GhaudePhaede010 said:
Miyamotoo said:
1) Fact is that Switch is much better position in game wise also beacuse people actualy have strong games for which they could buy console, those 3 games are games that make huge difference, and every single one of those games totaly blows away any game that Wii U had in hole 1st year, not to mention all 3 games together. Of course there is a evidence, look at attach rate and sales of those games, when people buying console they are buying it for some games and offcourse thats one of reason why people are buying Switch are those games. Without those 3 games Switch wouldn't be nearly as popular like it is now. MK8 actually was system seller for Wii U, Wii U got huge boost in sales with MK8 launch, but that really didn't change anything, it was already too late and too little for Wii U, but you can bet that Wii U would sell few millions less without MK8.
2) Because you want to say that point of media options is similar important like system seller games, but of course thats not true, they dont have same effect on sales of console.
3) Like I wrote, MK8 come to Wii U when alaredy was too late and Wii U was already considerd for failure, same goes for Splatoon, not to mentone Zelda BotW (Wii U was already discounted in March), but you can bet if Wii U had just one of those games on launch, sales for Wii U would be quite difrent. You are wrong again, Switch games are again much more quality, Switch is 1st 6 months has more stronger and much more quality games than Wii U had, Wii U had only quantity but lacked quality. Most of games you mentioned were availible on much more cheaper PS3/Xbox360, while others that are not multiplatform are good in best case, so no realy reason to buy Wii U, again, Wii U lacked strong and great game in almost hole 1st year, game that will move hardware, Switch has them 3 in less than 1st 6 months. Its about context, multiplatform games you mentioned were available on much cheaper and much bigger platforms with much bigger numbers of games so of course that people will choose PS3/Xbox360 for those games instead WiiU, on other hand MK8 was available on $300/350 platform that was already considered for failure in time when MK8 was launched, and most people didnt want to invest in sucha platform despite MK8 is great game, and thats why mostly just hardcore Nintendo fans actually bought Wii U. Also Zelda BotW was released when Wii U was already discounted.
Also, why you think Nintendo launched Switch with Zelda BotW, why they released MK8D just two months after Zelda, Splatoon 2 just 2-3 months after MK8D, or they have one stronger or bigger game evre month!? Because they know they need huge system seller games early on and steady flow of big and great games if they want to have successful platform, they basically admitted that failed to do that with Wii U and thats one of main reasons why Wii U failed, and they basically said that's one most important things for Switch. And guess what, they were right, they nailed it, they done right all key reasons because Wii U failed, and strong and great games from start is definitely one of key reasons.
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1) Look at the attach rate of Mario Kart on Wii U. That does not mean it would sell consoles because... it didn't. However, I have an effective way of closing this conversation which I will get to in just a minute.
2) I am not trying to actually say that. I am saying if Switch failed, people would use that narrative... which is untrue... because they could. Using the narrative does not make it truthful. People would say, "who wanted a 300 USD tablet that lacked the options of all other tablets on the market? Who wanted a gaming console that didn't offer Netflix and Youtube and has an antiquated online infrastructure in 2017?" and of course, people would agree with that sentiment because the console failed. However, they would, like you in this conversation, be incorrect.
3) I see you keep trying to discredit the games that came out on Wii U but here is the real deal about it. When the console was released, who was complaining about the launch line up? Nobody. The launch line up was praised almost universally. This is not to discredit anything positive you are saying about Switch. This is simply about the notion that Wii U had a poor launch (even in comparison to Switch). However, people complained from day 1 that outside of Zelda, there was nothing else to play on Switch. This is a fact as well. On the other side, from day 1 people were comfused about what exactly Wii U was. It was so bad that Nintendo had to put out a press release basically explaining Wii U was a different console from Wii and not just a controller add on. From there, did the marketing and communication get any better? No. The marketing has been considered by most, the worst in Nintendo's history. And that leads me to Switch. From day 1, people knew what it was and how it worked. Its simple hybrid nature was plain and simple. The games were of high quality and it was clear this was a brand new Nintendo console that you could do new things with. They walk you through exactly what you can do with the console and show why the console will be fun for people college age and older. Then, SUPER BOWL ad. And a marketing campaign that put the world on notice that Switch is something serious and awesome. And how many people were confused about the communication and/or marketing of Switch? Nobody. How many people said Switch marketing and advertising was bad? Nobody. While Wii U's marketing was universally panned, Switch's marketing has been universally praised.
4) My point is that even if you want to say Switch has more important titles (I would still hesitate to call them system sellers if they have no history of selling consoles) than Wii U, neither console was exactly panned for their software in the first six months. However, one console was universally panned for its poor communication and marketing while the other console has been universally praised for its communication and marketing. That is the BIGGEST difference between Wii U and Switch at this point. Without a doubt, the biggest step to selling anything to someone is to have them clearly understand what the product is. Nintendo completely missed with Wii U (even showing Wii games in their initial presentation and in their early commercials leading to people believing Wii U was just a tablet add on for Wii) but nailed that with Switch. One is flying off shelves, the other had (as you call them), "system selling games" that did not sell systems.
By the way, your argument about Wii U having more expensive titles than their counterparts is only... well true in exception. But then we have Ultra Street Fighter II on Switch which most people call overpriced and it managed to sell super well. We also have the, "Switch tax" which we are in the midst of right now. The obstacles Wii U and Switch have to overcome are not dissimilar. Great marketing will help, at least initally, to overcome a lot of those obstacles.
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1) I already wrote to you, MK8 actually was system seller for Wii U, Wii U got huge boost in sales with MK8 launch, but that really didn't change anything, it was already too late and too little for Wii U, but you can bet that Wii U would sell few millions less without MK8. Wii U got boost in sales with evre bigger game, SM3DW, MK8, Smash Bros, Splatoon2, but again it was to little and too late, Wii U needed some of those games at launch and in 1st 6 monts.
2) Some people can use whatever they want narrative, someone will even say that Wii U failed because did not had stronger 3rd party support, but that doesnt mean its true. But its very easy to define what are key points that are needed for Nintendo platform in order to be successful: appealing hardware, launch and 1st year system seller games, and marketing, Wii U failed with all 3 points while Wii and Switch had all those 3 points.
3) Nobady complained beacuse theye were some strong 3rd party game that Wii didnt had, but nobady said thats must have console. Only multi platform games were praised because Wii didn't had 3rd games like those, but nobody praise Nintendo games and exclusives, games that actually sell the system and that couldnt be played on cheaper PS3/Xbox360. So Wii U, was missing key point, strong system seller game, actual reason for buying console, and that doenst goes just for launch but almost for hole 1st year. Switch had less games on start, but from start had huge and strong reason for owning Switch, and thats one of best Zelda and best games ever. Again, multiplatform games don't selling Nintendo hardware, nobody really want to buy Wii U because Batman, CoD, AC...if they could play those same those game on much cheaper platforms with much stronger lineup of games. I alredy wrote that marketing is one of key reasons why Switch is sucefule (offcourse its not only one), but even with that marketing focus was on Zelda BotW, even Super Bawl comercial was with Zelda BotW, people look at comercial and said, "I want to play that game". Do you rely think it would be same effect if Nintendo done same thing with NSMBU or Nintendo Land on Wii U, of course not, they don't have nearly same effect, Zelda BotW is huge system seller game. Switch was something serious and cool because of hybrid nature of console and because great new cool Zelda.
4) Lol, but fact is that Wii U didn't had great and system seller game in almost hole 1st year and because of that Wii U was mainly bought by Nintendo hardcore fans only. Wii U would sell quite better if it had on launch or in 1st 6 monts games like Mario Kart 8, Splatoon, Mario Maker, SM3DW or Zelda BotW. You need to realise that great and strong Nintendo games are selling Nintendo hardware, not multiplatform games. Marketing, apeling hardware and strong system seller games, are all huge difrences compared to Wii U, and they are all key points why Switch is selling so great. If you have only marketing but you don't have appling hardware and game that will sell you that hardware, you don't have nothing. It doesn't mean anything if marketing make me understand what console is if that console is not appealing and don't have strong and huge game to sell you that console.
Its not point that Wii U games were more expansive, but fact that Switch alone is around $100 more expansive than PS3/Xbox360 that played that same games, so if I interested in those game and I want to play those games I would be crazy to pay $100 more for Wii U that actually has incompatible less 3rd party games than PS3/Xbox 360. Ultra Street Fighter II is overpriced on Switch, but that doesnt relly matters, because people are buying Switch because Zelda BotW, MK8D and Splatoon 2 on first place, not because Ultra Street Fighter II.
Also again, why you think Nintendo launched Switch with Zelda BotW, why they released MK8D just two months after Zelda, Splatoon 2 just 2-3 months after MK8D, or they have one stronger or bigger game evre month!? Because they know they need huge system seller games early on and steady flow of big and great games if they want to have successful platform, they basically admitted that failed to do that with Wii U and thats one of main reasons why Wii U failed, and they basically said that's one most important things for Switch. And guess what, they were right, they nailed it, they done right all key reasons because Wii U failed, and strong and great games from start is definitely one of key reasons.
