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Forums - Politics Discussion - The US is ranked as a 'Flawed Democracy', what needs to change?

It's not a flawed democracy, it's a flawed republic. But even so, it's the flaws that make it what it is and allow it to change and grow and bend its way along. So I don't think anything needs to change. There has always been periods of social and political upheaval in the US. We're in one right now. Soon, it'll be over and things will carry on as usual.



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This entire thread is an example of everything that is wrong with US politics. The main problem is people disputing the vote, the left and the right. Fix it? Nope, nobody here even wants to fix it. So honestly who cares. You get what you deserve. No problems in other countries, I see a lot of Americans talking about changing everything and they have grand schemes, but they won't get the basics right.



the-pi-guy said:
ConservagameR said:

I'm going to refer you to a few rich famous people who were extremely well liked, until they were not, more recently. Worth 1000 words.

 

You can't be serious. 

These people were not silenced. 

Jumpin said:
ConservagameR said:

I'm going to refer you to a few rich famous people who were extremely well liked, until they were not, more recently. Worth 1000 words.

 

In case anyone missed it, this is Conservagamer showing that not even in a picture worth a thousand words can he find a lick of evidence for his argument of people being silenced.

The EIU lists the US as a flawed democracy, but freedom of speech is the one area the country does exceedingly well in—scoring 9.58/10 on the EIU’s democracy index.

Why did Elon and Kanye not care at all about control over social media, only being able to use it themselves, until somewhat recently?

Why did they then both go out of their way to spend ridiculous amounts of money to have full control over these so called free speech platforms?

To fix them because so many people are being wrongly silenced, and to own the platforms themselves to make sure they won't ever be silenced.

Want to make sure that you or others can speak freely? Don't rely on democratic rights or morals, instead rely on the free market and capitalism to make yourself (tens of) billions of dollars, otherwise you very well may be kept quiet.



ConservagameR said:

Why did Elon and Kanye not care at all about control over social media, only being able to use it themselves, until somewhat recently?

Why did they then both go out of their way to spend ridiculous amounts of money to have full control over these so called free speech platforms?

To fix them because so many people are being wrongly silenced, and to own the platforms themselves to make sure they won't ever be silenced.

Want to make sure that you or others can speak freely? Don't rely on democratic rights or morals, instead rely on the free market and capitalism to make yourself (tens of) billions of dollars, otherwise you very well may be kept quiet.

Elon Musk was absolutely not silenced in any way. Despite the fact that he was spreading authoritarian propaganda, he still has a lively twitter account.

Being scared of being "silenced", doesn't make it so. 

Kanye isn't "fixing" Parler.  



the-pi-guy said:
ConservagameR said:

Why did Elon and Kanye not care at all about control over social media, only being able to use it themselves, until somewhat recently?

Why did they then both go out of their way to spend ridiculous amounts of money to have full control over these so called free speech platforms?

To fix them because so many people are being wrongly silenced, and to own the platforms themselves to make sure they won't ever be silenced.

Want to make sure that you or others can speak freely? Don't rely on democratic rights or morals, instead rely on the free market and capitalism to make yourself (tens of) billions of dollars, otherwise you very well may be kept quiet.

Elon Musk was absolutely not silenced in any way. Despite the fact that he was spreading authoritarian propaganda, he still has a lively twitter account.

Being scared of being "silenced", doesn't make it so. 

Kanye isn't "fixing" Parler.  

Where did I say Elon was silenced? I simply referred you to him as his more recent situations are very much about this as a whole.

I personally don't find him attempting to help Ukraine with Starlink as authoritarian or propaganda, but you're free to think that if that's your view.

I did mention fixing the platform, which Elon has said he plans to do to Twitter, and both he and Kanye with Parler have suggested they want to change and expand both platforms for the good of the consumer.

Kanye isn't just scared, it's clear an attempt is being made to keep him quiet and to cancel him. I don't believe Elon has expressed worry, but to think he isn't worried whatsoever would be naive given who has been shut out of social media.



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Popular vote would be a big step.
Getting rid of gerrymandering as well. And the law that makes it legal for companies to bribe politicians.

ConservagameR said:
the-pi-guy said:

You can't be serious. 

These people were not silenced. 

Jumpin said:

In case anyone missed it, this is Conservagamer showing that not even in a picture worth a thousand words can he find a lick of evidence for his argument of people being silenced.

The EIU lists the US as a flawed democracy, but freedom of speech is the one area the country does exceedingly well in—scoring 9.58/10 on the EIU’s democracy index.

Why did Elon and Kanye not care at all about control over social media, only being able to use it themselves, until somewhat recently?

Why did they then both go out of their way to spend ridiculous amounts of money to have full control over these so called free speech platforms?

To fix them because so many people are being wrongly silenced, and to own the platforms themselves to make sure they won't ever be silenced.

Want to make sure that you or others can speak freely? Don't rely on democratic rights or morals, instead rely on the free market and capitalism to make yourself (tens of) billions of dollars, otherwise you very well may be kept quiet.

Define wrongly silenced?
Because Twitter decides who and what they want to give their microphone to. What is right or wrong on their platform has to adhere to their community guidfelines and terms of service.

Should anyone be able to say anything they like, including death threats and harassment?
Do you think every person we've ever moderated on this forum was wrongly silenced as well?
Because if your answer is no, then understand that this isn't an issue of a universal right or wrong, but that different people will draw the lines differently.

And to answer your rhetorical question, Musk and Kanye are interested in erasing that line for things like hate speech and baseless/harmful missinformation.
And I don't think that's admirable.

Last edited by Hiku - on 27 October 2022

Eagle367 said:
Ka-pi96 said:

Yes, it is. Democracy is letting people vote, there shouldn't be any restrictions on who they can vote for. Also, you never addressed the issue of who exactly gets to determine who's eligible or not. Plenty of incredibly authoritarian countries hold elections where there are no eligible opponents because they won't allow them to run for election, that's definitely not democratic.

I did address it. Having criteria for who gets to run. Countries have them already. Like you wouldn't let a treasonous traitor run right? What about someone who wants another country to take over yours? What you said describes why these people need to be stopped because they can win one legitimate election and then slowly chip away and destroy democracy. That's what Orban did, Modhi is doing it, erdogan did it, Trump wanted to do it, Putin did it. Your democracy doesn't survive if you have no protections against anti democratic agents.

Answer this question, should a monarchist be allowed to run in an election when they promise to destroy the democracy that will give them power and institute themselves as supreme leader?

Of course they should. If the monarchist gets elected, it's the people's will. 



Ei Kiinasti.

Eikä Japanisti.

Vaan pannaan jalalla koreasti.

 

Nintendo games sell only on Nintendo system.

bdbdbd said:
Eagle367 said:

I did address it. Having criteria for who gets to run. Countries have them already. Like you wouldn't let a treasonous traitor run right? What about someone who wants another country to take over yours? What you said describes why these people need to be stopped because they can win one legitimate election and then slowly chip away and destroy democracy. That's what Orban did, Modhi is doing it, erdogan did it, Trump wanted to do it, Putin did it. Your democracy doesn't survive if you have no protections against anti democratic agents.

Answer this question, should a monarchist be allowed to run in an election when they promise to destroy the democracy that will give them power and institute themselves as supreme leader?

Of course they should. If the monarchist gets elected, it's the people's will. 

As a nihilist that would be an acceptable outcome, but in reality with so much at stake that would be catastrophic outcome for the people long term

Putin is the effective "monarch" of Russia because he and others in Russia have eroded Democrat institutions to the point the Russian people have no peaceful say in his reign and the direction he is taking his country 



ConservagameR said:
the-pi-guy said:

Elon Musk was absolutely not silenced in any way. Despite the fact that he was spreading authoritarian propaganda, he still has a lively twitter account.

Being scared of being "silenced", doesn't make it so. 

Kanye isn't "fixing" Parler.  

Where did I say Elon was silenced? I simply referred you to him as his more recent situations are very much about this as a whole.

I personally don't find him attempting to help Ukraine with Starlink as authoritarian or propaganda, but you're free to think that if that's your view.

Kanye isn't just scared, it's clear an attempt is being made to keep him quiet and to cancel him. I don't believe Elon has expressed worry, but to think he isn't worried whatsoever would be naive given who has been shut out of social media.

>Where did I say Elon was silenced?

You shared a picture of him when I asked who was silenced. 

>personally don't find him attempting to help Ukraine with Starlink as authoritarian or propaganda

Has nothing to do with starlink.

Has to do with a tweet he made where he said what Ukraine should do. 

No one is getting cancelled for having conservative views. No one has ever gotten cancelled for arguing for lower taxes. People are getting consequences for things like hate speech. 

Our words have consequences, spreading misinformation can get people killed. People have died from vaccine misinformation. Hate speech against trans, gay, or other minorities gets people riled up. 



When you have people like Biden in power no one takes the US seriously anymore. You have no idea how many mock videos I see on 微博,抖音,微信 etc making him out to be an absolute airhead. Yes, I know they are all government funded and run, but still. His whole party is a joke on the world stage, just look at the US recent relationship with Saudi Arabia shows the world that no one takes the US seriously anymore.



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