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Forums - Microsoft Discussion - Braid Discussion Thread (SPOILERFEST!)

I just want to add that the story is NOT what makes Braid so great (aside from the awesome ending), it's that the unique gameplay makes you think about things differently from other games, like with Portal.



We don't provide the 'easy to program for' console that they [developers] want, because 'easy to program for' means that anybody will be able to take advantage of pretty much what the hardware can do, so the question is what do you do for the rest of the nine and half years? It's a learning process. - SCEI president Kaz Hirai

It's a virus where you buy it and you play it with your friends and they're like, "Oh my God that's so cool, I'm gonna go buy it." So you stop playing it after two months, but they buy it and they stop playing it after two months but they've showed it to someone else who then go out and buy it and so on. Everyone I know bought one and nobody turns it on. - Epic Games president Mike Capps

We have a real culture of thrift. The goal that I had in bringing a lot of the packaged goods folks into Activision about 10 years ago was to take all the fun out of making video games. - Activision CEO Bobby Kotick

 

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sinha said:

I just want to add that the story is NOT what makes Braid so great (aside from the awesome ending), it's that the unique gameplay makes you think about things differently from other games, like with Portal.

Well I'm not sure who you're trying to convince. There aren't supposed to be any none owners in here so there's no opinions to sway. I do agree though. The gameplay is by far the main attraction in this game with the art direction, music and story coming in as a three way tie in second. The game just excels in so many ways.

 



Tag: Became a freaking mod and a complete douche, coincidentally, at the same time.



Just finished Braid wow wow wee! Amazing game.

But I dont get it, in the Epilogue stage, there this platform with a lever that swings up if you pull the lever and it has green mist for time standstill on it. There doesnt seem to be a point of it, does anyone know what its for?

Also is the Princess portrayed as dead or asleep? What does going back in time in the last level signify?

I did read above about the atomic bomb and it makes sense to me. Thanks for that.

All in all I am very confused in the overall story but there were times I did think of certain morals. The puzzles are extremely innovative and I have to say I wont forget playing this game anytime soon and a sure contender for my GOTY!

Update: I notice Braid is having a real effect on me. Hehe. When I watch a movie now or play other games, I feel like I want to press the X button to rewind or undo something I did!



EaglesEye379 said:
Just finished Braid wow wow wee! Amazing game.

But I dont get it, in the Epilogue stage, there this platform with a lever that swings up if you pull the lever and it has green mist for time standstill on it. There doesnt seem to be a point of it, does anyone know what its for?

Also is the Princess portrayed as dead or asleep? What does going back in time in the last level signify?

I did above about the atomic bomb and it makes sense to me. Thanks for that.

All in all I am very confused in the overall story but there were times I did think of certain morals. The puzzles are extremely innovative and I have to say I wont forget playing this game anytime soon and a sure contender for my GOTY!

Earlier in this thread, jason tells me about secret texts during the Epilogue. You'll hear a woman say "ahhhh" and at that exact spot you can read the alternate text from the book. In the room with the platform and lever, it's needed to cross to the other side of the room where the "ahhh" sound is without disturbing the books. It gives just a bit more insight into the story by reading these alternate texts.

I believe the last level during World 1 signifies Tim coming to terms with his search for the Princess. He has ruined his relationships for this pipe dream to search for something better in life, because he is not satisfied with the mistakes he makes. The Princess running away is to show that his search has no Princess awaiting him at the end, and his pursuit was the biggest mistake he's made. During the Epilogue you notice the story content takes place with his mother and girlfriend/wife and what he has done. That's my take at the moment anyways. I'm sure i'll take the story differently tomorrow. That's the brilliance of it though. It's how each person can take from the story and create their own scenario of what's happening based on the same information. Maybe it's about relationship, or atomic bombs. Maybe it's a big metaphor, or maybe it'd interdimensional travel. It's up to you to decide.

 



Tag: Became a freaking mod and a complete douche, coincidentally, at the same time.



Thanks for the tip on the alternate text (I knew there was something up when I heard that voice in certain places).

To me, the thing that most spoke to me is that when you are chasing something or someone in life, sometimes the best thing to do is let go. Just let go and not pull to hard on her braid and it will come to you naturally. The alternate text spoke of:
1. The Princess being annoyed at Tim
2. Tim only looking at the outsides of things
3. Tim wanting something that he can only have when he is older

I think in general, this game speaks of people thats too caught up in making sure they accomplish their goals (money, power) and wanting things that they should wait for, and yet are also chasing that one thing: love.

In the last level, Tim reached his love, only to find her asleep (not finding what he wanted). And then Tim escaped the horror of reaching his destination (but not getting what he wanted) by backtracking and returning home with all the whims of life (wine, women etc.)

The Epilogue stage is like a culmination of his destination which is built by the building blocks of his journey (the last castle) and is something that all of us will encounter when we die.

I also think the atom bomb theory makes sense. Like a painting this game is very open to personal interpretation. Love it.



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EaglesEye379 said:


Also is the Princess portrayed as dead or asleep? What does going back in time in the last level signify?

 

Point missed.  You're not going back in time, you were before.  I thought they made it obvious enough... 

What order did you enter the doors, the same as in the other worlds or different?  Are the bad guys in the other areas of the world moving forwards or backwards?  What about the music? If you were going forward in time, you think the ground in that level is sucking in smoke from the air??

 



We don't provide the 'easy to program for' console that they [developers] want, because 'easy to program for' means that anybody will be able to take advantage of pretty much what the hardware can do, so the question is what do you do for the rest of the nine and half years? It's a learning process. - SCEI president Kaz Hirai

It's a virus where you buy it and you play it with your friends and they're like, "Oh my God that's so cool, I'm gonna go buy it." So you stop playing it after two months, but they buy it and they stop playing it after two months but they've showed it to someone else who then go out and buy it and so on. Everyone I know bought one and nobody turns it on. - Epic Games president Mike Capps

We have a real culture of thrift. The goal that I had in bringing a lot of the packaged goods folks into Activision about 10 years ago was to take all the fun out of making video games. - Activision CEO Bobby Kotick

 

Yea i got it after I saw it the second time. The Princess was moving so sleeping. I thought she was dead because in the end you dont end up with her anyway.

The last part shows what you think is happening (you saving the Princess) to what is actually (or could be) happening (the Princess is running away from you to her knight in shining armour). Its a dual vision of two different things that could be the outcome of Tims search of the Princess.



The enemies were all going backwards in the last level.

But yea this is another layer - you think you are the hero but actually you are being the monster.



noslodecoy said:
That explanation by giantbomb doesn't seem to fit quite right. I like it, but it doesn't explain why the princess wanted to be saved from Tim and ran into the arms of the night in shining armor. This seems to be an important part of the "ending". I don't see how that can be equated to the atomic bomb.

I don't think the princess want to save by Tim.  The whole thing was backward when you get to the end and you rewind it is actually how it play out.  Tim found his "princess" but she ran from him and was save by knight in shining armor.  The only thing princess need to be save from was Tim himself.  Anyway that was my take on it.

Awesome game.

The one puzzle that stump me completely was the shadow of the past the one where he had to get the shadow knock out so he can jump up the level.

 



Onyxmeth said:

1. In World 5(The doppelganger world), I think it's the fourth room in, you have a door all the way towards the right and a platform overhead with a puzzle piece. I couldn't figure out to let the goomba kill me by walking off the platform onto my head, elevating him high enough so my future jump from the upper platform could bounce me to the puzzle piece. God I hope you can all visualize what I'm talking about.

2. Definitely World 6(The pocket of time world), where in the right upper corner, you have to pass two goombas in a row past three pirahna plants so you can hop off one and onto another for a boost big enough to reach the upper platform for a puzzle piece. I knew what to do early on, but it was maddeningly difficult to execute.

 

Exactly the same for me, so I'll just quote you instead of describing the puzzles again.

As for the story, I think there's multiple intended meanings. First, it can be taken as a more thoughtful version of the standard "save the princess" videogame plot. It gives some insight into the motivations of both the hero and the princess, and ends with a brilliant twist. Taken just on that level, it succeeds beyond the standard videogame plot. Beyond that, theres universal themes running through the story that act as metaphors for more than one thing. The most prominent theme is how a difference in perspective can make the same events mean the opposite thing to different people. I think that's the purpose behind the books in the epilogue: each one shows a different way to interperet the story.

The most obvious metaphor is the romantic relationship. The boyfriend sees himself as being protective, while the girlfriend sees him as smothering. Similar to how Tim sees himself as trying to save the princess due to his backwards perception of time, while the princess is afraid of him and trying to escape. There also appears to be an atomic bomb metaphor; the creation of the bomb could be seen as working for the good of humanity - to defeat nazi Germany - at the time scientists were working on it. When viewed in hindsight, the creation of the bomb can be seen as evil. There's also the mother/baby metaphor: the mother is trying to protect, the baby doesn't understand and sees the protection as cruel.

I also think there's ironic comments about videogames running through the game. The example that comes to mind is the book saying Tim doesn't believe he should be punished for his mistakes, as long as he learns from them. The entire game design is based around the this concept: the game never tries to punish the player for making a mistake. If you do something wrong, you're free to learn from it, rewind, and do it right. There's probably more parallels that can be drawn, but I'm not good at seeing them.

Finally, I think the game examines universal themes about the human condition, such that it can be seen as a metaphor for any number of things unintended by the author. The player is intended to examine the themes presented for themselves, and be able to see parallels between the themes in the game and the themes in the player's own life. The castle at the very end of the epilogue is extremely vague about what it is supposed to represent, while the other books in the epilogue are more clear. Some people have said the castle means Tim is dead, and is examining the events of his life. I think the castle represents the experience of the player playing the game. From the memory of those experiences, the player has the beginnings of their own "castle". But it's only the basis; the complete the castle, the player needs to use his own life experiences, to build his own "castle" of meaning, unique to himself. The player's "princess" will never be found in someone else's castle, but only in one he has constructed himself.

(I really feel like most of the game's story goes over my head. I'm still trying to understand it.)