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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - GameXplain: 10 Lessons that 2D Mario can learn from Donkey Kong: Tropical Freeze

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Kai_Mao said:
curl-6 said:

I've been saying this since DKCR showed up NSMBWii nearly a decade ago.

NSMBU is just an abominably bland, lazy, unimaginative game. From its copy-paste assets and level themes, to its ear-bleeding music, its a showcase of how lazy Nintendo can be when they know they can get away with it. The fact its being sold again in 2019 for full price is just disgusting.

I guess in terms of fan reception and lasting impact, you may have a point.

But it's kinda hard to say "showed up" when the Metacritic scores are similar and the sales are...still in NSMBWii's advantage even without the bundles.

I get people have issue with the pricing (like they did with DKTF, Bayonetta 1 and 2, Pokken DX, among other Wii U ports). But if it sells, Nintendo will continue releasing those ports at full price. Of course, people will say its Mario so it'll sell well anyway when there have been examples that shows it's not always the case.

Sales are hardly a good measuring stick of craftsmanship. Just off the top of my head, Just Dance 3 sold more than Super Mario Galaxy 2. As for Metacritic, it basically just puts the opinions of a small few on a pedestal. 

Last edited by curl-6 - on 15 January 2019

Bet with Liquidlaser: I say PS5 and Xbox Series will sell more than 56 million combined by the end of 2023.

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In my opinion they shouldve released some nsmb and mario maker together, i played nsmb for wii and it was crazy fun and the multiplayer too, but as they sold 30M maybe they just got lazy on the following one. The port is just late in my opinion, last year maybe when there were no big titlea announced (spring end winter)... Still i could play the one for wii u so im thinking of gettig it... I guess i can just wait for it to become cheaper



cycycychris said:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iORdCuz2vtE

1. Too much downtime.
2. Make every level distinct.
3. Have a better soundtrack.
4. Context.
5. Characters with personality
6. Have a level of Surprise within levels
7. Have narrative within the levels
8. Give better controls
9. Have better rewards
10. Better artstyle

You'll have to watch the video to hear the explanations for each

This video is so spot on about NSMBU, its infinitely inferior to Tropical Freeze. The level design, atmosphere, character, music, basically everything is better in Tropical Freeze. the only thing NSMBU does better is mutliplayer. I hope Nintendo will look at Tropical freeze when making the next Mario to help advance this series. Level designs are feeling bland, the art style is dated, basically the series is in urgent need for a revamp.

What do you guys think about the suggestions in the video and how to improve the 2D mario series

You could have replaced the title with "Shovel Knight" or "Kirby's Epic Yarn" or about 3 dozen platformers from last year, and literally make all the same points.

But 2D Mario seems to have found a large market, so they don't really need to change anything.

And NSMB multiplayer trashes the new DKC trilogy spinoffs



I describe myself as a little dose of toxic masculinity.

curl-6 said:
Kai_Mao said:

I guess in terms of fan reception and lasting impact, you may have a point.

But it's kinda hard to say "showed up" when the Metacritic scores are similar and the sales are...still in NSMBWii's advantage even without the bundles.

I get people have issue with the pricing (like they did with DKTF, Bayonetta 1 and 2, Pokken DX, among other Wii U ports). But if it sells, Nintendo will continue releasing those ports at full price. Of course, people will say its Mario so it'll sell well anyway when there have been examples that shows it's not always the case.

Sales are hardly a good measuring stick of craftsmanship. Just off the top of my head, Just Dance 2011 sold more than Super Mario Galaxy 2. As for Metacritic, it basically just puts the opinions of a small few on a pedestal. 

I just wanted to say that Just Dance 3 is actually the best in the series. A great dancing game if you ask me, with a superb selection of songs that balance old classics and new stuff and pretty cool and fun coreographies.

Of course, Galaxy 2 is overall the better game and of course, your point is still true... But I don't know, I felt like you used this comparison because Just Dance is a dancing game and by  the definition of most so called "gamers" is not in the same league as Galaxy 2. I might be wrong on you though...



Vodacixi said:
curl-6 said:

Sales are hardly a good measuring stick of craftsmanship. Just off the top of my head, Just Dance 2011 sold more than Super Mario Galaxy 2. As for Metacritic, it basically just puts the opinions of a small few on a pedestal. 

I just wanted to say that Just Dance 3 is actually the best in the series. A great dancing game if you ask me, with a superb selection of songs that balance old classics and new stuff and pretty cool and fun coreographies.

Of course, Galaxy 2 is overall the better game and of course, your point is still true... But I don't know, I felt like you used this comparison because Just Dance is a dancing game and by  the definition of most so called "gamers" is not in the same league as Galaxy 2. I might be wrong on you though...

I'm not opposed to the Just Dance games, but in terms of craftsmanship they're hardly in Galaxy 2's league, is all I meant.



Bet with Liquidlaser: I say PS5 and Xbox Series will sell more than 56 million combined by the end of 2023.

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Clank said:
In my opinion they shouldve released some nsmb and mario maker together, i played nsmb for wii and it was crazy fun and the multiplayer too, but as they sold 30M maybe they just got lazy on the following one. The port is just late in my opinion, last year maybe when there were no big titlea announced (spring end winter)... Still i could play the one for wii u so im thinking of gettig it... I guess i can just wait for it to become cheaper

Why they would that when they released NSMBU DX and they will released seperate Mario Maker 2 and have much better sales and profit? :)

NSMBU DX will sell great in any case, easily 5m+.



One thing NSMUD doesn't need to learn from Tropical freeze is how to rake in the cash. Although not as ambitious etc as the video explains, it is much more accessible to lesser skilled gamers. Really its nice to have the best if both worlds surely



Talking about NSMBU and DKTF, despite point that NSMBU is more than same after so many NSMUB games, that type of game is very fun and could be played buy people from 5 to 99 years, espacily its fun with 4 player co-op multiplayer and thats why have much bigger apealing and sales on market compared to DK. While DKTF is far more oriented to core gamers, much more serious and more difficult game. So both of those games have its audince and place on market, saying that, after so many NSMB games, we need brand new kind of 2D Mario that could coexist with Mario Maker for instance.

 

 

 

zippy said: 
One thing NSMUD doesn't need to learn from Tropical freeze is how to rake in the cash. Although not as ambitious etc as the video explains, it is much more accessible to lesser skilled gamers. Really its nice to have the best if both worlds surely

Totally agree, to me NSMBU and DKTF are quite opposite games despite both being 2D platformers and thats great thing.



Looks like I need o get Tropical Freeze some time.



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curl-6 said:
Kai_Mao said:

I guess in terms of fan reception and lasting impact, you may have a point.

But it's kinda hard to say "showed up" when the Metacritic scores are similar and the sales are...still in NSMBWii's advantage even without the bundles.

I get people have issue with the pricing (like they did with DKTF, Bayonetta 1 and 2, Pokken DX, among other Wii U ports). But if it sells, Nintendo will continue releasing those ports at full price. Of course, people will say its Mario so it'll sell well anyway when there have been examples that shows it's not always the case.

Sales are hardly a good measuring stick of craftsmanship. Just off the top of my head, Just Dance 3 sold more than Super Mario Galaxy 2. As for Metacritic, it basically just puts the opinions of a small few on a pedestal. 

I get where you’re coming from but it’s a weird comparison between a dancing game and a 3D Mario game.