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Forums - Politics Discussion - News Outlets Dissatisfied With Trump Administration Banned From Press Briefing

 

Is this okay?

Yes 49 30.43%
 
No 108 67.08%
 
On the fence about the issue 4 2.48%
 
Total:161
Mr Puggsly said:
Puppyroach said:

I've never understood this, but why is the DOE always the target for destruction, when their job is to provide public education for the masses? Please explain.

I think John Stossel sums it up well.

"The department doesn’t teach kids or pay teachers. It comes up with studies, test requirements, and one-size-fits-all rules that limit what schools can do if they want federal money. That money gets taken from states and shipped to Washington, D.C., which then ships it back to states if they do something the department likes. On that long journey, plenty of the money disappears into the hands of bureaucrats.

Turn education back over to local governments, the way it was not so long ago. Let entrepreneurs and local governments compete to improve schools."

I could be sold on the idea of abolishing the federal department of education, but no viable alternative has been provided.  Local governments already have the bulk of the educational funds, and for the most part have the discretion to do what they want.  There are incentives to doing things like adopting common core standards or nclb standards, but these are actually not mandated.  As a teacher, the stuff that the federal DOE is a distant fourth concern after city, district, and state standards.

Entreprenuers running schools has been rife with fraud and abuse.  Not that this DOESN'T happen in public schools to an extent, but the degree of fraud in charter schools has been utterly obscene in some cases.  If entreprenuers are involved, then you need strict oversight, which would require a department of eductation in some capacity.  

 If schools are funded 100% by municipal government, that's going to exacerbate the already huge difference between schools in high income and low income areas.  Ideally, the federal DOE would do more to correct this imbalance.  For instance, the quality of eductation that exists in Long Island is typically far better than what is in NYC because of the fact that education funding is almost exclusively based on property taxes.  There needs to be some corrective force, which the federal DOE can serve as, although as you rightly point out, it has not been effective in this. 

So, I agree with the problem, but the solution you're endorsing does not fix it.



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zero129 said:
VGPolyglot said:

Yes it is, there are many minorities facing trouble in France, have you ever seen the movie "La Haine"? Yes, it's a work of fiction, but it highlights the severe troubles that minorities face in France. There were also riots before in 2005 because of poor living conditions:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ja511kBVuLA

So, since I'm not European I can't talk about European problems? How specific do we get? You might as well not be allowed to talk about France either, since you don't live there.

OMG, im arguing with a person who would sooner look at a work of fiction as if its real, Try side stepping and using strawman tactics to desprove "REAL" problems a country is facing, Mis quotes Martin Luther Jr King more then he should, and thinks its ok for people to go around attacking innocent people, smashing up peoples homes,cars,shops etc.

I live in europe and was planning on going to Paris this year to bring my kids to Disney Land, With the way things are going over there at the moment that might not be possible.

Plus unlike you i can see whats happening in france as being wrong on so many levels, im not the one making up excuses for why Rioting and attacking innocent people, destorying their cars and homes and shops as being "OK" . I can see whats going on with my own eyes since the is plenty of videos thats "Not" "Fiction" .

You on the other hand keep commenting on european problems and denying whats right in front of your eyes, or trying to make up excuses with mis quotes and lies as to why its ok. You also ignore parts of peoples comments that you cant answer and try direct the conversation in a whole different direction.

This alone makes it impossible to talk with you on such subjects, and thats why it would be better if you just stopped talking about european problems in the first place...

Anyway i've had enough of going over this with you as its clear what you are doing, so have a good day and good luck to you..

Yes, I referred to a work a fiction, but I guess you also ignored that I mentioned a real life event to, and sent you a link of it (albeit in French, because I'm not sure if they made an English version of it). 



JWeinCom said:
Mr Puggsly said:

I think John Stossel sums it up well.

"The department doesn’t teach kids or pay teachers. It comes up with studies, test requirements, and one-size-fits-all rules that limit what schools can do if they want federal money. That money gets taken from states and shipped to Washington, D.C., which then ships it back to states if they do something the department likes. On that long journey, plenty of the money disappears into the hands of bureaucrats.

Turn education back over to local governments, the way it was not so long ago. Let entrepreneurs and local governments compete to improve schools."

I could be sold on the idea of abolishing the federal department of education, but no viable alternative has been provided.  Local governments already have the bulk of the educational funds, and for the most part have the discretion to do what they want.  There are incentives to doing things like adopting common core standards or nclb standards, but these are actually not mandated.  As a teacher, the stuff that the federal DOE is a distant fourth concern after city, district, and state standards.

Entreprenuers running schools has been rife with fraud and abuse.  Not that this DOESN'T happen in public schools to an extent, but the degree of fraud in charter schools has been utterly obscene in some cases.  If entreprenuers are involved, then you need strict oversight, which would require a department of eductation in some capacity.  

 If schools are funded 100% by municipal government, that's going to exacerbate the already huge difference between schools in high income and low income areas.  Ideally, the federal DOE would do more to correct this imbalance.  For instance, the quality of eductation that exists in Long Island is typically far better than what is in NYC because of the fact that education funding is almost exclusively based on property taxes.  There needs to be some corrective force, which the federal DOE can serve as, although as you rightly point out, it has not been effective in this. 

So, I agree with the problem, but the solution you're endorsing does not fix it.

School choice can help rid of failing schools, more competition could lead to better oversight of corruption, and schools can still get federal funding without huge, useless department doing it.

DOE hasn't existed very long and hasn't made things better. Essentially, get rid of it completely or reduce what it does signficantly.



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zero129 said:

Im sick of you talking about the problems Europe is facing as if you live here.

You're Irish...



Mr Puggsly said:

School choice can help rid of failing schools, more competition could lead to better oversight of corruption, and schools can still get federal funding without huge, useless department doing it.

DOE hasn't existed very long and hasn't made things better. Essentially, get rid of it completely or reduce what it does signficantly.

So far, school choice hasn't done those things.  

School choice, in the form of charter schools, has been rife with abuse.  The oversight has simply not been there, and competition hasn't done anything to help.  Competition between schools, whether public, charter, or private, has mostly served as motivation to fudge numbers and to eliminate the lowest performers.  



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JWeinCom said:
Mr Puggsly said:

School choice can help rid of failing schools, more competition could lead to better oversight of corruption, and schools can still get federal funding without huge, useless department doing it.

DOE hasn't existed very long and hasn't made things better. Essentially, get rid of it completely or reduce what it does signficantly.

So far, school choice hasn't done those things.  

School choice, in the form of charter schools, has been rife with abuse.  The oversight has simply not been there, and competition hasn't done anything to help.  Competition between schools, whether public, charter, or private, has mostly served as motivation to fudge numbers and to eliminate the lowest performers.  

School choice hasn't had a chance to thrive yet so lets not pretend competition truly exist. School unions have been at war with charter schools and hindered their progress.

Public schools often like to ignore test scores but national tests show which are doing a poor job. Either way the direction Trump seems to be moving things can't be worse. We keep spending more on K-12 eductation with no results.



Recently Completed
River City: Rival Showdown
for 3DS (3/5) - River City: Tokyo Rumble for 3DS (4/5) - Zelda: BotW for Wii U (5/5) - Zelda: BotW for Switch (5/5) - Zelda: Link's Awakening for Switch (4/5) - Rage 2 for X1X (4/5) - Rage for 360 (3/5) - Streets of Rage 4 for X1/PC (4/5) - Gears 5 for X1X (5/5) - Mortal Kombat 11 for X1X (5/5) - Doom 64 for N64 (emulator) (3/5) - Crackdown 3 for X1S/X1X (4/5) - Infinity Blade III - for iPad 4 (3/5) - Infinity Blade II - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Infinity Blade - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Wolfenstein: The Old Blood for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Origins for X1 (3/5) - Uncharted: Lost Legacy for PS4 (4/5) - EA UFC 3 for X1 (4/5) - Doom for X1 (4/5) - Titanfall 2 for X1 (4/5) - Super Mario 3D World for Wii U (4/5) - South Park: The Stick of Truth for X1 BC (4/5) - Call of Duty: WWII for X1 (4/5) -Wolfenstein II for X1 - (4/5) - Dead or Alive: Dimensions for 3DS (4/5) - Marvel vs Capcom: Infinite for X1 (3/5) - Halo Wars 2 for X1/PC (4/5) - Halo Wars: DE for X1 (4/5) - Tekken 7 for X1 (4/5) - Injustice 2 for X1 (4/5) - Yakuza 5 for PS3 (3/5) - Battlefield 1 (Campaign) for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Syndicate for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: Infinite Warfare for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: MW Remastered for X1 (4/5) - Donkey Kong Country Returns for 3DS (4/5) - Forza Horizon 3 for X1 (5/5)

Mr Puggsly said:
JWeinCom said:

So far, school choice hasn't done those things.  

School choice, in the form of charter schools, has been rife with abuse.  The oversight has simply not been there, and competition hasn't done anything to help.  Competition between schools, whether public, charter, or private, has mostly served as motivation to fudge numbers and to eliminate the lowest performers.  

School choice hasn't had a chance to thrive yet so lets not pretend competition truly exist. School unions have been at war with charter schools and hindered their progress.

Public schools often like to ignore test scores but national tests show which are doing a poor job. Either way the direction Trump seems to be moving things can't be worse. We keep spending more on K-12 eductation with no results.

Hmmmm... so even when charter schools fail, that's the public school's fault.

There's well over 1000 charter schools.  We have enough of a sample to make a judgment.  As the laws currently are, they are not an effective solution.  The Trump administration has not made any proposals that would change things.