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Forums - Microsoft - MS: 1st party Xbox games will be cross-gen for "next year, two years"

sales2099 on 11 February 2020

Koi

eva01beserk said:
Conina said:

$100 or $200 premium compared to what? To the competing console (PS5)? Or to the predecessor (Xbox One X)?

How much is a ton of PS5 exclusives?#

And why do you think most of Sony's PS5-releases won't be cross-gen games and remasters?

Let's have a look at the SCEA releases of the first PS4 years:

........did you see what's crosgen? Or did you just count them? Its little A to AA games that are crosgen. The big guns are ps4 exclusive. Plus most of thouse games arent even made by Sony. Could be publish by them I dont know.

Knack: Metacritic 54

Killzone Shadowfall: 73

Infamous Second Sun: 80

Drive club: 71

The Order 1886: 63

These are the 1st party “true exclusives” Sony released in the same time frame that Xbox would do its cross gen initiative. Ya.....so much quality here. Real heavy hitters that gamers mention in the same sentence as GOW, Spider-Man and Uncharted 4. 

So really the argument is that in the same time frame this upcoming gen, Sony will get off 3-5 exclusives but if history is any indication, they won’t be their best and won’t make the best use of the hardware. 

Where as Xbox is giving us their best. Halo is a 5 year developed game instead of 3, Forza 8 will be 3 years instead of the usual 2. Ironically the best PS5 early exclusive will be the cross gen Last of Us 2 ;)

Last edited by sales2099 - on 11 February 2020

Xbox: Best hardware, Game Pass best value, best BC, more 1st party genres and multiplayer titles. 

 

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sales2099 on 11 February 2020
HollyGamer said:
sales2099 said:

Well that just settles the argument here and now. Sony incredibly guilty of the same practice. Thanks for doing the homework :)

Glad they are move on and change for better, while Xbox still on the past.  Also that's not "crossgen" instead an old port :) :) :)  

Lol I think you missed the point. Cross gen, ports.....it’s the same game that can be done on both generations. 

Knack: 54

Killzone Shadowfall: 73

Infamous Second Sun: 80

Drive club: 71

The Order 1886: 63

Lets see...knack just a bad game. Killzone Shadowfall a notable drop in quality from its predecessors. But hey it squeezed 100% out of PS4 hardware so it’s ok right???

Infamous SS could be easily downgraded for PS3 if they wanted. Drive Club was plagued with online issues. The Order has some controversy with fake 1080p and was way too short. 

Point being these titles weren’t their best and they still couldn’t get the most out of the system at launch. Quality will always speak louder. I just hope Sony doesn’t do the same bait and switch tactics for the first 2 years. 

Last edited by sales2099 - on 11 February 2020

Xbox: Best hardware, Game Pass best value, best BC, more 1st party genres and multiplayer titles. 

 

sales2099 on 11 February 2020
goopy20 said:
sales2099 said:

Oh no what will we do?!?!?!? We will just have to get by playing the superior 3rd party games while we play quality cross gen games. And then for 90% of the gen Series X will have the power advantage in all games. Woe is me! 

Stop being so dramatic. The post above with Conina charts show PS4 non cross gen titles weren’t that plentiful. Knack, KZ, Infamous and Drive Club. All games that are average or below, with Infamous being the best game but hardly “next gen” as it could easily have had a downgraded PS3 version imo. 

 Your argument has even more holes.....congrats PS5 will release a few true exclusives (and likely not their best) before MS drops the cross gen initiative. You say 2 years, I’ll say 1 since the quote said both. Big whoop LOL. 

I think you're forgetting in what kind of situation the Xbox is. Sony just had the 2nd best selling console of all time, while the X1 sold roughly half of what the 360 did. Sony has a lot of momentum going and like I said, the only way the Series X is going to succeed is if they come out swinging and make it crystal clear from the get go why people should spend $100 or $200 more on the Series X. Sony was in the exact situation with the ps3, it was more expensive and more powerful than the 360 and it came out a year later to boot. To make things worse, 3rd party developers weren't willing or able to make good use of the Cell and most games actually ended up looking better on the cheaper 360. The only way for Sony to showcase that the ps3 was more powerful and worth the premium, was with their exclusives. And while it was rough, Sony still managed to beat the 360 with their exclusives alone. This should tell you that exclusives are important and they can make or break a console, especially early on in the console cycle. Hell, we probably wouldn't even have a X1 if the original Xbox didn't launch with Halo back in the day.

Imo MS's strategy for next gen should be to at least try to launch with awesome games that showcase the hardware. By making them cross gen and multi platform, MS is shooting themselves in the foot as they now have no way of doing that, at least not in the first 2 years where it counts the most. And sure, you can assume that the first wave of ps5 exclusives will suck, but if only half of that list of rumored ps5 launch titles is true, it's already game over for the Series X. Believe it or not, but I would hate to see that happen and I would much rather see a competitive next gen that pushes both Sony and MS to release awesome games. Unfortunately, it doesn't seem like that's going to happen because again it looks like MS is having an identity crisis, fumbling around and pushing the extras like Game pass/ Xcloud that nobody cares about. Sony doesn't do that. They are pretty straightforward what they're about and that's the games, not reinventing the living room or games ecosystem. 

Thanks for the history lesson. Halo Infinite bud. It’s flagship title, made in 5 years with a cutting edge development engine.  With the aim to bring back to its glory days learning hard lessons from the past. Can’t wait for the heavy marketing to kick in. Cross gen or not, it isn’t on PS so it’s a real system seller despite options to play it.....cause guess which console it won’t be on???? (PlayStation 5).

Historically by comparison you will get Sony’s B level exclusives and it’s best title will (ironically) be the cross gen Last of Us 2. Feel free to quote me on that, I doubt any PS5 exclusives will touch it in quality.

But it’s funny you changed the goal posts. Because now you know Sony was incredibly guilty of the same practice but also the ones they did have didn’t come close to getting the most out of the hardware and weren’t their best.

Knack: 54 (straight up bad)

Killzone Shadowfall: 73 (worse then 2/3)

Infamous Second Sun: 80 (could have been PS3 too)

Drive club: 71 (plagued with online issues)

The Order 1886: 63 (fake 4K and too short)

And btw down talking Game Pass makes you look even worse. You have no idea how popular it is within the community and how insane the value is. It saves me a ton of money ever year.....you saying you enjoy getting ripped off with PSNow? I mean ok....you do you. 

Last edited by sales2099 - on 11 February 2020

Xbox: Best hardware, Game Pass best value, best BC, more 1st party genres and multiplayer titles. 

 

sales2099 on 11 February 2020
Radek said:
sales2099 said:

Lol I think you missed the point. Cross gen, ports.....it’s the same game that can be done on both generations. 

Knack: 54

Killzone Shadowfall: 73

Infamous Second Sun: 80

Drive club: 71

The Order 1886: 63

Lets see...knack just a bad game. Killzone Shadowfall a notable drop in quality from its professors. But hey it squeezed 100% out of PS4 hardware so it’s ok right???

Infamous SS could be easily downgraded for PS3 if they wanted. Drive Club was plagued with online issues. The Order has some controversy with fake 4K and was way too short. 

Point being these titles weren’t their best and they still couldn’t get the most out of the system at launch. Quality will always speak louder. I just hope Sony doesn’t do the same bait and switch tactics for the first 2 years. 

Fake 4K on console that only supports up to 1080p? What are you on about?

?? The Order was advertised as 4K but the reality was some combination of checkerboard tactics and using wide screen. I’m no PS historian but I think that’s the gist ;)



Xbox: Best hardware, Game Pass best value, best BC, more 1st party genres and multiplayer titles. 

 

goopy20 on 11 February 2020
LudicrousSpeed said:
Basically you guys have pummeled him with logic and facts and now the goal posts are shifting to “well Xbox is in this precarious position they really have to hit a grand slam!!”.

Why are you still referencing this two year next gen window when according to the interview you’re referencing he says one to two years which means at worst, the end of 2021. Aka one year of next gen. If even that. One to two years could literally mean the end of this year 😆

Also PS3 was on pace to outsell 360 from day one. Sony put out a lot of good titles because Nintendo was beating them and they were coming off the PS2 which did way better. Yeah you should hope for a competitive next gen because otherwise we’ll get lazy Sony like we did this gen with way less first party stuff and less new IPs because they didn’t really need to do anything to beat Xbone and WiiU.

Also I don’t think anyone has really said Sony launch titles SUCK, just that they, like all launch titles, do nothing that really pushes the envelope. At least, recent launch titles. I think the DC is the last time we’ve had truly jaw dropping launch titles that really show we’ve entered a new generation.

The only facts we have is MS saying their 1st party games will be cross-gen for the next 1 or 2 years. And uncle Phil saying they have no wish to compete with Sony and Nintendo anymore because Amazon and Google are now apparently their main competitors. Everything else is all assumptions, like the first wave of ps5 exclusives being nothing special and won't take advantage of of the new tech. 

You should just ask yourself this. Does, MS saying their 1st party games will be cross gen for the first 1 or 2 years, sound like a good or a bad thing to you? I mean if you're not planning on buying a next gen console in the first 2 years anyway, it's not bad news at all. However, if you do plan on buying a series X early on, then tell me you wouldn't be disappointed if Halo Infinite turns out looking like a current gen remaster. Especially when something like Horizon Zero Dawn 2 comes out and does have true next gen ai, physics, geometry and whatnot. Not saying that will happen, but we do know for a fact that both companies have totally different strategies going in. So 1, 2 or 5 Years of cross gen games, it doesn't matter. What matters is if you think it's a good or a bad thing to begin with. And seeing how defensive some people are getting, I already know the answer.   

Hopefully you'll prove me wrong but the way MS's been talking reminds me so much of when MS was trying to shove Kinect down everyone's throat with the 360 and then taking it to another stupendous level when they announced the X1. Which was pitched as a box that connects the whole living room with Kinect and also plays games. I will just leave this here as a reminder of what happened the last time MS started blabbering about their services, instead of focusing on just launching a gaming console: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KbWgUO-Rqcw

Last edited by goopy20 - on 11 February 2020

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sales2099 on 11 February 2020
goopy20 said:
LudicrousSpeed said:
Basically you guys have pummeled him with logic and facts and now the goal posts are shifting to “well Xbox is in this precarious position they really have to hit a grand slam!!”.

Why are you still referencing this two year next gen window when according to the interview you’re referencing he says one to two years which means at worst, the end of 2021. Aka one year of next gen. If even that. One to two years could literally mean the end of this year 😆

Also PS3 was on pace to outsell 360 from day one. Sony put out a lot of good titles because Nintendo was beating them and they were coming off the PS2 which did way better. Yeah you should hope for a competitive next gen because otherwise we’ll get lazy Sony like we did this gen with way less first party stuff and less new IPs because they didn’t really need to do anything to beat Xbone and WiiU.

Also I don’t think anyone has really said Sony launch titles SUCK, just that they, like all launch titles, do nothing that really pushes the envelope. At least, recent launch titles. I think the DC is the last time we’ve had truly jaw dropping launch titles that really show we’ve entered a new generation.

The only facts we have is MS saying their 1st party games will be cross-gen for the next 1 or 2 years. And uncle Phil saying they have no wish to compete with Sony and Nintendo anymore because Amazon and Google are now apparently their main competitors. Everything else is all assumptions, like the first wave of ps5 exclusives being nothing special and won't take advantage of of the new tech. 

You should just ask yourself this. Does, MS saying their 1st party games will be cross gen for the first 1 or 2 years, sound like a good or a bad thing to you? I mean if you're not planning on buying a next gen console in the first 2 years anyway, it's not bad news at all. However, if you do plan on buying a series X early on, then tell me you wouldn't be disappointed if Halo Infinite turns out looking like a current gen remaster. Especially when something like Horizon Zero Dawn 2 comes out and does have true next gen ai, physics, geometry and whatnot. Not saying that will happen, but we do know for a fact that both companies have totally different strategies going in. So 1, 2 or 5 Years of cross gen games, it doesn't matter. What matters is if you think it's a good or a bad thing to begin with. And seeing how defensive some people are getting, I already know the answer.   

Hopefully you'll prove me wrong but the way MS's been talking reminds me so much of when MS was trying to shove Kinect down everyone's throat with the 360 and then taking it to another stupendous level when they announced the X1. Which was pitched as a box that connects the whole living room with Kinect and also plays games. I will just leave this here as a reminder of what happened the last time MS started blabbering about their services, instead of focusing on just launching a gaming console: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KbWgUO-Rqcw

Ya that’s some nice mental gymnastics you doing. Comparing Game Pass...a service designed around traditional games at insane value to Kinect....a casual games peripheral. Bravo.

Im finally glad I’ve been having this discussion for over a week cause now I feel amazing going into next gen. Losing made MS hungry and now they giving us their best out the gate.

Where as Sony has zero motivation to give gamers their best out the gate...why should they? They won by a landslide and Sony has a habit of being arrogant when they on top.  Historically PS4 exclusives (that weren’t cross gen) didn’t make the most of the console nor were their best quality games. Ironically their best game will likely be Last of Us 2...a cross gen title. 

Sony forced Nintendo to do things differently since 2006 and now they forcing MS to try new things. Cross gen has its pros and cons but it’s better then Sony giving you their B tier games at launch because they expect you to buy PS for the brand name alone. Also them not giving you day 1 access to their exclusives because they want you to be good fans and give them more money upfront. XB1 losing never felt this good :)

Last edited by sales2099 - on 11 February 2020

Xbox: Best hardware, Game Pass best value, best BC, more 1st party genres and multiplayer titles. 

 

Conina on 11 February 2020
sales2099 said:
Radek said:

Fake 4K on console that only supports up to 1080p? What are you on about?

?? The Order was advertised as 4K but the reality was some combination of checkerboard tactics and using wide screen. I’m no PS historian but I think that’s the gist ;)

No, The Order was advertised as a 1080p game, but if we don't count the big black bars, it was only a 800p game. Fake4K came with the PS4 Pro.



Conina on 11 February 2020
goopy20 said:

The only facts we have is MS saying their 1st party games will be cross-gen for the next 1 or 2 years. And uncle Phil saying they have no wish to compete with Sony and Nintendo anymore because Amazon and Google are now apparently their main competitors. Everything else is all assumptions, like the first wave of ps5 exclusives being nothing special and won't take advantage of of the new tech. 

That is wrong. Saying they are seeing Amazon and Google as their main competitors in the long run doesn't mean that they have to compete with the rest.



sales2099 on 11 February 2020
Conina said:
sales2099 said:

?? The Order was advertised as 4K but the reality was some combination of checkerboard tactics and using wide screen. I’m no PS historian but I think that’s the gist ;)

No, The Order was advertised as a 1080p game, but if we don't count the big black bars, it was only a 800p game. Fake4K came with the PS4 Pro.

Ah thanks for the clarification 



Xbox: Best hardware, Game Pass best value, best BC, more 1st party genres and multiplayer titles. 

 

chakkra on 11 February 2020
goopy20 said:
LudicrousSpeed said:
Basically you guys have pummeled him with logic and facts and now the goal posts are shifting to “well Xbox is in this precarious position they really have to hit a grand slam!!”.

Why are you still referencing this two year next gen window when according to the interview you’re referencing he says one to two years which means at worst, the end of 2021. Aka one year of next gen. If even that. One to two years could literally mean the end of this year 😆

Also PS3 was on pace to outsell 360 from day one. Sony put out a lot of good titles because Nintendo was beating them and they were coming off the PS2 which did way better. Yeah you should hope for a competitive next gen because otherwise we’ll get lazy Sony like we did this gen with way less first party stuff and less new IPs because they didn’t really need to do anything to beat Xbone and WiiU.

Also I don’t think anyone has really said Sony launch titles SUCK, just that they, like all launch titles, do nothing that really pushes the envelope. At least, recent launch titles. I think the DC is the last time we’ve had truly jaw dropping launch titles that really show we’ve entered a new generation.

The only facts we have is MS saying their 1st party games will be cross-gen for the next 1 or 2 years. And uncle Phil saying they have no wish to compete with Sony and Nintendo anymore because Amazon and Google are now apparently their main competitors. Everything else is all assumptions, like the first wave of ps5 exclusives being nothing special and won't take advantage of of the new tech. 

You should just ask yourself this. Does, MS saying their 1st party games will be cross gen for the first 1 or 2 years, sound like a good or a bad thing to you? I mean if you're not planning on buying a next gen console in the first 2 years anyway, it's not bad news at all. However, if you do plan on buying a series X early on, then tell me you wouldn't be disappointed if Halo Infinite turns out looking like a current gen remaster. Especially when something like Horizon Zero Dawn 2 comes out and does have true next gen ai, physics, geometry and whatnot. Not saying that will happen, but we do know for a fact that both companies have totally different strategies going in. So 1, 2 or 5 Years of cross gen games, it doesn't matter. What matters is if you think it's a good or a bad thing to begin with. And seeing how defensive some people are getting, I already know the answer.   

Hopefully you'll prove me wrong but the way MS's been talking reminds me so much of when MS was trying to shove Kinect down everyone's throat with the 360 and then taking it to another stupendous level when they announced the X1. Which was pitched as a box that connects the whole living room with Kinect and also plays games. I will just leave this here as a reminder of what happened the last time MS started blabbering about their services, instead of focusing on just launching a gaming console: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KbWgUO-Rqcw

I know this question was not for me by I'm gonna take the liberty to give you my answer:

It sounds like a GREAT thing to me. Why? 1) It shows respect and support for the vast majority of their fanbase that will not be able to buy their next consoles in the first two years. 2) This idea that games need to be totally exclusives to be great is just...  silly. I mean, two of the three best reviewed games in PS4's catalog are remasters from last gen for Christ sakes. I mean, in SEVEN years of exclusive games "pushing the hardware," they haven't been able to put out a game that surpasses those two games from last gen.