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Forums - Nintendo - Xenoblade 2 thoughts (no spoilers)

curl-6 said:

caffeinade said: 

Yeah, Xenoblade has lots of enemies in close proximity.

I don't think the Switch could handle: 3 player characters, 3 blades, 6+ enemies in combat, with large high level enemies running around in the background at BotW detail.
The game is clearly taxing on the hardware: 720p docked and much lower in handheld mode.
It is a launch year game that is built on an engine that was made for a very different architecture, so there is plenty of room to improve.

You do have to admire Monolith Soft's commitment to their vision.
Not many first party devs would be willing to push their hardware quite as far as they have in this title.
Naughty Dog's Uncharted 4 runs at 1080p; imagine if they were willing to push their tech so hard, that they were forced to render at 720p.

In light of DF's analysis I think XBC2 suffered a bit from a strict deadline and the devs still figuring out the hardware as they went along. Their second Switch project should hopefully be more polished.

Polished or not, I am loving the game. I would rather have Monolith come out with a new game every couple years of this quality than worry about some extra polish and it take say 4 years.

I've played like 50 hours and not one crash, any slowdowns are completely ignorable. Considering there are 3 characters, 3 blades, countless enemies in battle and on screen and the super flashy effects of the attacks all going on, I feel like the game should be lagging like crazy. Yet any slowdowns are when randomly running in the world. I'm sure its as you said, they are new to system and don't have the ram or something figured out. Didn't even DF say something like the fps is stable but some weird ram flaw.

But as said, no crashes, loving story and characters, slowdowns are ignorable, love art style, ect. Only have two complaints.

1. Map system sucks.

2. Wish when you traveled to a new Titan that is had some sort of cutscene or something that let you see the Titan in its entirety. The three big titans I have been on, I really don't have a clear picture of what they look like. Be nice to see them in some cool sweeping custscene or something when you first arrive. You know showing off their whole body, the landscape, ect. Like in Xenoblade 1, when it had that big pan out moment where you saw the Bionis you were on and how you were just a little speck on the knee or something. The world being on Titans is such a cool concept, yet they didn't do an amazing job of projecting that.



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The game is simply amazing.The music so far is great, the story is entertaining, and the world is simply breathtaking.When the game gets closer to stuff, or when it is a low profile cutscene, the game looks good.But when you are travelling its world, seeing its vistas with the animals on it, it is simply incredible.As always there are very few games that makes the world as awesome as Monolith.

The gameplay is also incredible.If you played any XC game you know what to expect here, but I personally think its more refined.Yes its complicated, but once you get the hang of that(and Im still early in the game, didnt see the full extent of the combat system yet) its simply excellent.

The game does have its technical problems though.For docked mode, there are some framerate hickups, but nothing too big that gets in the way of the game, and supposedelly resolution is terrible undocked(never played that way, so I dont know)

And yeah, this game is more "anime" than other Xenoblade games, and I see where the complaints come from.But even then, its not nearly as bad as some reviewers makes it to be.I mean, personally I like it very much, but I get if someone dosent like.But reviewers going as far as the gamespot review(and other Im sure) and listing as that being basically their only complain and taking away 3 points because of that?BS I say.

Anyways, so far, I feel the game should have scored at least a 90, but oh well.



My (locked) thread about how difficulty should be a decision for the developers, not the gamers.

https://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/thread.php?id=241866&page=1

 

-There's no in menu tutorial. Just hints that you have to buy. The short tutorial that exists doesn't 
explain everything. Twenty hours in I was still trying to figure things out.
- A few of the Blade character designs are bad. Example: A bird with literal sandbags for breasts.
- The graphics are on par with a PS3 game from 2009.
- Combat is a little slow, and auto-piloty early game.
- English voice acting is hit and miss.
- Characters constantly repeat the same lines over and over again in combat.
- The protagonist is a niave Shonen boy.
- No subtitles for Japanese voicework outside of cutscenes.
- The map system is unintuitive, and segmented. 
- The waypoint system for missions is poorly executed.


+ There is a Japanese langauge pack for voices. The Japanese voicework is superior. 
+ Most of the main characters are well designed.
+ The music is great.
+ Combat gets to be insane and fast mid to late game. Combos are fun to pull off.
+ Multi-tiered maps, brimming with secrets, and hidden passageways. 
+ The main plot makes excellent use of the main character's niavete. 
+ Complicated and varied in game systems, make modern western games look simple by comparison. 
+ The game is brimming with genuinely funny and interesting moments.
+ A massive game that is potentially longer than BotW.
+ Tons of different weapons to use, along with the ability to equip multiple blades, make characters
endlessly customizable. 

 

Overall most of the negatives are small complaints that are overshadowed by what makes the game so great. Based on the ten or so reviews I read, I was expecting something along the lines of Xenoblade Chronicles X, with an ultra grindy and needlessly complicated system. But everything that's in the game works beautifully, and is in there for a reason. It's not like X where they added pointless features simply for the sake of having them. Xenoblade 2 always seems to have something interesting for you to do, so there's less a feeling of Grinding and more a feeling of natural progression via exploration and combat. 

So long as the story wraps up without any senseless "Cloud amnesia" moments, and so long as ultra late game isn't needlessly grindy, this will wind up being just as good as the original Xenoblade. And I was seriously not expecting that. Not after all the middling reviews I read. 



I've been taking my sweet time and I just got inside a Titan. Sweet lord it's stunning.

Also for those who thinks this looks like a PS3/360 game. You're out of your minds. 

Last edited by Cubedramirez - on 06 December 2017

Cubedramirez said:

I've been taking my sweet time and I just got inside a Titan. Sweet lord it's stunning.

Also for those who thinks this looks like a PS3/360 game. You're out of your minds. 

They're talking about tiny things like low poly assets here and there. Also the 720p resolution. IMO technical graphics don't matter one lousy bit. Keep in mind Valkyria Chronicles looks like a PS3 game because it is a PS3 game, but that's one of the best looking games I've ever played. It makes me sad that so many critics heavily docked Xenoblade 2 for not being a technical masterpiece. I'd rather see games come out at a steady pace, than wait around for developers to polish a game so it looks 10% better, just to get high scores from graphics whores. People wanna complain about studios closing down, but then want to go ahead and whine if a game isn't absolute cutting edge tech. Most of the most technically impressive games out there either nickel and dime the consumer, or force their employees to work slave hours, or they just go out of business. 



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Cerebralbore101 said:

 

-There's no in menu tutorial. Just hints that you have to buy. The short tutorial that exists doesn't 
explain everything. Twenty hours in I was still trying to figure things out.
- A few of the Blade character designs are bad. Example: A bird with literal sandbags for breasts.
- The graphics are on par with a PS3 game from 2009.
- Combat is a little slow, and auto-piloty early game.
- English voice acting is hit and miss.
- Characters constantly repeat the same lines over and over again in combat.
- The protagonist is a niave Shonen boy.
- No subtitles for Japanese voicework outside of cutscenes.
- The map system is unintuitive, and segmented. 
- The waypoint system for missions is poorly executed.


+ There is a Japanese langauge pack for voices. The Japanese voicework is superior. 
+ Most of the main characters are well designed.
+ The music is great.
+ Combat gets to be insane and fast mid to late game. Combos are fun to pull off.
+ Multi-tiered maps, brimming with secrets, and hidden passageways. 
+ The main plot makes excellent use of the main character's niavete. 
+ Complicated and varied in game systems, make modern western games look simple by comparison. 
+ The game is brimming with genuinely funny and interesting moments.
+ A massive game that is potentially longer than BotW.
+ Tons of different weapons to use, along with the ability to equip multiple blades, make characters
endlessly customizable. 

 

Overall most of the negatives are small complaints that are overshadowed by what makes the game so great. Based on the ten or so reviews I read, I was expecting something along the lines of Xenoblade Chronicles X, with an ultra grindy and needlessly complicated system. But everything that's in the game works beautifully, and is in there for a reason. It's not like X where they added pointless features simply for the sake of having them. Xenoblade 2 always seems to have something interesting for you to do, so there's less a feeling of Grinding and more a feeling of natural progression via exploration and combat. 

So long as the story wraps up without any senseless "Cloud amnesia" moments, and so long as ultra late game isn't needlessly grindy, this will wind up being just as good as the original Xenoblade. And I was seriously not expecting that. Not after all the middling reviews I read. 

What pointless features did Blade X have? And in what way is it needlessly grindy? 



bigtakilla said:
Cerebralbore101 said:

 

-There's no in menu tutorial. Just hints that you have to buy. The short tutorial that exists doesn't 
explain everything. Twenty hours in I was still trying to figure things out.
- A few of the Blade character designs are bad. Example: A bird with literal sandbags for breasts.
- The graphics are on par with a PS3 game from 2009.
- Combat is a little slow, and auto-piloty early game.
- English voice acting is hit and miss.
- Characters constantly repeat the same lines over and over again in combat.
- The protagonist is a niave Shonen boy.
- No subtitles for Japanese voicework outside of cutscenes.
- The map system is unintuitive, and segmented. 
- The waypoint system for missions is poorly executed.


+ There is a Japanese langauge pack for voices. The Japanese voicework is superior. 
+ Most of the main characters are well designed.
+ The music is great.
+ Combat gets to be insane and fast mid to late game. Combos are fun to pull off.
+ Multi-tiered maps, brimming with secrets, and hidden passageways. 
+ The main plot makes excellent use of the main character's niavete. 
+ Complicated and varied in game systems, make modern western games look simple by comparison. 
+ The game is brimming with genuinely funny and interesting moments.
+ A massive game that is potentially longer than BotW.
+ Tons of different weapons to use, along with the ability to equip multiple blades, make characters
endlessly customizable. 

 

Overall most of the negatives are small complaints that are overshadowed by what makes the game so great. Based on the ten or so reviews I read, I was expecting something along the lines of Xenoblade Chronicles X, with an ultra grindy and needlessly complicated system. But everything that's in the game works beautifully, and is in there for a reason. It's not like X where they added pointless features simply for the sake of having them. Xenoblade 2 always seems to have something interesting for you to do, so there's less a feeling of Grinding and more a feeling of natural progression via exploration and combat. 

So long as the story wraps up without any senseless "Cloud amnesia" moments, and so long as ultra late game isn't needlessly grindy, this will wind up being just as good as the original Xenoblade. And I was seriously not expecting that. Not after all the middling reviews I read. 

What pointless features did Blade X have? And in what way is it needlessly grindy? 

I would say the degree to which X was or was not grindy heavily depended on your approach.  If you wanted to push main story stuff, the grind could be very real.  But if you broadened your approach earlier, like I did, you pick up enough extra XP and gear to not mind it.  X was a paradox of design in that it was built so you could approach it in any way but clearly designed to be approached a certain way.  Nothing wrong with that except you get very little warning.  

As for useless features, I could see some not liking the probes for example.  I did, but not everyone will feel that was a worthwhile mechanic and may be annoyed that it is mandatory in several sidequests.



Cerebralbore101 said:
Cubedramirez said:

I've been taking my sweet time and I just got inside a Titan. Sweet lord it's stunning.

Also for those who thinks this looks like a PS3/360 game. You're out of your minds. 

They're talking about tiny things like low poly assets here and there. Also the 720p resolution. IMO technical graphics don't matter one lousy bit. Keep in mind Valkyria Chronicles looks like a PS3 game because it is a PS3 game, but that's one of the best looking games I've ever played. It makes me sad that so many critics heavily docked Xenoblade 2 for not being a technical masterpiece. I'd rather see games come out at a steady pace, than wait around for developers to polish a game so it looks 10% better, just to get high scores from graphics whores. People wanna complain about studios closing down, but then want to go ahead and whine if a game isn't absolute cutting edge tech. Most of the most technically impressive games out there either nickel and dime the consumer, or force their employees to work slave hours, or they just go out of business. 

I'd rather not have bugs that tank the fps that require me to shut off my system, better voice acting that makes people want to just turn on the japanese voice acting, a handheld mode (if it's on the switch) that doesn't have the worst image quality of any first party game likely this gen at least from a higher budget title, and characters that don't look ripped from a budget jrpg. Fix that and the rest I'll let fly. Hopefully X2 will be better.



Nuvendil said:
bigtakilla said:

What pointless features did Blade X have? And in what way is it needlessly grindy? 

I would say the degree to which X was or was not grindy heavily depended on your approach.  If you wanted to push main story stuff, the grind could be very real.  But if you broadened your approach earlier, like I did, you pick up enough extra XP and gear to not mind it.  X was a paradox of design in that it was built so you could approach it in any way but clearly designed to be approached a certain way.  Nothing wrong with that except you get very little warning.  

As for useless features, I could see some not liking the probes for example.  I did, but not everyone will feel that was a worthwhile mechanic and may be annoyed that it is mandatory in several sidequests.

I think you hit it on the head though. You easily get enough gear and XP to not require grinding. It's only a conscious decision of wanting things that the game makes you work for it. If you want the best skell, you're going to have to work for it, but you readily get skells,  hell you even get a free one. You can master a class tree or two easily, but if you want to master them all you gotta work for it. You'll easily pick up adequate armor and weapons, if you want the best though, ect.

 

As for the probes, it's not like they didn't serve a function (fast travel). They also served other functions like miranium mining, and revenue which again only really effects the player if they want to get those sweet extras. Is it so much to ask someone to tap A when setting up a fast travel spot? This is super nitpicky if you ask me.



bigtakilla said:  What pointless features did Blade X have? And in what way is it needlessly grindy? 

Useless and overly complicated features: A half baked tacked on multiplayer mode. Skells. Arms Manufacturers. Probes and Mining. 

Needlessly grindy parts: Having to collect specific collectible items in order to get certain augments. Xenoblade 1 had this problem with collectible items to an extent, but at least you only needed them to complete some missions. There's nothing fun about running around the map praying that you finally find that 1/200 drop you need to finish your augment. Needing to mine a holy fuckton of miranium in order to afford your skells. Miranium is time based, and only drops on an hourly or so basis. You can't just leave the game on overnight to get your miranium so you gotta play a ridiculous amount of hours to get your good stuff. I know that mining and augments are only two things, but they made the post game content stupidly grindy. If you want to 100% Xenoblade X you need to spend 200 - 300 hours playing it, with 150 of those hours being doing pointless menial tasks. Having to talk to everybody in order to improve a town, but not knowing who you haven't talked to yet. Needed to complete certain unspecified tasks to unlock certain party members, and heart to hearts. 

Xenoblade 2 fixes so many of the issues with XCX. Items are now dropped from farm/salvage points and you can improve the drop rates by using blade skills, or better salvaging cylinders. Getting new unique blades is easy if you have boosters, and rare core crystals. Heart to hearts appear without any hidden requirements. You still have to talk to everybody in town to improve a town, but now there's stars over their heads. Leveling up a blade just requires putting their favorite item in your pouch with a ton of refills. So far there's no skells, and no miranium. 

Playing XCX feels like playing a Monster Hunter game without the ability to cut tails, capture monsters, etc to improve your drop rates. It's just a huge grind late - post game. I mean don't get me wrong, I still liked XCX and intend on going back to it one day, even after my 150+ hours. But X2 is just a massive breath of fresh air. 

Last edited by Cerebralbore101 - on 06 December 2017