when you get caught doing something your not supposed to be doing.

So when a top MS employee uses a Mac, one who is incredibly informed about OS's, something has to be good about it :p



TheRealMafoo on 24 October 2008

dbl post



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Bitmap Frogs on 24 October 2008
Domicinator said:

A) I never said Vista was more open than Mac OS.  I simply said that they are both proprietary and that there are a lot more software options for Windows than Mac.

B) I could also Google "Mac sucks" or "Apple sucks" and get all kinds of hits.  Not everyone drinks the kool aid like you have, in fact there are quite a few people out there who don't fall for Apple's false marketing.

C) My wife's Macbook is a school computer.  She is locked out of doing anything damaging to the system.  They use all Macs in her school, and there are LOTS of problems with them.  They are NOT infallible.  My last job required me to visit about 50 public and private schools a week.  About 10 of those schools that I visited were on Macs, and just about all of them complained of problems every bit as much as the schools who use PCs. 

D) I will not "get out of this thread" just because some douche bag tells me to.  First you claim that I just use Windows because I can't admit that Windows sucks and then you make demands that I leave the thread?  Why don't YOU leave the thread, you #$%#ing moron?  Do you really think that because you use all software that starts with "i" and because you use a computer whose shiny plastic casing is supposedly manufactured on Mt. Olympus that you have a monopoly of the truth on what people should and shouldn't use?  Get over yourself!!!  Stereotypical Mac zealot.  Go make some tracks on Garage Band or iMusic or iDick or whater you like using.  I don't care what you use, and I don't care to convince you otherwise.  Go roll around in your pile of grossly priced Apple hardware and then suck a bag of dicks.

 

You still haven't brought any kind of proof of your outlandish claims that apple controls what you can run on apple computers. Still waiting for that.

Btw, all of apple computers are make of metal, not plastic: except for the mini and the white macbook. You got it the other way, it's PC's that are mostly made of plastic.

Your hate is reaching some interesting levels dude. The only stereotypical zealot in this thread is the stereotypical apple-hating zealot you so well match.

Oh, you've also been reported. Insulting people like that is oh so rude =/

edit: @therealmafoo - ;)





Current-gen game collection uploaded on the profile, full of win and good games; also most of my PC games. Lucasfilm Games/LucasArts 1982-2008 (Requiescat In Pace).

endimion on 24 October 2008
Bitmap Frogs said:
endimion said:

woawoawoa wait a second.... iPhone only ???? let me add something to the list.... you can add iTune.... iPod..... and iMac.... iSight and so on so forth..... come on there isn't a single sustainable argument that justify the price of any apple hardware... not a single one... beside design and still there IMHO it's still over priced.... and don't throw at me MACOS X first it's the OS that doesn't justify the price of the hardware... I can run a distro of linux on a PC that equal or outrun the qualities of OS X... then more stable... yeah well I crash about as often macs than PCs.... and to finish.... when people tell me more secure my ass.... OS X at the last bench mark took less time to be over taken than vista.... so even there the myth is not true... apple is a Fing scam pricewise FULL STOP.... now when they'll have a mac book pro air at less than $1500 we'll talk

 

Mac OS X is awesome. In fact it's so awesome the guy who won that hacking competition uses macs for everything.

Interview link: http://securitywatch.eweek.com/apple/mac_hacked_via_safari_browser_in_pwn2own_contest.html

He went on record saying he'd use the money prize to buy a Mac Pro =D

didn't say mac is not good... it's great.... but it's way overpriced....... like i said i'll get one the day they put out a macbook pro air under 1500

 



Plaupius on 24 October 2008
endimion said:
Bitmap Frogs said:
endimion said:

woawoawoa wait a second.... iPhone only ???? let me add something to the list.... you can add iTune.... iPod..... and iMac.... iSight and so on so forth..... come on there isn't a single sustainable argument that justify the price of any apple hardware... not a single one... beside design and still there IMHO it's still over priced.... and don't throw at me MACOS X first it's the OS that doesn't justify the price of the hardware... I can run a distro of linux on a PC that equal or outrun the qualities of OS X... then more stable... yeah well I crash about as often macs than PCs.... and to finish.... when people tell me more secure my ass.... OS X at the last bench mark took less time to be over taken than vista.... so even there the myth is not true... apple is a Fing scam pricewise FULL STOP.... now when they'll have a mac book pro air at less than $1500 we'll talk

 

Mac OS X is awesome. In fact it's so awesome the guy who won that hacking competition uses macs for everything.

Interview link: http://securitywatch.eweek.com/apple/mac_hacked_via_safari_browser_in_pwn2own_contest.html

He went on record saying he'd use the money prize to buy a Mac Pro =D

didn't say mac is not good... it's great.... but it's way overpriced....... like i said i'll get one the day they put out a macbook pro air under 1500

 

It's kinda ironic that you should mention sustainable arguments for the price of Apple HW. Because I have one that is what you are asking for: business. Apple is a business, it is implementing a strategy that is radically different from any other large computer manufacturer, and as a result, Apple is able to maintain healthy profit margins. Mind you, the rest of the computer market has been run down in the last 10 years or so, the PC manufacturers operate on such thin margins that it is basically close to a zero profit market.

Another thing: as is very clearly evident from the financial results, design is indeed a sustainable argument for a higher price. In fact, it's much moreso than any performance related feature or technological advance, which become all but obsolete in just a couple of years, whereas good design is timeless and maintains its value over the years.

I'm not arguing that Macs are better or worse than PCs, I just want to stress out time and time again that Apple has a different strategy, and Apple customers value somewhat different things than those who buy cheaper Windows computers. For me, the price difference is a non-factor: I'll be using any Mac I buy a minimum of 2.5 years, more likely around 3 years or about 36 months. With a price difference of, say, $1000, that translates into less than $30 per month, provided that I use the Windows machine for a similar amount of time. I'm very happy to pay that for the overall better user experience I get from the Mac, and if I choose to resell my old Mac when I buy a new one, the price difference is practically nonexistent (my current MBP has a resell value of around €900, maybe less now that the new models are out). Anyway, my point is that I know there is a price difference, but I'm not basing my buying decision on price. And I guess that makes me one of the people Apple is targeting.