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Forums - Sales Discussion - Microsoft: we will finish 2nd

celine said:
321tttrini4everz said:
celine said:
DMeisterJ said:
Sony: No you wont.

Nintendo: (laugh) ooo wait ! we haven't reached 100 million mark with one console although we was on the market so long *CRYING*

 

 

fixed^^^^

 

I like bitter tears, keep it up ^^^^

 

 

^^^^^ ;)



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Sony is going to be in third for this gen unless they want to keep losing money. Microsoft will beat sony for the rest of the year after the price cut and sony will go from first to last. Sony need to focus on making money on the ps3. All these weeks sony beat microsoft they are still losing money I still find it funny how people say sony will some how start selling some much more then M$ there no way because 360 will always be cheaper and with the us and soon most of the worlds economy in the s*** that will matter plus both the ps3 and 360 and getting beat by the wii so by next gen both of them will turn there focus on nintendo

now the kingdom hearts 3 will be only on the ps3 I have no choice but to buy one
which mean sony will get more money from me



I still find it funny how people say sony will some how start selling some much more then M$ there no way because 360 will always be cheaper

Well, the 360 always being cheaper isn´t really making it outsell the PS3 in Europe, Asia and since the beginning of this year, the U.S., is it?

xboxfanboy said:
Sony is going to be in third for this gen unless they want to keep losing money. Microsoft will beat sony for the rest of the year after the price cut and sony will go from first to last. Sony need to focus on making money on the ps3. All these weeks sony beat microsoft they are still losing money I still find it funny how people say sony will some how start selling some much more then M$ there no way because 360 will always be cheaper and with the us and soon most of the worlds economy in the s*** that will matter plus both the ps3 and 360 and getting beat by the wii so by next gen both of them will turn there focus on nintendo

now the kingdom hearts 3 will be only on the ps3 I have no choice but to buy one
which mean sony will get more money from me

I didn't know it was possible for someone to be so wrong about every little thing they're talking about.

1. Sony is practically guaranteed to come in 2nd this Gen.

2. PS3s are borderline profitable and what little loss there is left on hardware sales are made up with PS2 & PSP hardware sales as well as PS3, PSP, PS2 and PSN software sales.

3. If you bothered to look at Sony and Microsoft's respective financial reports you would see that Sony actually made a profit last quarter with the PS3 selling at a much more significant loss per unit sold than it does now. Meanwhile, Microsoft went right back into the red last quarter. If Microsoft couldn't even stay in the green last quarter, I have serious doubts whether they can in the future given that the upcoming price-cuts will only cut their profitability even more.

4. The upcoming 360 price-cut will not push 360 over PS3 in worldwide consoles sales in either October or November and probably not December either. The price-cut earlier this year in Europe didn't push 360 sales over PS3's and the Japanese couldn't care less how much the 360 costs. The price-drop in America will have a greater effect then in Europe, but if you think that it will somehow magically make up the difference in Europe and Japan for the next 12 months then you must be in denial. Hell, even in America 360 is going to have trouble beating PS3 due to the fact that this upcoming Christmas will be the biggest HDTV/Blu-ray adoption season ever.

5. Xbox has been cheaper than the PS3 since launch and yet the PS3 has still out sold the 360 for almost EVERY SINGLE WEEK this year. If you haven't realized that having the cheaper model isn't the most important aspect toward gaining more consoles sales, then you're hopeless.

6. Trying to fight Nintendo directly is a lost battle. They've successfully created their own microcosm in the games industry. Sony will not feel the need to take on Nintendo for the casual market because they are successful with the hardcore market. Microsoft may feel the need to go after Nintendo with the casual market simply because they can't beat Sony with the hardcore market while making a profit. If Microsoft does go after Nintendo next generation, not only will they likely still remain in 3rd place, they will also leave Sony with unchallenged reign of the hardcore market. 

7. Kingdom Hearts III is not confirmed to be on the PS3 or even in development for that matter. That was rumor in a UK PlayStation magazine. Do I really need to tell you that you should wait until you blindly accept it as fact?



astrosmash said:
Coming from the Senior VP, this clearly wasn't just an off the cuff remark or a slip of the tongue; this statement is a sign of something. Keep in mind that MS has shown time and time again, in most industries it is a big player in that to them market share is king; to admit they can't reach first is very un-MS.

The simpliest, and least ground shaking would be if this is just softening up investors for the real bad news that could be coming when they end up in third. Yet that doesn't sound like MS. MS almost always (in all its business units), make predictions that are absurdly optimistic. For that reason, I feel it must be more than just this.

The next most obvious, as others in this thread have already predicted, is that MS may be giving up on gen 7 and already making plans for gen 8. With all the admiration they have been showing for Wii of late, if this is their plan bet on it being a wii clone (with HD and Live)

But I am going to put my money on the less obvious option (one I have floated before, and been critisized for); MS is openning the door to getting out of the console business after this gen. They will be resigned to second for a little while, then a year or so after PS3 overtakes them they will stop producing 360 and not make a replacement. MS has thrown billions into consoles, and in the process achieved their goal (knocking Sony down far enough that Sony can't own the living room). But what MS hasn't acheived is the kind of domination of the industry that works best with their business philosophy. So I think they will chalk those billions up as money well spent, then get out before it costs them any more.

I think the most obvious option is that it's clear to even the blindest fanboy that the 360 is not going to beat Wii sales in this universe.  So MS is just being absurdly optimistic but not insanely optimistic. 

As for your theory:  aside from the likelihood of MS dropping out of consoles next generation (which I judge to be low), there is no reason that MS would abandon the 360 until it stops being profitable -- and "1 year after the PS3 overtakes it" would be way too soon for that.



Tag (courtesy of fkusumot): "Please feel free -- nay, I encourage you -- to offer rebuttal."
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My advice to fanboys: Brag about stuff that's true, not about stuff that's false. Predict stuff that's likely, not stuff that's unlikely. You will be happier, and we will be happier.

"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts." - Sen. Pat Moynihan
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I have the most epic death scene ever in VGChartz Mafia.  Thanks WordsofWisdom! 

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Seihyouken said:
xboxfanboy said:
Sony is going to be in third for this gen unless they want to keep losing money. Microsoft will beat sony for the rest of the year after the price cut and sony will go from first to last. Sony need to focus on making money on the ps3. All these weeks sony beat microsoft they are still losing money I still find it funny how people say sony will some how start selling some much more then M$ there no way because 360 will always be cheaper and with the us and soon most of the worlds economy in the s*** that will matter plus both the ps3 and 360 and getting beat by the wii so by next gen both of them will turn there focus on nintendo

now the kingdom hearts 3 will be only on the ps3 I have no choice but to buy one
which mean sony will get more money from me

I didn't know it was possible for someone to be so wrong about every little thing they're talking about.

But he might be right about the US and world economies! 



Tag (courtesy of fkusumot): "Please feel free -- nay, I encourage you -- to offer rebuttal."
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My advice to fanboys: Brag about stuff that's true, not about stuff that's false. Predict stuff that's likely, not stuff that's unlikely. You will be happier, and we will be happier.

"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts." - Sen. Pat Moynihan
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
The old smileys: ; - ) : - ) : - ( : - P : - D : - # ( c ) ( k ) ( y ) If anyone knows the shortcut for , let me know!
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I have the most epic death scene ever in VGChartz Mafia.  Thanks WordsofWisdom! 

Wait...

Microsoft said they'll finish 2nd in the HD console war?

Thought so.




"This won't be an issue (for Nintendo) anymore by the end of 2010, or if things don't run smoothly, by early 2011."

Maybe not but it is almost a given that the PS3 will pass the Wii's worldwide install base either before or in the 2010 Christmas season. The Wii might make it to 50 million pretty easily; however its momentum largely due to hardware limitations and the quality of games that will be coming to PS3 over the next two years -- a virtual hurricane of quality starting with games like Heavy Rain, Kojima's next project, God of War III, GT 5, Team ICO's game, MAG, RE5, the Final Fantasies, and on and on will have the Wii in a position much like New Orlean's levies trying to stand up to Katrina.



My most anticipated games:  Whatever Hideo Kojima is going to do next, Final Fantasy XIII, Final Fantasy Versus XIII, Gran Turismo 5, Alan Wake, Wii Sports Resort.  Cave Story Wiiware.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zqqLMgbtrB8

Seihyouken said:
xboxfanboy said:
Sony is going to be in third for this gen unless they want to keep losing money. Microsoft will beat sony for the rest of the year after the price cut and sony will go from first to last. Sony need to focus on making money on the ps3. All these weeks sony beat microsoft they are still losing money I still find it funny how people say sony will some how start selling some much more then M$ there no way because 360 will always be cheaper and with the us and soon most of the worlds economy in the s*** that will matter plus both the ps3 and 360 and getting beat by the wii so by next gen both of them will turn there focus on nintendo

now the kingdom hearts 3 will be only on the ps3 I have no choice but to buy one
which mean sony will get more money from me

I didn't know it was possible for someone to be so wrong about every little thing they're talking about.

1. Sony is practically guaranteed to come in 2nd this Gen.

2. PS3s are borderline profitable and what little loss there is left on hardware sales are made up with PS2 & PSP hardware sales as well as PS3, PSP, PS2 and PSN software sales.

3. If you bothered to look at Sony and Microsoft's respective financial reports you would see that Sony actually made a profit last quarter with the PS3 selling at a much more significant loss per unit sold than it does now. Meanwhile, Microsoft went right back into the red last quarter. If Microsoft couldn't even stay in the green last quarter, I have serious doubts whether they can in the future given that the upcoming price-cuts will only cut their profitability even more.

4. The upcoming 360 price-cut will not push 360 over PS3 in worldwide consoles sales in either October or November and probably not December either. The price-cut earlier this year in Europe didn't push 360 sales over PS3's and the Japanese couldn't care less how much the 360 costs. The price-drop in America will have a greater effect then in Europe, but if you think that it will somehow magically make up the difference in Europe and Japan for the next 12 months then you must be in denial. Hell, even in America 360 is going to have trouble beating PS3 due to the fact that this upcoming Christmas will be the biggest HDTV/Blu-ray adoption season ever.

5. Xbox has been cheaper than the PS3 since launch and yet the PS3 has still out sold the 360 for almost EVERY SINGLE WEEK this year. If you haven't realized that having the cheaper model isn't the most important aspect toward gaining more consoles sales, then you're hopeless.

6. Trying to fight Nintendo directly is a lost battle. They've successfully created their own microcosm in the games industry. Sony will not feel the need to take on Nintendo for the casual market because they are successful with the hardcore market. Microsoft may feel the need to go after Nintendo with the casual market simply because they can't beat Sony with the hardcore market while making a profit. If Microsoft does go after Nintendo next generation, not only will they likely still remain in 3rd place, they will also leave Sony with unchallenged reign of the hardcore market. 

7. Kingdom Hearts III is not confirmed to be on the PS3 or even in development for that matter. That was rumor in a UK PlayStation magazine. Do I really need to tell you that you should wait until you blindly accept it as fact?

 

Just wanted to point out that #3 cannot be backed up by facts.  The division that you are reffering to that lost money contains many many of M$'s products, so basing preformance on those numbers is completely wrong.



JaggedSac said:
Seihyouken said:
3. If you bothered to look at Sony and Microsoft's respective financial reports you would see that Sony actually made a profit last quarter with the PS3 selling at a much more significant loss per unit sold than it does now. Meanwhile, Microsoft went right back into the red last quarter. If Microsoft couldn't even stay in the green last quarter, I have serious doubts whether they can in the future given that the upcoming price-cuts will only cut their profitability even more.
Just wanted to point out that #3 cannot be backed up by facts.  The division that you are reffering to that lost money contains many many of M$'s products, so basing preformance on those numbers is completely wrong.

What do you suggest lost the money in that division instead?  There has to be a plausible alternative, or the presence of other things in the division makes no difference.  This is a serious question because I really haven't looked at this.



Tag (courtesy of fkusumot): "Please feel free -- nay, I encourage you -- to offer rebuttal."
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
My advice to fanboys: Brag about stuff that's true, not about stuff that's false. Predict stuff that's likely, not stuff that's unlikely. You will be happier, and we will be happier.

"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts." - Sen. Pat Moynihan
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
The old smileys: ; - ) : - ) : - ( : - P : - D : - # ( c ) ( k ) ( y ) If anyone knows the shortcut for , let me know!
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
I have the most epic death scene ever in VGChartz Mafia.  Thanks WordsofWisdom!