MikeB said: @LordTheNightKnight MikeB, I asked for a list, not a number. If you can link to one, I don't have to see them all, just see there actually were that many games. Right now, I only have your word, which equals a grain of salt. http://obligement.free.fr/articles/listejeuxamigaa.php http://hol.abime.net/ Happy now?

 Nice list, even if I don't know French. Yet it doesn't look like 4500 games.

JDWolf36 said: JSF the DVD format has been around a little over 10 years what's your point if the blu-ray format takes 7 that's to long. The argument I've never understood throughout this whole thing is PC games have never had this limitation on disk space you could easily of put a game like Oblivion on two DVD9 disk and made it much bigger than it already is but it didn't happen games in 2000 could easily of been on 2 or 3 CD's if they wanted to be closer to 2-3GB of space but they weren't the point of all that is to watch history and how games how grown over time a high tech game in 2000 came in a little under 1GB of space one in 2005 came in right around 4.7GB is the industry going to grow past 25GB this generation I doubt it for most games based off that jump and that a 15 year old Dell CRT monitor can display in 720p resolution. As a medium reaches its limits you will probably see it in the games such as FF9 being on 4 disk but to my knowledge that had no correlation to the price of the game. Also MikeB did I see 25 amiga mine games in that list?

The point is you can argue how you don't mind swapping discs all you want.  The fact is that technology 
will continue to progress with or without you.  What ends up happening is that you simply tag along, which
is why you now have a DVD drive on your computer even though, as you said yourself, a CD drive would have done the job just as well.  Blue opticals will be forcefed to everyone as the new standard within the next four years.  Toshiba is already looking to push HD-DVD as standard on all its computers.  As part of this push, prices will come down and it will become more cost effective to buy blue optical media versus old stuff like CD and DVD.  That is what has happened to CD when DVD pushed it aside.  If the Dreamcast were still alive at the end of the last gen, it would not have worked out to still be buying CD's when DVD's have clearly become the bargain since the start of the last gen.  Sure, I suppose if you don't back up games and don't mind all the disc swapping and have all sorts of free shelf space for all the extra discs, this might not be as big a deal.

As for the growth of data use, I remember all of the PS2's launch titles were on single CD's.  Today, the average PS2 game would require at least 4 CD's each.

 

@sienr

I think you mean to say you generally like the art direction found in most Super Nintendo games better, but that doesn't have much to do with technical specs. Any of those colors on the Snes can be reproduced on the A1200 with its 16.7 million color pallette, but vice versa is no the case.

Amiga games tend to be a bit darker and offer less contrast overall, suiting the suspense and sometimes horrific nature found in its diverse games library, but Amigas could easily generate colorfully vibrant worlds and had it share of colorful platformers appealing also to Teletubbie kids as well:

Marvin (A1200)

http://hol.abime.net/2415/screenshot

http://hol.abime.net/2416/screenshot

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m-ZE6lxjX68

@ LordTheNightKnight

I haven't counted all the entries myself, but that's what the site statistics state. I will take their word for it as they have a good reputation.

Let us know when you're done counting.

JSF said: The point is you can argue how you don't mind swapping discs all you want.  The fact is that technology  will continue to progress with or without you.  What ends up happening is that you simply tag along, which is why you now have a DVD drive on your computer even though, as you said yourself, a CD drive would have done the job just as well.  Blue opticals will be forcefed to everyone as the new standard within the next four years.  Toshiba is already looking to push HD-DVD as standard on all its computers.  As part of this push, prices will come down and it will become more cost effective to buy blue optical media versus old stuff like CD and DVD.  That is what has happened to CD when DVD pushed it aside.  If the Dreamcast were still alive at the end of the last gen, it would not have worked out to still be buying CD's when DVD's have clearly become the bargain since the start of the last gen.  Sure, I suppose if you don't back up games and don't mind all the disc swapping and have all sorts of free shelf space for all the extra discs, this might not be as big a deal. As for the growth of data use, I remember all of the PS2's launch titles were on single CD's.  Today, the average PS2 game would require at least 4 CD's each.

JSF, apparently we were making different points. My point was that blue optical is a mistake on a console RIGHT NOW. Sony screwed up by using such bleeding edge tech in a gaming device and it's akin to them delaying PS1 by one year and going with DVD in 1996. It's too new.

Well let's assume there are that many. The thing is that list is apparently for every region, while the 750 number is just for SNES games in North America. A lot more were made in Japan, which would make the number much higher. Not likely as high as 4500, but being a computer, the Amiga apparently didn't need strict licensing rules, which Nintendo implemented to avoid a flood of games and another crash.

@JSF:

Do you know when DVD was finalized? Dec 1995, my friend. It was more than 4 years old by the time the PS2 came out. And you talk of the PS2 and Xbox as if the Gamecube didn't use DVDs too - physically, those were pretty standard 8cm DVDs. By the time the 6th generation came DVDs were more than ready for it. All consoles, except for the Dreamcast (which used 1.2GiB GD-ROMs, not CD-ROMs) used them, while managing to keep the launch prices of their predecessors: $200 for the GC (vs. N64), and $300 for the PS2 (vs. PS1) - this in America and Japan too (Europe was historically raped).

Higher density optical formats are the future, be it HD-DVD or BluRay. But they sure ain't the present, at least not at $200-300, and they won't be for a while. They forced the PS3 into basically doubling its price, and to delay its launch. This is in no way similar to what happend last generation, it's far more alike the PS1 being delayed for a year into 1995, early 1996, to sport a DVD drive at $600.

KruzeS said: @JSF: Do you know when DVD was finalized? Dec 1995, my friend. It was more than 4 years old by the time the PS2 came out. And you talk of the PS2 and Xbox as if the Gamecube didn't use DVDs too - physically, those were pretty standard 8cm DVDs. By the time the 6th generation came DVDs were more than ready for it. All consoles, except for the Dreamcast (which used 1.2GiB GD-ROMs, not CD-ROMs) used them, while managing to keep the launch prices of their predecessors: $200 for the GC (vs. N64), and $300 for the PS2 (vs. PS1) - this in America and Japan too (Europe was historically raped). Higher density optical formats are the future, be it HD-DVD or BluRay. But they sure ain't the present, at least not at $200-300, and they won't be for a while. They forced the PS3 into basically doubling its price, and to delay its launch. This is in no way similar to what happend last generation, it's far more alike the PS1 being delayed for a year into 1995, early 1996, to sport a DVD drive at $600.

Yep. And in terms of performance, HD-DVD and blu-ray are actually slow for 7th gen needs. When drives can read about 100MB a second, then HD discs will be a good investment.

Here's my main issue with HD-DVD/Blu-Ray:

CD-Rom was a 10-year lifespan, DVDs were around 10, but Blu-Ray, most likely, won't make it out of this gen without being replaced by a much bigger capacity with faster read times.

What's the succuessor to Blu-Ray? Holographic Versatile Disks. They're already out, hold 200+ GB of data, and their transfer rate is in the 1+ gigabit range already.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holographic_Versatile_Disc

HVD came out in September, with a 200gb disk already. The readers and disks are insanely expensive, but that was last year - by the time next-gen rolls around in 2010-2013, HVD and the other formats will be easily available, and provide HUGE leaps versus Blu-Ray, as they have much faster reading times (HVD is 4x faster than a 16 speed DVD, since it uses multiple lasers, exponentially increasing read times).

So when PS3 starts in being 100% optimized and utilized, and devs need 20+gb, we'll have 200gb drives available. Not only that, HVD's are scalable as far as I know, allowing for more freedom on their sizes and storage caps.

mrstickball said: Here's my main issue with HD-DVD/Blu-Ray: CD-Rom was a 10-year lifespan, DVDs were around 10, but Blu-Ray, most likely, won't make it out of this gen without being replaced by a much bigger capacity with faster read times. What's the succuessor to Blu-Ray? Holographic Versatile Disks. They're already out, hold 200+ GB of data, and their transfer rate is in the 1+ gigabit range already. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holographic_Versatile_Disc HVD came out in September, with a 200gb disk already. The readers and disks are insanely expensive, but that was last year - by the time next-gen rolls around in 2010-2013, HVD and the other formats will be easily available, and provide HUGE leaps versus Blu-Ray, as they have much faster reading times (HVD is 4x faster than a 16 speed DVD, since it uses multiple lasers, exponentially increasing read times). So when PS3 starts in being 100% optimized and utilized, and devs need 20+gb, we'll have 200gb drives available. Not only that, HVD's are scalable as far as I know, allowing for more freedom on their sizes and storage caps.

Wow interesting stuff mrstickball.  I didn't know about HVD at all.  I can't imagine anyone supporting EITHER blu-ray or HD-DVD when that tech becomes affordable.  It certainly won't take 10 years for it to be.