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Forums - Nintendo - Square-Enix using Nintendo to pay for Final Fantasy 13 etc?

Kasz216 said:
Onyxmeth said:
Kasz216 said:
Onyxmeth said:

Let me ask the real question here. If Square had made Final Fantasy XIII on the DS instead of PS3, would it match sales? If it could then ask yourself the difference in profit it could make. Me personally, I think if FF XIII were developed for the DS, it would outsell the PS3 version by a healthy margin and would have been highly profitable. Much more profitable than the PS3 FF XIII will be. Square is aware of this and have shifted a lot of resources over to the little handheld that could.

I dunno. Graphics is about all Final Fantasy has left as far as quality goes.

 

That's simply not true. I will not argue that Final Fantasy is at it's best, because it's not, but each game has been polished and has tried new ideas in gameplay, for better or for worse. Not to mention that there is no one FF team. Square can utilize any number of it's designers to head the next Final Fantasy, so each one can speak for itself. Who's to say if Final Fantasy XIV finds it's way onto the DS that The World Ends With You team won't be the one to handle it? This also applies to any console FF lands on, but I wanted to tie it into my position.

If you truly think FF would only sell because of improving graphics, you're sorely mistaken. The brand sells, and the main series sells just because it's THE Final Fantasy. I have no doubts in my mind that Final Fantasy XIV could sell oodles on the DS. I would predict no less than 7 million copies. Gamers want their RPGs on the DS. They've been selling well there and Final Fantasy is still a very healthy brand name in gaming.

Problem is, the Final Fantay team hasn't told a good story since the SNES days. (Unless 9 had a good story, haven't played it.) They've tried new ideas in gameplay, which... have mostly been minor, and generally for the worse as well.

The brand sells as well, however a large part of the brand identity relies on the cutting edge visuals. With it's more realistic art style a backwords step in graphics would be much more noticable then the cartoonish Dragon Quest series.

What was it that put FF7 on the map? Huge marketing hype and cutscenes that had some pretty amazing graphics at the time. Since then the focus has been on cinematic gaming in the final fantasy series.

At one point Final Fantasy games were known to be the pinnacle of RPGs in terms of story and gameplay...

Now it's known mostly for it's graphics, and it's hype as "the" RPG franchise. (Or that's how it's seen in the west anyway.) That's all it has left really to keep it on top of the mountain.

Take away the better graphics... and all that's left is the hype vs other RPGs... and pure hype can't sustain by itself in my opinion. It would start to fall and lose casual RPG fan marketshare to some other franchise.

FF7 was a good game don't hate like a lot of people do just because it's popular.

 



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Onyxmeth said:

Square-Enix, if it wasn't obvious already, is not heavily supporting any console. Their allegiance is with handhelds now and I feel in the future, more and more games and franchises will be lost on consoles to the handhelds. Dragon Quest has already changed allegiances. I think it's only a matter of time, maybe 5-6 years at the most and we'll be seeing the main FF series change to a handheld exclusive. Just look at the DS and PSP support:

..............................

See the difference? I wouldn't be surprised if the main series of both Kingdom Hearts and Final Fantasy were both on handhelds within 5 years. Square is abandoning consoles very slowly but surely. Even if you look towards reviews, their handheld offerings have reivewed better also. A handheld oriented Square is a rejuvenated one. The console Square is lazy as all hell and uninspired.

 

I think the reason there is such a lack of Console games on Square Enix's part is because they are spending a lot of their money and time on one game, FFXIII. The DS/PSP ones are quicker and cheaper to make with SE's other teams (if they have small, separate teams). Obviously console games take much more time, but with FFXIII, they are taking several years, past the standard 18 monthe-2 years.



Leatherhat on July 6th, 2012 3pm. Vita sales:"3 mil for COD 2 mil for AC. Maybe more. "  thehusbo on July 6th, 2012 5pm. Vita sales:"5 mil for COD 2.2 mil for AC."

Question is DQ 9 actually confirmed for Wii or....

Oh just googled it and it's on DS! Woah!



SaviorX said:
Onyxmeth said:

Square-Enix, if it wasn't obvious already, is not heavily supporting any console. Their allegiance is with handhelds now and I feel in the future, more and more games and franchises will be lost on consoles to the handhelds. Dragon Quest has already changed allegiances. I think it's only a matter of time, maybe 5-6 years at the most and we'll be seeing the main FF series change to a handheld exclusive. Just look at the DS and PSP support:

..............................

See the difference? I wouldn't be surprised if the main series of both Kingdom Hearts and Final Fantasy were both on handhelds within 5 years. Square is abandoning consoles very slowly but surely. Even if you look towards reviews, their handheld offerings have reivewed better also. A handheld oriented Square is a rejuvenated one. The console Square is lazy as all hell and uninspired.

 

I think the reason there is such a lack of Console games on Square Enix's part is because they are spending a lot of their money and time on one game, FFXIII. The DS/PSP ones are quicker and cheaper to make with SE's other teams (if they have small, separate teams). Obviously console games take much more time, but with FFXIII, they are taking several years, past the standard 18 monthe-2 years.

I agree. They have decided to use most of their other resources on the DS and PSP becuause of how long these RPGs are taking to make on consoles. It isn't just FF XIII either. When's the last time you heard anything about Crystal Bearers for the Wii? Square is deciding to put most of it's eggs into the DS, because better quantity and quality of games can be made on there. In the time it takes to bring out FF XIII, Square will probably have released over 20 DS games, and those games will make them more money.

 



Tag: Became a freaking mod and a complete douche, coincidentally, at the same time.



You got it backwards. The big projects, DQIX & FFXIII are expected to make enough profit to fund all the other crap they make. These titles are expected to earn them several times what it cost them to develop and market. If they fail to generate huge profit, they will be considered failures.



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the_bloodwalker said:
Bored4life said:

Crystal Tools was never supposed to multiplatform as they later claimed.Some study of SE during Nov07 to Jan08 shows pretty good evidence that Wada wanted to shift FF13 to Wii despite the enormous costs already put in.

Crystal Tools had 2 purposes for being on Wii.

1)Port over FF13.There is evidence to show that this was the main motivation to the port.But it seems that that fell through since most likely Iwata didn't moneyhat them like they wanted.They weren't too sure if rpgs would do well and wanted money as insurance.

2)Push Wii gaphics and have it to start putting out well made rpgs to compete with the other well made rpgs that are being announced for the system.the_bloodwalker's post sums up that part nicely.

Exactly. SE got the Licence of Unreal III engine to develop multiplatform games, not the Cristal Tools. That was made to fully use the PS3, their platform of choice.

You're right about the disruption, SE got cought off guard will the Wii's success. They understood that they had to move. They thought with Chocobo's Dungeon and their original Cristyal Bearers it would be enough, but now they have to shift resources and reorganize internally.

While the FFXIII port came to my mind, it made think of a remake of FFVII more possible on Wii because of the franchise's fame and will be a lot easier to strike back hard with a known title. On the other hand, it would look like that they are using theur previois games as defense for not developing an original title.

This is why Crystal Bearers will be made as close to a final Fantasy game as possible in terms of quality. But besides Chocobo's Dungeon, they need a full RPG flagship. the chances are

  1. FFXIII, which I find it hard. Sony needs this game more than any other.
  2. FFVII remake, but will have to be less like the Adven Childern models and more like the CG cutscenes from the PS1 game. Besides it may give an image that they are unable to make original games successful on Wii.
  3. Kingdom Hearts 3, but if the rumors about the NA version of the PS2 games that weren't localized, this is ruled out. Besides Sony would not let it go as well that easily.
  4. Revive with Full Strenght other franchises: Chrono, Mana, Musasshi, Saga.

I find it hard to come up with an original IP for the need to stop a disruption

 

FF is exactly what is bringing down SE at the moment.Due to their insecurities they have gone into a play safe mode when it comes to their titles.Look at the sheer number of FF ports, remakes and spinoffs being made in such a period of time.The problem is that most of SE fans aren't truly SE fans, but FF fans.

SE have released quite a number of other well made rpgs but due to SE's attitude of playing safe, they push the FF games into the focus of the audience instead of games such as TWEWY and the like.

Unless they can reinvent the series much like Nintendo did with NSMB,Galaxy and MKDS/Wii I can see FF starting to shrink slowly as the decade goes on.

SE should have a dedicated team on the side trying to create a new/existing(preferably new, since it would be fresh) franchise with the intent of it being greater than FF and attract newer players as well as the old FF fans.Once they have absorbed the old market they can then focus on making FF with smaller budgets and try to reinvent it now that less pressure is being put on the expectation of the game,or simply scrap the series altogether if FF doesn't transition too well into this 3rd generation of gaming that the DS/Wii has spawned.



Prediction:
Disney will make KH3 with Nintendo.Yes,KH3 will be a Disney/Nintendo crossover.

Save the industry,Kill a Hardcore gamer

Stopped buying Ubisoft games.Will not buy Red Steel 2.Let them struggle on HD. Click here for a solution:CLICK
ALERT: I have also exposed a UBI'Z'OFT viral marketer in THIS thread.Read my posts, see the set up and watch how everything crumbles on page 8. Please learn from this experience.

FishyJoe said:
You got it backwards. The big projects, DQIX & FFXIII are expected to make enough profit to fund all the other crap they make. These titles are expected to earn them several times what it cost them to develop and market. If they fail to generate huge profit, they will be considered failures.

Who me? Au contraire mon ami. You are bold faced WRONG and are being fishy with your comments. You're being vveeerrryyy fishy...Joe. The crap they make funds itself. How much do you really think these little DS projects take to make?

 



Tag: Became a freaking mod and a complete douche, coincidentally, at the same time.



Big franchises are expected to pull in mega profits. Look at GTAIV, that game alone pretty much keeps T2 alive. The same goes with SE, their big franchises are expected to pull in huge profits or the company will shrivel and die.

If low budget shovelware were so profitable, then THQ would be king. Instead EA, Activision and to a lesser degree SE are the big dogs because they have the big names pulling in big profits.



Bored4life said: 

FF is exactly what is bringing down SE at the moment.Due to their insecurities they have gone into a play safe mode when it comes to their titles.Look at the sheer number of FF ports, remakes and spinoffs being made in such a period of time.The problem is that most of SE fans aren't truly SE fans, but FF fans.

SE have released quite a number of other well made rpgs but due to SE's attitude of playing safe, they push the FF games into the focus of the audience instead of games such as TWEWY and the like.

Unless they can reinvent the series much like Nintendo did with NSMB,Galaxy and MKDS/Wii I can see FF starting to shrink slowly as the decade goes on.

SE should have a dedicated team on the side trying to create a new/existing(preferably new, since it would be fresh) franchise with the intent of it being greater than FF and attract newer players as well as the old FF fans.Once they have absorbed the old market they can then focus on making FF with smaller budgets and try to reinvent it now that less pressure is being put on the expectation of the game,or simply scrap the series altogether if FF doesn't transition too well into this 3rd generation of gaming that the DS/Wii has spawned.

I think the teams have been made already. Their first battlefront is the DS to explore possibilities on Wii.

Also, look at the Crystal Cronicles Franchise, The DS and WiiWare approach are the first signs that they want to make it a franchise on its own... They just need to take out the FF from it because they are very different. They gave a lot more support to the dev team

And with the port of Chrono Trigger out of the blue, many can speculate that they plan to revive it, for it had potential to be as good or even better than FF

 



the_bloodwalker said:
Bored4life said:

FF is exactly what is bringing down SE at the moment.Due to their insecurities they have gone into a play safe mode when it comes to their titles.Look at the sheer number of FF ports, remakes and spinoffs being made in such a period of time.The problem is that most of SE fans aren't truly SE fans, but FF fans.

SE have released quite a number of other well made rpgs but due to SE's attitude of playing safe, they push the FF games into the focus of the audience instead of games such as TWEWY and the like.

Unless they can reinvent the series much like Nintendo did with NSMB,Galaxy and MKDS/Wii I can see FF starting to shrink slowly as the decade goes on.

SE should have a dedicated team on the side trying to create a new/existing(preferably new, since it would be fresh) franchise with the intent of it being greater than FF and attract newer players as well as the old FF fans.Once they have absorbed the old market they can then focus on making FF with smaller budgets and try to reinvent it now that less pressure is being put on the expectation of the game,or simply scrap the series altogether if FF doesn't transition too well into this 3rd generation of gaming that the DS/Wii has spawned.

I think the teams have been made already. Their first battlefront is the DS to explore possibilities on Wii.

Also, look at the Crystal Cronicles Franchise, The DS and WiiWare approach are the first signs that they want to make it a franchise on its own... They just need to take out the FF from it because they are very different. They gave a lot more support to the dev team

And with the port of Chrono Trigger out of the blue, many can speculate that they plan to revive it, for it had potential to be as good or even better than FF

 

 

Agreed.The name will decrease the value in the eyes of gamers since even though this game might be of AAA quality it will still only be seen "as another spinoff title for Wii while HD consoles get the main ones".



Prediction:
Disney will make KH3 with Nintendo.Yes,KH3 will be a Disney/Nintendo crossover.

Save the industry,Kill a Hardcore gamer

Stopped buying Ubisoft games.Will not buy Red Steel 2.Let them struggle on HD. Click here for a solution:CLICK
ALERT: I have also exposed a UBI'Z'OFT viral marketer in THIS thread.Read my posts, see the set up and watch how everything crumbles on page 8. Please learn from this experience.