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Pyro as Bill said:

Companies pay the triff and (eventually) pass it onto to consumers just like they do with corporation tax. All taxes on companies are indirect taxes on consumers.

Not in the same way. 

Taxing on profits is less regressive than taxing on everything. 



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sc94597 said:
Bofferbrauer2 said:

Only under VERY specific circumstances, as in, you're either absolutely physically or mentally unable to earn any income, or you're a prisoner. Selling of your possessions wouldn't be enough to be eligible, otherwise all the homeless would benefit from it, which they don't.

Pyro as Bill is indeed wrong about everyone who needs Medicaid getting it. Having said that, a fifth of all Americans get their insurance through Medicaid and many more than that (up to a third of the population in some states) qualify, but don't apply for it, because they think they don't qualify. It would be hard to find an American who doesn't have a family or friend who has gotten insurance through Medicaid. Copays for Medicaid are about $0-$5, and hospital stays around $20/week. So essentially "free" in the average European sense (multipayer universal healthcare with some cost sharing.)

How easy it is to get Medicaid and how much it covers (beyond a federal minimum) varies from state to state though. Purple states, ironically, have the best Medicaid services because elections are competitive and it is an easy win for politicians. A good number of blue states have inclusive Medicaid as well. Red states lag behind, considerably. 

Most homeless people qualify for Medicaid but not having a home makes the application process tricky and you have to actively apply to get coverage beyond "emergency medicaid." Hospitals will have homeless people auto-applied into emergency Medicaid because it is a way for them to get paid by the state for mandatory emergency care. 

So everyone who qualifies gets it if they apply and everyone qualifies if they have no money?



Nov 2016 - NES outsells PS1 (JP)

Don't Play Stationary 4 ever. Switch!

the-pi-guy said:
Pyro as Bill said:

Companies pay the triff and (eventually) pass it onto to consumers just like they do with corporation tax. All taxes on companies are indirect taxes on consumers.

Not in the same way. 

Taxing on profits is less regressive than taxing on everything. 

Regressive and progressive are subjective. My point stands.



Nov 2016 - NES outsells PS1 (JP)

Don't Play Stationary 4 ever. Switch!

the-pi-guy said:
Pyro as Bill said:

The antivaxers making a name for themselves now are all doing it when there's no real emergency and most seem a bit tapped in the head. The antivaxers at the start of the pandemic were doing it for political reasons. Hopefully a more dangerous and virulent covid strain returns and we can expose all the hypocrites while we play our Switch 2 under another lockdown.

Those people are not antivaxxers. They were pro-vaccine. They were concerned that the Trump administration would push a bad vaccine for political reasons. When that wasn't the case, they heavily pushed vaccines - when the science showed it was effective. 

You're being incredibly dishonest. 

Pedantry. There's plenty of (covid) antivaxers who are still provax. Point stands.

The only antivaxers with serious political clout and influence were Democrats and they did it cos they were anti-Trump. Who cares what Joe Rogan is saying in 2025 ffs?



Nov 2016 - NES outsells PS1 (JP)

Don't Play Stationary 4 ever. Switch!

Pyro as Bill said:
Machiavellian said:

I invite you to come to America poor and see exactly how much you get.  I believe you have absolutely no ideal what you are talking about.  Being seen and being treated is a whole different story when you do not have any money.  While welfare works much better if you are a child, try believing as an adult you will get the same treatment with no money and poor.

So let's tax billionairre companies more just like Trump is doing.

Huh, where exactly are you getting that Trump is taxing billionaire companies. Not sure if you fully understand how the American government works if you believe that line.



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Pyro as Bill said:

Regressive and progressive are subjective. My point stands.

It's not subjective. 

Regressive and progressive tax schemes have testable definitions. 

Pyro as Bill said:

Pedantry. There's plenty of (covid) antivaxers who are still provax. Point stands.

Pretty much all of the people you're claiming were antivaxx were provax when the vaccine actually was created. Because their hesitation had nothing to do with vaccinations themselves. 



Machiavellian said:
Pyro as Bill said:

So let's tax billionairre companies more just like Trump is doing.

Huh, where exactly are you getting that Trump is taxing billionaire companies. Not sure if you fully understand how the American government works if you believe that line.

Million and billion dollar companies are paying higher taxes/tariffs just like everyone says they should. People are only mad cos they're likely going to pass those costs on like they do for every other tax.



Nov 2016 - NES outsells PS1 (JP)

Don't Play Stationary 4 ever. Switch!

Pyro as Bill said:
sc94597 said:

Pyro as Bill is indeed wrong about everyone who needs Medicaid getting it. Having said that, a fifth of all Americans get their insurance through Medicaid and many more than that (up to a third of the population in some states) qualify, but don't apply for it, because they think they don't qualify. It would be hard to find an American who doesn't have a family or friend who has gotten insurance through Medicaid. Copays for Medicaid are about $0-$5, and hospital stays around $20/week. So essentially "free" in the average European sense (multipayer universal healthcare with some cost sharing.)

How easy it is to get Medicaid and how much it covers (beyond a federal minimum) varies from state to state though. Purple states, ironically, have the best Medicaid services because elections are competitive and it is an easy win for politicians. A good number of blue states have inclusive Medicaid as well. Red states lag behind, considerably. 

Most homeless people qualify for Medicaid but not having a home makes the application process tricky and you have to actively apply to get coverage beyond "emergency medicaid." Hospitals will have homeless people auto-applied into emergency Medicaid because it is a way for them to get paid by the state for mandatory emergency care. 

So everyone who qualifies gets it if they apply and everyone qualifies if they have no money?

Nope, you get treated yes but if there is any serious condition you get sent out the door.  It's not what you think.  Even with most insurances, a lot of procedures are not covered in America and if you are poor with no health insurance even less.  Couple that with medication and it's even worse.  Until you are on it do not act as if its just some free ride for everyone, it isn't and many die because they do not have a basic level of insurance to cover the cost of procedures.



the-pi-guy said:
Pyro as Bill said:

Regressive and progressive are subjective. My point stands.

It's not subjective. 

Regressive and progressive tax schemes have testable definitions. 

Pyro as Bill said:

Pedantry. There's plenty of (covid) antivaxers who are still provax. Point stands.

Pretty much all of the people you're claiming were antivaxx were provax when the vaccine actually was created. Because their hesitation had nothing to do with vaccinations themselves. 

Those people implying Trump was going to force an untested vax on people (at the height of the pandemic) are more dangerous than Joe Rogan doing it in 2025.



Nov 2016 - NES outsells PS1 (JP)

Don't Play Stationary 4 ever. Switch!

Pyro as Bill said:
Ryuu96 said:

You aren't making sense, you're saying it's both free but at the same time you have to sell everything you own, so it's not free, Lol. The USA does have good medical treatment though, I never said the actual medical treatment itself was bad, but I will also say that "if you can afford it" is a pretty massive caveat in many peoples cases and is dismissive that millions simply cannot afford it.

Healthy nations are better for the country overall, a stronger workforce, a happier nation, etc. Now imagine all those people living pay check to pay check or on welfare, barely being able to afford electricity or food bills, they don't even have to be in a medical emergency life or death situation to now be in debt by the tune of thousands, now they're struggling even more, what does that lead to? Even worse living conditions, even more medical problems, both physically and mentally and mental health is equally as important as physical health.

I'm not even someone who is against having a private option either, Lol. But you have extreme rose tinted views on America and I had to call out your hyperbolic nonsense with actual first hand experience myself as a British citizen, I feel like the argument keeps changing slightly though, first it was a ridiculous hyperbole comment about healthcare applied to Europe as a whole, when that was called out, the argument changed to welfare specifically in Romania.

Breaking News: Eastern Europe is less wealthy than Western Europe.

It's free if you don't have the assets to pay towards treatment. What's so difficult to understand?

Because at first you said it's free but you'd have to sell everything you own and all your children's inheritance, Lmao. So now I'm understanding your argument is that if you literally own nothing then treatment is free? Again, I'm not sure that's as good of an argument as you think it is, Lol. Anyway, now three Americans are saying that you're wrong or at least not giving the full facts so I'll defer to them.

Pyro as Bill said:
Ryuu96 said:

Sometimes I'm curious how much debt me and my family would have been in living in America from my medical bills, then I think who cares, I don't have to think about that, my last trip to the hospital was like a stay at a hotel, 3 meals a day, my own room, amazing staff, my own shower, I was almost disappointed they discharged me so quickly! Lmao. Jk.

They do both have major issues though, but that's the perks of Tories mismanaging everything for over 10 years.

That's great but in the real world bills have to be paid and there's no free lunch. Just cos your government goes into massive debt to pay for the insurance doesn't mean you're kids won't pay it back tenfold in debt interest and the lack of productivity.

Don't worry, I pay my bills, I'm happy to pay my way so that others in the country can also receive free medical treatment because crazily enough, I think that a country should take care of its citizens and a healthy and happy country is best for the country. As for the debt situation, I'll provide you with this chart to illustrate the debt differences across the world.

Global Debt Database - Central Government Debt

Donald Trump Built a National Debt So Big (Even Before the Pandemic) That It’ll Weigh Down the Economy for Years

Good thing debt in America isn't an issue.

Trump Wants To Extend US Debt Ceiling, Says He Doesn't Want To See A Default

Pyro as Bill said:
Bofferbrauer2 said:

LNG: Canada.

Military Hardware: We'll produce them ourselves now. Those 800 Billion € will get spent for the most part on European products, and Military Hardware production is increasing fast throughout Europe.

Net loser: The US, especially considering that until the 2010's more than half of the military hardware bought in Europe was American-made. But going forward this number will go down drastically entirely due to Trump. I'm sure the Military-industrial Complex in the US is very thankful already to Trump already for losing hundreds of billions in potential contracts by default already now.

Canada doesn't have the capacity yet and Europe will freeze over Winter before they do.....without US LNG.

Yeah we'll make our own except if we did that already we wouldn't be buying US. Kind of ironic that the only other bloc that could seriously compete with the US is Europe but it would mean "securing" energy from the ME and Russia and no-one has the balls. They spent 3 years debating whether it's ok to send long range missiles meanwhile Trump lowkey kills the Russian economy.

Dude accidentally hurt the Russian economy and if you were following things, the Russian economy was starting to collapse already thanks to Biden's sanctions but it took longer than expected, sanctions aren't an overnight thing and Russia and turned into a war economy country. Regardless, Trump hasn't put tariffs on Russia despite trading billions with Russia still.

Anyway I heavily attacked Biden for his cowardice in sending long-range missiles, that doesn't mean Trump is any better, Lol.

Last edited by Ryuu96 - on 06 April 2025