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Forums - Politics - IGN takes issue with white male lead in Days Gone.

ArchangelMadzz said:
Mr Puggsly said:

I would assume your example would only be used sarcastically and that would imply the same thing that was said.

Youre saying Im getting caught up on a single word but it says a lot about how the writer thinks. Its a double standard.

Obviously my example is assuming no sarcasm. 

Yes, it says a lot about how the writer is tired of generic characters, but in this case he realised the character is a lot deeper than the generic foundation would suggest.
White is not a bad thing and he never said it was a bad thing it was used for description. It's like saying I have a big red ugly car. Does it mean I hate red? Does it mean red is bad and I'm being anti-red? Do I judge all red cars to be ugly? No it's a description for an ugly ass car that's red. 

Racism exists but pointing racism at anything that has the word 'white' or 'black' in it without thinking about context and reading what he's actually saying or using any sort of logic at all is a bad idea. 

I think what you're missing or excusing is "white" was part of his criticism.

For example, if I call a woman a "fat ugly cunt," I am mocking her weight, appearance and perhaps behavior. All the words were part of my criticism.



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SpokenTruth said:
Kerotan said:

my point is simple. whether it's racism or not , the skin colour should not be a factor. ok so he is sickofwhite male scruffy and buff biker gang leaders? but if this exact same character was black would it be any more interesting? I'd argue no because the colour of his skin is not something i judge characters by.

And you keep proving my point that you can't separate your idea of racism from tropes/cliches/stereotypes.

I'll ask this again.  Can black people be tired of the angry black woman trope/cliche/stereotype? Or would that be racist and sexist?

 

They shouldn't be tired of it because it's black. Again it's a complete non factor. There's nothing boring about someone because they are the 1000th white person or black person you've met or seen. If that was the case I'd find ireland very boring because almost everyone I see are white. It's such a pointless and irrelevant metric to go by. 



SpokenTruth said:
Kerotan said:

They shouldn't be tired of it because it's black. Again it's a complete non factor. There's nothing boring about someone because they are the 1000th white person or black person you've met or seen. If that was the case I'd find ireland very boring because almost everyone I see are white. It's such a pointless and irrelevant metric to go by. 

OMG, I take back when I said I thought you could understand this.

They aren't saying it is boring just because the character is black but because the character is an overused trope/cliche/stereotype.  Angry. Black. Women. It requires all 3 traits to be the trope.  Not just 1.  In fact, take any 1 of them away, any one of them, and it's not longer the trope/cliche/stereotype and therefore no longer an issue.  You could then make it an angry, Asian man.  Totally different thing and not a trope. What about a cheerful, black women?  Nope, not currently a known or overused trope/cliche/stereotype.  What about a thuggish, white male?  Nope, not currently a known or overused trope/cliche/stereotype.  What about a gruff, white male?  Bingo, we found a known and overused trope/cliche/stereotype.

Please tell me you get it now.

Yeah so basically throw in 2 more characteristics and it's OK to use skin colour when judging someone. I think that's ridiculous. I don't care if a black or white character has been used a billion times I don't think we as people should be judging them like that. What they do and how they act is what matters. 



People are making a big deal about this and it is getting a little silly at this point (especially since the writer even said he got to like the character). I'm seeing people take on just another form of social justice identitarian left, myself included - which I hate myself for lol (I hesitate to use the overused cringeworthy term "SJW" although I sort have just did myself :/)

But I do have one point which I haven't quite seen touched on. I suppose I just find it shallow that the writer seemed at least initially to be 100% focused on the image of the character. I'm not just talking about race, but about the male/gruff as well. To me at least, like 80% of the depth and diversity of a character comes from the actions, and well, "character" of said protagonist.

In order words, I'd rather play a series of games that all featured:
the same exact looking dudes of the exact same race dressed the exact same but had more depth to their character, exhibitted completely different personalities, made completely different decisions, had completely different dialect, emotions, etc..

Vs:
a bunch of characters that represented every possible race under the sun and had completely different wardrobes, hairstyles, etc - yet they had no depth or nothing interesting about them, all spoke and acted the same way, made the same types of decisions, had the same types of emotions, etc.

Obviously visual appearance/dress/general makeup of a character does mean something, sure. After all, it's what you're going to be staring at throughout most of your game. But I guess it just doesn't mean as much to me as to many, vs personality traits.



 

"We hold these truths to be self-evident - all men and women created by the, go-you know.. you know the thing!" - Joe Biden

SpokenTruth said:
Kerotan said:

Yeah so basically throw in 2 more characteristics and it's OK to use skin colour when judging someone. I think that's ridiculous. I don't care if a black or white character has been used a billion times I don't think we as people should be judging them like that. What they do and how they act is what matters. 

Got it.  You can't recognize the separation between racism or sexism and a trope/cliche/stereotype.

So that we have this clear....nobody should ever be bothered by the overuse of the angry, black women trope.  The techy, Asian man trope.  The black, street slang male trope.  The buxom female with attitude trope.  The evil, British male antagonist trope.  The Arabian oil Sheikh.  The Persian, male taxi driver.  The Indian, customer service technician.  The popular, blonde female cheerleader.  The psycho, white male survivalist. The evil, white matriarch (also known as the wicked stepmother). The Jewish, male accountant. The mad, white male scientist. The boisterous, gay man. 

And on and on and on.  These character trait combinations are never supposed to bother anyone no matter how much they are overused and stereotyped onto countless characters.  Good to know.

It's quite simple my thoughtprocess. i treat races as equals and dont judge characters based on their ethnic origin. it literally doesn't enter my brain when i make my judgment.



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I'm happy the main character is a white man; for the sequel I want a black female, and very very sexy.



”Every great dream begins with a dreamer. Always remember, you have within you the strength, the patience, and the passion to reach for the stars to change the world.”

Harriet Tubman.

RolStoppable said:
LuccaCardoso1 said:
This thread is surreal. It's unbelievable. I want to believe that this is an elaborate joke. Or a troll, I don't know. My mind can't process how someone can be so close-minded and willfully ignorant just to keep defending a political stance in any way possible.

You can rest easy then.

Kerotan has a long history of saying things that he doesn't believe in as long as he is able to get a rise out of people. That's his objective and it's widely known among longtime members of VGC; anyone who still has doubts can read Kerotan's Rocket League thread. The basis of this thread here is a selective quote that isn't even posted as a full sentence, so that's a big hint already. It's an exercise to see how long it's possible to keep people going.

Another thing that many longtime members recognize is that the political section is almost free-for-all, so it's also known as a refugee camp. People who have caused trouble in gaming and sales discussions move to politics once they realize that moderation is much more lenient in political threads. It is no coincidence that the worst posts on this website are in pollitical threads, because the circumstances have created an environment where this is the logical outcome.

Ok so because I have a different opinion or belief to you I'm trolling. Gotcha. For the record there are a few other posters in this thread with the same opinion as myself. Are they trolls too?

Another thing I didn't post this in the political section. CGI moved it there. Instead of taking a backseat and talking to me like a mod why don't you actually engage in the conversation. Sitting on your high horse taking personal pot shots.

Thanks for reminding me of that RL thread. A lot has happened on RL since then so I'll need to get around to doing an update thread. 



The thing that is getting very not understood is that a criticism of having to many of something is on an editorial not on one game, because on one game it isn't being abused.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

DonFerrari said:
The thing that is getting very not understood is that a criticism of having to many of something is on an editorial not on one game, because on one game it isn't being abused.

But a game is not released on a void. Criticizing a game for lack of originality is completely valid.



LuccaCardoso1 said:
DonFerrari said:
The thing that is getting very not understood is that a criticism of having to many of something is on an editorial not on one game, because on one game it isn't being abused.

But a game is not released on a void. Criticizing a game for lack of originality is completely valid.

Even when the game is original and the fact a person is a gruff white male is just one very small part of his traits? The game isn't unoriginal, the char isn't just gruff (since white male is basically irrelevant).

That is basically the moronic way of reviewing a game for what you wanted it to be instead of what it is.

"Ow great, another FPS, 3/10".



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."