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Forums - Gaming - EDGE ranks the top 100 greatest games (2017 edition)

So many triggered people, love it.



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VGPolyglot said:
JakDaSnack said:

You don't get it, countless hours went into the development of the apple 2, does that mean an apple 2 is better than the latest mac? Games are constantly being improved upon, we don't just count the hours of dedication of the developers that created super mario bros, but the hours of dedication that went into every game that came before it.  

Look, i get it.  Being told your favorite game isn't as good as another game is hard to accept.  That's just human nature.  And it's hard to overcome it, but it's also a part of maturity.  I grew up in the 90's, I loved my SNES, N64/PS1 etc.  But I have moved on, and I enjoy seeing how far gaming has come in the last 20 years.  

"Better" is subjective. So yeah, depending on who you ask, it can be better.

it's not that better is subjective, it's that it's generic.  If you define it, then the subjectiveness starts to go away.



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JakDaSnack said:
Wright said:

Don't you think this all is contradictory when Tetris, a game from 1984, shows up as the seventh best game in their list? There's certainly a base to question choices made in this list. Even what you're suggesting point at mistakes in their lists.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't believe I said it was a perfect list.  Frankly I would have preferred they used "puyo puyo tetis" as that is a better version of the game.  But I do agree there are faults in the list, However GTAV, the last of us, zelda botw, and dark souls are the probably the best games (or close to the best games) out there right now, so it's nice to see them so high on their list.

I don't mean to say the list is flawless. I mean to say that just because there lies flaws in it, people can express discomfort with the choices (or the order of the choices) made. It doesn't necessarily has to reflect nostalgia, it just points out that the list can be criticised for the choices made. Bloodborne is a game that came later than Dark Souls, but it's ranked lower; despite both being modern games, there's room to debate which one deserves to be over the other one.

What you're suggesting is that just because Bloodborne uses a different (better?) combat formula, a more refined (more solid?) gameplay system and it all came later in development, it automatically deserves to be better than Dark Souls. Which is extremely debatable.



JakDaSnack said:
VGPolyglot said:

"Better" is subjective. So yeah, depending on who you ask, it can be better.

it's not that better is subjective, it's that it's generic.  If you define it, then the subjectiveness starts to go away.

You can define it by processing power, sales, etc. You can't objectively define which is better, since it's based on personal enjoyment.



p0isonparadise said:
So many triggered people, love it.

This is a forum, the whole purpose of which is discussion



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Veknoid_Outcast said:
pokoko said:
Those saying, "opinions shouldn't be criticized," it's certainly not that simple. This list isn't titled "my favorite games" , it's supposedly "the greatest games of all-time." That's a substantial difference. We look for a meaningful degree of objectivity from professional publications. Completely subjective lists are only meaningful to the person who wrote them. Otherwise, all reviewers would be throwing out arbitrary scores like Jim Sterling and they would be useless.

This looks exactly like a "my favorite games" list. Taken as a "greatest games" list, it looks silly.

I half agree with you. I definitely think this whole cultural relativism line of thinking is silly. Of course we can applaud, criticize, or even rip to shreds a list such as this. The fact that all lists are subjective doesn't prevent us, as consumers, from applying our own subjective perspective to them.

But I disagree about a greatest games list requiring some degree of objectivity. You simply can't measure greatness in any objective, empirical way. You can measure sales, and scores, and influence, but not greatness. So I'm fine with EDGE embracing the subjective opinions of its writers. Those opinions just happen to be far removed from my own, which is why I'm down on the list.

We're just going to have to disagree.  If Time published a list of "The 100 Greatest People" and it was full of entries like "that old lady who used to give me snacks when I was a kid" I think consumers would have a legitimate complaint.  It might be true that the author thinks that old lady deserves a spot enough to kick George Washington off the list but a publication isn't just about the author.  I think there is some degree of obligation when using a word like "Greatest".

That's my opinion as a consumer and it's something I'm going to look for in situations like these.  It's also why I don't seek out EDGE, Jim Sterling, or the like.



Wright said:
JakDaSnack said:

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't believe I said it was a perfect list.  Frankly I would have preferred they used "puyo puyo tetis" as that is a better version of the game.  But I do agree there are faults in the list, However GTAV, the last of us, zelda botw, and dark souls are the probably the best games (or close to the best games) out there right now, so it's nice to see them so high on their list.

I don't mean to say the list is flawless. I mean to say that just because there lies flaws in it, people can express discomfort with the choices (or the order of the choices) made. It doesn't necessarily has to reflect nostalgia, it just points out that the list can be criticised for the choices made. Bloodborne is a game that came later than Dark Souls, but it's ranked lower; despite both being modern games, there's room to debate which one deserves to be over the other one.

What you're suggesting is that just because Bloodborne uses a different (better?) combat formula, a more refined (more solid?) gameplay system and it all came later in development, it automatically deserves to be better than Dark Souls. Which is extremely debatable.

I didn't mean to suggest that, sorry you took it that way.  And I never said you couldn't express discomfort, in my personal experience I see 20-30 year old games that have been improved upon in numerous ways over years, being placed near the top of various "best game ever" lists.  Usually the reason why they are placed there is because "they still hold up well" or "they were good for their time" or "they were very influencial".  And I don't agree with those assessments.



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JakDaSnack said:

I didn't mean to suggest that, sorry you took it that way.  And I never said you couldn't express discomfort, in my personal experience I see 20-30 year old games that have been improved upon in numerous ways over years, being placed near the top of various "best game ever" lists.  Usually the reason why they are placed there is because "they still hold up well" or "they were good for their time" or "they were very influencial".  And I don't agree with those assessments.

Well, that makes more sense.



Lists like this one always crack me up.



VGPolyglot said:
JakDaSnack said:

it's not that better is subjective, it's that it's generic.  If you define it, then the subjectiveness starts to go away.

You can define it by processing power, sales, etc. You can't objectively define which is better, since it's based on personal enjoyment.

personal enjoyment is just one way to define "better".  But personal enjoyment isn't a great way to judge anything, because personal enjoyment depends on numerous factors that are irrelevent to said thing (i.e. did you have a good night sleep, were you hungry, were you in an argument with a random person on vgchartz etc.  These can effect your emotions which can effect enjoyment). 



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