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Forums - Gaming - PS4 and Xbox ‘720′ to arrive in 2011/12, says Crytek

HappySqurriel said:
Resident_Hazard said:
HappySqurriel said:
colonelstubbs said:
Ive only had my PS3 a year! 2011 makes it 4 years! Thats ridiculous! If the PS4 was to come out before 2013 i will...switch sides!

What 'colonelstubbs wants' or the technology available doesn't really factor into when a new console is released ...

The videogame market is an oligopoly which means that each of the participants in the market bases their strategy in response to the strategy of their competition. As we have seen in the past, it is a very bad idea to leave your competition on the market for too long before bringing a new system to market that is in direct competition to it; one of the primary reasons why the Playstation was so dominant over the N64, and the PS2 was so dominant over the XBox and Gamecube, was they had an 18 month lead (only dealing with weak competition) to build a userbase and secure third party support before their competition came to market. At the same time the market tends to start rejecting the more minor competitors after 4 or 5 years, and they soon start to see a very rapid death.

 

Your logic is heavily flawed.  The Saturn and Dreamcast were out well before the Playstation and PS2, respectively, and that didn't put them in the Number 1 slot.  The Genesis was also out two years before the SNES, and the SNES ended up with almost twice the userbase.  The Xbox360 hit the market first this generation and lost the number one slot to the Wii.

Being first means nothing and by now, everyone in the industry should understand that.  Just as making the most powerful hardware means nothing as, traditionally, the most powerful hardware is never the top selling console.

 

The Atari2600 dominated over more powerful rivals such as ColecoVision, and trounced earlier arrivals like the Fairchild Channel F.

The NES trounced the more powerful Master System and TurboGrafx-16.

The SNES usurped the earlier-released Genesis (and to an extent, the TurboGrafx), and vastly outsold the more powerful Jaguar and Neo-Geo.

The Playstation annhilated the earlier released Saturn and 3DO, and sales-wise, crushed the more powerful N64.

The Playstation 2 crushed the earlier released Dreamcast and controlled the market over the more powerful Xbox and GameCube.

 

Coming to market first does not guarantee success by any stretch of the imagination.
Developing the most powerful hardware does not guarantee success by any stretch of the imagination.

 

First off, Sega's reaction in the market and their competitions reaction to Sega was a little different than what we would see today ...

Sega released the Sega CD, followed by the Sega 32x, and then did a "Surprise" release of the Sega Saturn at $500 with no games, so its not that surprising that the 12 month lead it had over the Playstation didn't lead to its dominance; after all this failed hardware, the Saturn's software not being carried by major US retailers, and major third party publishers (EA) refusal to produce any games for the Dreamcast even die-hard Sega fans wouldn't buy the system.

 

My argument wasn't that releasing a console first leads to its dominance (by the way), it was that none of the console manufacturers would wait 2 years to release a console to compete with a new console that actually can threaten their position within the market; in particular if their console has already had an acceptably long life (5 or 6 years).

I'm well aware of Sega's disastrous and unfortunate history post SegaCD.  Video game history is something I consider fun and I read up on it a lot.  No really, a lot.

The 2-year stretch argument also loses some strength when you consider that the SNES launched 2 years after the Genesis, and the N64 launched two years after the Saturn and in both cases, the Nintendo consoles prevailed over their Sega rivals.  So, some have waited two years and still had success.  When you think about it, both the Xbox and GameCube debuted two years after their respective generation started as well.

Your clarified point, however does carry some sway in the fact that any console that launches, shall we say, "halfway" into a generation is pretty much dooming itself to failure.  Look at the Atari 7800 and Jaguar.  Late bloomers can find success if properly marketed and supported, however.  Look at the ancient ColecoVision which was one of the latest bloomers of the ill-fated second generation.  It managed third place at a time when there were about 764 different consoles on the market despite it's late entry.  ColecoVision was only topped (as I recall) by Atari VCS (2600) and Mattel Intellivision.  Coleco's success came with it's decently powerful hardware and it's large collection of licensed arcade-quality ports, and the fact that one of the top arcade games at the time (Donkey Kong) was exclusive and a pack-in.  It also helped that they made an add-on that allowed Atari2600 games to be played on the thing... for which they were promptly sued by Atari.

This is why I find the revelation of Wii-like technology patents from Apple so intriguing.  If they are planning a console, it's almost too late for them to release it and still be met with success this generation.  Not that I wouldn't welcome another entrant (this is the lightest generation ever hardware-wise), but I think that, unless it was suddenly launched this upcoming holiday season with fanfare and loads of support, it'll be something prepped for the next generation.  And if true, Apple may be the company that jumps the gun on the next gen.  Apple putting out their own Wii-like console (perhaps with Xbox360 equivalent power) anytime between now and, say, 2011, would likely end with embarassing failure.

 



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Yeah I'm on the side of the nay-sayers here. I think the companies would be short selling themselves big time on the current gen software, which they need for R&D for next gen. Also I think in this particular generation we've just now started catching up to the curve hardware wise. Both as Consumers and Software developers. I don't think these companies are ready to throw a new system at people now that they just spent their money on an HD TV with the proper hook ups and sound systems.

Also what would the medium be. It would have to already be devoloped for them to implement it in time. Personally I think Next GEN needs something new like Holographic Data which is still way to expensive. As far as others: quote Wikipedia: "No commercial product based on 3D optical data storage has yet arrived on the mass market, although several companies are actively developing the technology and predict that it will become available by 2010."

So I would imagine 2012 to be earliest maybe Q4 2011.



"Let justice be done though the heavens fall." - Jim Garrison

"Ask not your horse, if ye should ride into battle" - myself

sony and publishers will fight another cycle that short because they need to make a decent ROI.
ms will probably go for it to stay a step ahead of the pack (and they roll in cash so they don't focus as much on short term ROI.
I have no idea what nintendo might do.