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Forums - PC Discussion - So why do people hate the dreaded Spore DRM (or any DRM) again?

@Gnizmo, sorry, but in native language there are ONLY administrative responsibility for doing this all for commercial purpose.

There is just NO administrative responsibility for that, even if it is illegal. =))
That`s how it is.))



Every 5 seconds on earth one child dies from hunger...

2009.04.30 - PS3 will OUTSELL x360 atleast by the middle of 2010. Japan+Europe > NA.


Gran Turismo 3 - 1,06 mln. in 3 weeks with around 4 mln. PS2 on the launch.
Gran Turismo 4 - 1,16 mln. with 18 mln. PS2 on the launch.

Final Fantasy X - around 2 mln. with 5 mln. PS2 on the launch.
Final Fantasy X-2 - 2.4 mln. with 12 mln. PS2 on the launch.

 

1.8 mln. PS3 today(2008.01.17) in Japan. Now(2009.04.30) 3.16 mln. PS3 were sold in Japan.
PS3 will reach 4 mln. in Japan by the end of 2009 with average weekly sales 25k.

PS3 may reach 5 mln. in Japan by the end of 2009 with average weekly sales 50k.
PS2 2001 vs PS3 2008 sales numbers =) + New games released in Japan by 2009 that passed 100k so far

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twesterm said:
greenmedic88 said:
Conroy said:

Actually, if it's going to require you to be online anyway, why don't they just require a login using a cd key to play the game?  This seems more reasonable and less intrusive to me.

I suspect it's because the real reason for the limited install form of DRM has less to do with preventing piracy, and more to do with preventing the game from being loaned, shared, traded, sold, given away or anything that could potentially prevent another legitimate sale.

I'm beginning to think that the anti-piracy excuse is a more or less a screen to conceal this intent.

 

 

You "loaning" the game without uninstalling it is piracy and that is what DRM is made to stop.  Everyone knows it isn't going to stop people from cracking the DRM and downloading it.

 

Sure, but the post you're responding to was talking about why they don't use online verification of a cd key.  It's clear that online verification would prevent people from using the same key on more than one machine simultaneously.

Or are you saying that the mere existance of the installation on 2 machines is wrong, even if they can't both be played at the same time?

 



CrazzyMan said:
@Gnizmo, sorry, but in native language there are ONLY administrative responsibility for doing this all for commercial purpose.

There is just NO administrative responsibility for that, even if it is illegal. =))
That`s how it is.))

 So you are saying the first source which you provided and said was valid is no invalid and this new source no one but you can understand is the valid one and it proves you right? Sorry but I don't buy it. The article you first posted is crystal clear and you killed your own arguement with it.



Starcraft 2 ID: Gnizmo 229

Here is my countries administrative law - http://www3.lrs.lt/pls/inter3/dokpaieska.showdoc_l?p_id=270440
number 214(10) is about rights of author.
There is NOTHING more about responsibility.
If you don`t believe me, then find lithuanina-english translator, and you will find out that i say truth. =)

What i provided, is valid, but so far:

1. The author shall have the exclusive rights to authorise or to prohibit any of the following acts:

It has right to do so, but there is no responsobility for sharing in NO commercial purpose. =))

It`s like you have right to say, that you forbid me to post here, but i still can post here, and won`t have any administrative resposobility for that.

p.s. oh, that document, that i gave you in english, looks like it is a bit old, 2003 year(see in below). So probably, is not valid anymore, since there are no administrative responsobility. Sorry. =))



Every 5 seconds on earth one child dies from hunger...

2009.04.30 - PS3 will OUTSELL x360 atleast by the middle of 2010. Japan+Europe > NA.


Gran Turismo 3 - 1,06 mln. in 3 weeks with around 4 mln. PS2 on the launch.
Gran Turismo 4 - 1,16 mln. with 18 mln. PS2 on the launch.

Final Fantasy X - around 2 mln. with 5 mln. PS2 on the launch.
Final Fantasy X-2 - 2.4 mln. with 12 mln. PS2 on the launch.

 

1.8 mln. PS3 today(2008.01.17) in Japan. Now(2009.04.30) 3.16 mln. PS3 were sold in Japan.
PS3 will reach 4 mln. in Japan by the end of 2009 with average weekly sales 25k.

PS3 may reach 5 mln. in Japan by the end of 2009 with average weekly sales 50k.
PS2 2001 vs PS3 2008 sales numbers =) + New games released in Japan by 2009 that passed 100k so far

CrazzyMan said:

Here is my countries administrative law - http://www3.lrs.lt/pls/inter3/dokpaieska.showdoc_l?p_id=270440
number 214(10) is about rights of author.
There is NOTHING more about responsibility.
If you don`t believe me, then find lithuanina-english translator, and you will find out that i say truth. =)

What i provided, is valid, but so far:

1. The author shall have the exclusive rights to authorise or to prohibit any of the following acts:

It has right to do so, but there is no responsobility for sharing in NO commercial purpose. =))

It`s like you have right to say, that you forbid me to post here, but i still can post here, and won`t have any administrative resposobility for that.

p.s. oh, that document, that i gave you in english, looks like it is a bit old, 2003 year(see in below). So probably, is not valid anymore, since there are no administrative responsobility. Sorry. =))

 If he prohibits you from copying the material and then you distribute it he can make a case for lost sales and sue you for damages. Your unauthorized distribution of the game would allow a civil lawsuit to allow just compensation for your actions.

Further Lithunia is in compliance with the TRIPS agreement of the WTO which has the following to say "Creators can be given the right to prevent others from using their inventions, designs or other creations — and to use that right to negotiate payment in return for others using them. These are “intellectual property rights”. They take a number of forms. For example books, paintings and films come under copyright; inventions can be patented; brandnames and product logos can be registered as trademarks; and so on. Governments and parliaments have given creators these rights as an incentive to produce ideas that will benefit society as a whole."

 Computer programs are protected the same as literary works and paintings which are given in the Berne convention of TRIPS. Unless you want to claim that Lithuania is in violation of an agreement they signed up for 4 years ago I think I have made my case. Should I dig up the article stating that it is legal in Lithuania to sue for lost sales due to unauthorized actions or will you just stop posting and admit you are wrong?



Starcraft 2 ID: Gnizmo 229

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http://www.iipa.com/rbc/2006/2006SPEC301LITHUANIA.pdf It`s best so far i could find. Look at page 300.

Anyway, there is just NO Code of Administrative Violations for sharing in no commercial purpose. That`s how it is. So it`s legal. Since not forbidden by law. =)

Try look google "Article 214-10 of the Code of Administrative Violations of Law" - that the only one which works here.



Every 5 seconds on earth one child dies from hunger...

2009.04.30 - PS3 will OUTSELL x360 atleast by the middle of 2010. Japan+Europe > NA.


Gran Turismo 3 - 1,06 mln. in 3 weeks with around 4 mln. PS2 on the launch.
Gran Turismo 4 - 1,16 mln. with 18 mln. PS2 on the launch.

Final Fantasy X - around 2 mln. with 5 mln. PS2 on the launch.
Final Fantasy X-2 - 2.4 mln. with 12 mln. PS2 on the launch.

 

1.8 mln. PS3 today(2008.01.17) in Japan. Now(2009.04.30) 3.16 mln. PS3 were sold in Japan.
PS3 will reach 4 mln. in Japan by the end of 2009 with average weekly sales 25k.

PS3 may reach 5 mln. in Japan by the end of 2009 with average weekly sales 50k.
PS2 2001 vs PS3 2008 sales numbers =) + New games released in Japan by 2009 that passed 100k so far

CrazzyMan said:
http://www.iipa.com/rbc/2006/2006SPEC301LITHUANIA.pdf It`s best so far i could find. Look at page 300.

Anyway, there is just NO Code of Administrative Violations for sharing in no commercial purpose. That`s how it is. So it`s legal. Since not forbidden by law. =)

Try look google "Article 214-10 of the Code of Administrative Violations of Law" - that the only one which works here.

 http://www.irii.lt/MKiskis_analysis_Lithuanian_intellec.pdf

 On the other hand, the judiciary denied criminalization for
intellectual property violations causing damage without any financial profit, as well as for
intellectual property violations by non-profit entities. In the latter cases the Lithuanian law
enforcement authorities have suggested that civil remedies shall be used to protect the
interests if the holders of intellectual property rights.

Civil remedies are a lawsuit which would leave you vulnerable to legal action for distributing material even without any financial gain. As I said originally it is illegal in Lithuania to mass distribute a copy of the games. Just because it is a civil case rather than a criminal case does not make it legal.



Starcraft 2 ID: Gnizmo 229

twesterm said:

I keep hearing complaint after complaint of someone complaining how the Spore DRM is driving to piracy and that it's such an inconvenience.  I popped Spore into my PC last night expecting to have loads of troubles and have plenty to bitch about later but the strangest thing happened: I installed my copy and strangely enough I was able to play my game.

Ok, so what's the deal? 

Oh, that's right, you can only install 3 times, but how many people actually install their game more than 3 times?  The only games I can think off the top of my head I've installed more than 3 times are Half-Life 2 and WoW.  Half-Life 2 because it's just something you do whenever you make a new computer and WoW because I've started and quit it so many times.  Every other game I've probably installed up to 3 times but I don't think I've ever installed others more than that.

So how many of you actually *need* to install the game more than three times and how many of you actually think you're the majority?

And actually I thought about this a little more and starting thinking of console games.  I'm one of those people that put games down and just forget about them.  Sometimes I'll come back to them, most of the time I don't.  Lets pretend that each time I put the game down and don't play it for an extended period of time that I somehow magically uninstalled that game and to play again I would have to reinstall.

So what console games have I done this with?

  • Final Fantasy XII - played two different times
  • Lost Odyssey - On my second playthrough
  • Bully - played twice
  • God of War - played twice
  • Bioshock - played twice
  • Mass Effect - played twice

Now these are all games I decided I didn't like or decided I was just done with so I can assume those were uninstalls or removed to save disk space.  None of those were on their third install and they all even had one more install.

I understand some people really do like to install their games multiple times, but it's not like you can't.  It isn't that much trouble to call EA and get more installs.  As for everyone else, again, I ask why do you care so much?  I highly doubt anywhere near the majority of people bitching about DRM's actually are going to install their game more than three times.

Because it treats me like a criminal even though I've never pirated a single game in my entire life.

It has nothing to do with needing to install the game X amount of times or anything of the like, it's the principal behind the idea of DRM. Chances are I wouldn't install it more than twice total, but just because I personally will not be installing it a billion times doesn't change the fact that I'm being treated like a criminal. Me personally not needing that many installs is a very weak defense against draconian measures like this and I think people have the right to bitch and moan and sabotage as loud as they want.  As for me, I won't be buying it until that shit is removed, and if it isn't it's no great loss ...there are lots of games out there (such as Warhammer) to keep me entertained.

I was moderately interested in Spore, but DRM was really the thing that nailed it for me as a no purchase.  I'll stick with Steam and Stardock and as of next week Warhammer Online.



After all the backlash from Mass Effect that had the exact same DRM, I would have never thought they would implement the same shit on SPORE. I just don't understand why EA thinks this is the way to go. Their similar? franchise SIMS sells really well without this crap.

Reading forums and amazon reviews makes me wonder how many potential sales EA lost because of this whole DRM issue.

It doesn't prevent piracy, it only upsaets the legit consumers and more importantly gives a bad reputation to their name and could and would be a burden on their future releases. This garbage needs to stop.



crappy old school NES games are more entertaining than next-gen games.

If Red Alert 3 also does this, I'm not going to buy it. Fuck EA.