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Forums - Gaming - Nintendo addresses "weak" Switch launch lineup

Goodnightmoon on 02 February 2017
Hynad said:
Goodnightmoon said:

Or some people have a hard time making a distinction between a big line up and a good one, a good one makes you want to buy the console, a big one is just big, following the logic of this kind of forums Wiiu had a way better launch up, but that's just wrong, as hardcore Nintendo fan as I can be I thought WiiU had an awfull launch up, i recomended people not to buy it and i completely ignored it for more than a year (yes, me ignoring a Nintendo console, that some epic achievement), and so did everyone, but the thing is that is not gonna happen with Switch and BoTW has a lot to do with it, a single game can make an entire line up good as long as it achieves the purpose of a good launch up: make you want to buy the console.

What you describe is a system seller. A game that makes you want to buy the system. That game can come out anytime during a console's lifespan, depending on the gamer's needs and taste. That one game doesn't constitute a lcunah line-up, obviously enough. 

A launch line-up of games is simply that, a line-up of games ready for the launch of a platform. In this case, it is very limited in scope/choices. Meaning that, in the Switch's case, if you're not into that one high profile game, you're left with an anemic selection. 

Honestly, if someone is getting a Nintendo console at launch and is not interested on the most appealing Zelda Nintendo has ever done, chances are that person is part of the other kind of nintendo consumer, the one interested on things like 1-2 Switch and Just Dance. For the rest, they just have to wait a bit, as with every launch up, none satisfy everybody's needs.



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Faelco on 02 February 2017
Goodnightmoon said:
Faelco said:

A small number of gamers seems to be sure that Zelda is the greatest video game ever and that each new game in the series is an amazing system seller that the whole world dreams about.

And yet, the best selling Zelda game ever (Twilight Princess) sold less that Uncharted 4, even with an userbase twice bigger. It also sold less that annual games like FIFA (once again with an userbase twice bigger).

Zelda is a critical success and is hugely loved by Nintendo fans. But the broader audience doesn't care that much about it, and it surely won't change a console's fate by itself.

Some games sell 30m but they dont sell a system, some games sell a third of that, but they selkl the system, Fifa is not a system seller.

Also, funny how you totally forget that OoT, a game on a 35m userbase, sold more than uncharted 1,2 and 3 on an 80m userbase, what is the conclusuon of that? or maybe that part does not interest you? Appart fromt he fact that TP sold more than 9m when you combine the GC version, but BoTW will probably be the best selling Zelda ever anyways.

And nobody ever said that Uncharted 1, 2 or 3 were awesome commercial successes. Critical success yes, but until Uncharted 4 released everyone always said that Microsoft IPs like Halo or Gears were huge commercial successes and Sony IPs like Uncharted were not. Not a lot of people (almost noone) expected Uncharted 4 to outsell Halo 5 for example.

And you missed my point. Zelda sells Nintendo consoles to Nintendo fans. The rest of the world won't massively buy a console only for Zelda, the series is not popular enough for that. Never did, never will.

The Zelda audience isn't that big compared to the Wii U audience. Even with a 100M userbase, it didn't achieved 10M sales, we can pretty safely assume that less than 10M people in the world are in that Zelda's audience. This is pretty much on par with the usual ~15M Nintendo fans who bought the Wii U. No doubt about these 10-15M buying the Switch, they would buy it no matter what, the question is about the rest of the world. And this rest of the world won't buy the Switch for Zelda.

I'm really curious to see how your prediction of BoTW being the best selling Zelda ever will turn out...



Hynad on 02 February 2017
Goodnightmoon said:
Hynad said:

What you describe is a system seller. A game that makes you want to buy the system. That game can come out anytime during a console's lifespan, depending on the gamer's needs and taste. That one game doesn't constitute a lcunah line-up, obviously enough. 

A launch line-up of games is simply that, a line-up of games ready for the launch of a platform. In this case, it is very limited in scope/choices. Meaning that, in the Switch's case, if you're not into that one high profile game, you're left with an anemic selection. 

Honestly, if someone is getting a Nintendo console at launch and is not interested on the most appealing Zelda Nintendo has ever done, chances are that person is part of the other kind of nintendo consumer, the one interested on things like 1-2 Switch and Just Dance. For the rest, they just have to wait a bit, as with every launch up, none satisfy everybody's needs.


According to you, Zelda automatically appeals to anyone who likes Metroid, Super Mario, Mario Kart, Pokemon, Pikmin, F-Zero, StarFox, Donkey Kong, Kirby, Paper Mario, etc... You either like them all, or you're "that other kind of customers". Honestly, what a narrow minded way of seeing things. -____-



Louie_86 on 02 February 2017
Faelco said:
Goodnightmoon said:

Some games sell 30m but they dont sell a system, some games sell a third of that, but they selkl the system, Fifa is not a system seller.

Also, funny how you totally forget that OoT, a game on a 35m userbase, sold more than uncharted 1,2 and 3 on an 80m userbase, what is the conclusuon of that? or maybe that part does not interest you? Appart fromt he fact that TP sold more than 9m when you combine the GC version, but BoTW will probably be the best selling Zelda ever anyways.

And nobody ever said that Uncharted 1, 2 or 3 were awesome commercial successes. 

Well, I mean, I dont know what you'd call "awesome commercial successes" but 2 and 3 sold almost 7m physical. I'd call that a huge success for any franchise. 



irstupid on 02 February 2017
Neodegenerate said:
Goodnightmoon said:

Or some people have a hard time making a distinction between a big line up and a good one, a good one makes you want to buy the console, a big one is just big, following the logic of this kind of forums Wiiu had a way better launch up, but that's just wrong, as hardcore Nintendo fan as I can be I thought WiiU had an awfull launch up, i recomended people not to buy it and i completely ignored it for more than a year (yes, me ignoring a Nintendo console, that some epic achievement), and so did everyone, but the thing is that is not gonna happen with Switch and BoTW has a lot to do with it, a single game can make an entire line up good as long as it achieves the purpose of a good launch up: make you want to buy the console.

Sorry but no.  A good launch doesn't happen in that week.  It doesn't even happen in that month.  Early adopters are buying regardless of the launch line-up.  Pre-orders are being bought by people who have no interest in the system at all.  They are buying it in hopes to turn it around for more money on Ebay.  The same way it has happened with every console thusfar.  That number might not be huge, but it exists and is only a portion of my point.

If you are a baseball fan let's see if this helps.  You equating having Zelda as all you need for a great launch lineup is the same as me saying that a team of people who can't hit above .200 is a great offense because they have one guy who hits above .400.  It holds no damn weight.

I edited the hell outta this, I feel this makes my point better.

So then shouldn't one consider  good launch line-up being the first few months of the system and not day 1.

I mean if the system is going to sell out regardless in teh first month/shipment, then does it really matter if it has only one game.

By the times hpiment two is coming, buyers will have now two games. Zelda and Mario Kart?  I dont' know the release schedule. By the time shipment 3 comes out, add splatoon 2 to that list. (again rough guessing from memory)

As you said shipment 1 will be sold out regardless. With mario kart and zelda (and some others) it's not a stretch to say that shipment 2 should sell decent if not also sell out. By shipment 3 you have a very good line-up of games out and looking at the schedule there is more good games coming out basically monthly.

The Wii U had the problem of having a ton of games on release and then nothing for months. And most of those games were already palyable on 360/p3/one/ps4 and thus you probably just purchased them on a system you already own if you didn't buy the Wii U at launch. So in the following months what was the incentive to buy a WIi U? nothign was coming out. You played basically everythign it has to offer on something else.



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yvanjean on 02 February 2017
flashfire926 said:

Couldn't disagree more. While the Wii launch lineup destroys Switch, the Wii u one is much worse IMO. Yeah the wii u had more games, but didn't have a significant first party title(2d mario doesn't count) for a long time. People played all those multiplats on 360 and PS3, NOT on wii u. Many people didn't have a reason to buy the wii u because of this. Zelda alone makes the Switch launch better than Wii u.

I agree that Zelda will be amazing on Switch. But, has a WiiU owner I feel screwed by Nintendo for delaying the Zelda game over and over again. I don't see Zelda: Breath of the Wild has a Switch game, its actually a WiiU game that got delayed continuously to be ported on the Switch has one of the system launch game. 

But somehow Nintendo doesn't deliver on any other games on Switch at launch other then the WiiU port of Zelda. 

Don't get me wrong, I don't want Nintendo to fail but Zelda: breath of the wild should of been a killer app to what should of been a killer launch lineup. 

Now I probably won't even get to play Zelda till this holiday. Since I don't want to play the inferior version on WiiU and I don't like the value proposition of the Switch. I'm hoping that we get a Zelda Switch bundle on Black Friday. 



Alkibiádēs on 02 February 2017
Bandorr said:
Alkibiádēs said:

Why would you remove Zelda?

If Twilight Princess is any indication the fact that it's not exclusive won't matter at all. The Gamecube version barely sold anything. 

For the people that don't care about Zelda? I have zero interest in Zelda. So to represent how weak the launch line up is - you remove Zelda.

The launch line up is only "good" when you include that one game. If you remove one game it is a weak lineup. Thus anyone that finds no interest in Zelda considers it a weak line up.

Millions of people care about Zelda so launch sales will be good. By the time every hardcore Zelda fan has bought the Switch there will already be new games released like Shovel Knight: Specter of Torment (new campaign and it releases first on the Switch), Fast RMX, Mario Kart 8 Deluxe, Arms, Splatoon 2, Sonic Mania, Yooka-Laylee, Snake Pass, etc.

 Besides, I think 1-2 Switch will be a bigger success than most people think. Pre-orders are decent in Japan based on COMG.  



"The strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must" - Thoukydides

Goodnightmoon on 02 February 2017
Hynad said:
Goodnightmoon said:

Honestly, if someone is getting a Nintendo console at launch and is not interested on the most appealing Zelda Nintendo has ever done, chances are that person is part of the other kind of nintendo consumer, the one interested on things like 1-2 Switch and Just Dance. For the rest, they just have to wait a bit, as with every launch up, none satisfy everybody's needs.


According to you, Zelda automatically appeals to anyone who likes Metroid, Super Mario, Mario Kart, Pokemon, Pikmin, F-Zero, StarFox, Donkey Kong, Kirby, Paper Mario, etc... You like them all, or you're "that other kind of customers". Honestly, what a narrow minded way of seeing things. -____-


I didn't mean that "other kind of customer" as a bad thing at all, I just think this was probably Nintendo train of though here.

A hardcore nintendo fan not interested in a game like BoTW sounds like a rarity, and people buying consoles at launch are usually fans, so is not that crazy to think that most of the people buying the console at launch without having an interest on Zelda are probably part of the the other kind of Nintendo fan, those that rarely go to forums like this one, in that case there are other games at launch that catter to that audience. Yeah sure BoTW (and 1,2 Switch) is not representing all Nintendo fans tastes but what console has a line up that represent the tastes of all their fans? is not like they could release the console with all those games you mention at launch.



Hynad on 02 February 2017
irstupid said:
Neodegenerate said:

Sorry but no.  A good launch doesn't happen in that week.  It doesn't even happen in that month.  Early adopters are buying regardless of the launch line-up.  Pre-orders are being bought by people who have no interest in the system at all.  They are buying it in hopes to turn it around for more money on Ebay.  The same way it has happened with every console thusfar.  That number might not be huge, but it exists and is only a portion of my point.

If you are a baseball fan let's see if this helps.  You equating having Zelda as all you need for a great launch lineup is the same as me saying that a team of people who can't hit above .200 is a great offense because they have one guy who hits above .400.  It holds no damn weight.

I edited the hell outta this, I feel this makes my point better.

So then shouldn't one consider  good launch line-up being the first few months of the system and not day 1.

I mean if the system is going to sell out regardless in teh first month/shipment, then does it really matter if it has only one game.

By the times hpiment two is coming, buyers will have now two games. Zelda and Mario Kart?  I dont' know the release schedule. By the time shipment 3 comes out, add splatoon 2 to that list. (again rough guessing from memory)

As you said shipment 1 will be sold out regardless. With mario kart and zelda (and some others) it's not a stretch to say that shipment 2 should sell decent if not also sell out. By shipment 3 you have a very good line-up of games out and looking at the schedule there is more good games coming out basically monthly.

The Wii U had the problem of having a ton of games on release and then nothing for months. And most of those games were already palyable on 360/p3/one/ps4 and thus you probably just purchased them on a system you already own if you didn't buy the Wii U at launch. So in the following months what was the incentive to buy a WIi U? nothign was coming out. You played basically everythign it has to offer on something else.

No, we shouldn't, because once you're done with Zelda and want a new experience, what are you left with? You either have to wait until those new titles come out, or you're left with that anemic range of titles that don't really look compelling.



Neodegenerate on 02 February 2017
irstupid said:
Neodegenerate said:

Sorry but no.  A good launch doesn't happen in that week.  It doesn't even happen in that month.  Early adopters are buying regardless of the launch line-up.  Pre-orders are being bought by people who have no interest in the system at all.  They are buying it in hopes to turn it around for more money on Ebay.  The same way it has happened with every console thusfar.  That number might not be huge, but it exists and is only a portion of my point.

If you are a baseball fan let's see if this helps.  You equating having Zelda as all you need for a great launch lineup is the same as me saying that a team of people who can't hit above .200 is a great offense because they have one guy who hits above .400.  It holds no damn weight.

I edited the hell outta this, I feel this makes my point better.

So then shouldn't one consider  good launch line-up being the first few months of the system and not day 1.

I mean if the system is going to sell out regardless in teh first month/shipment, then does it really matter if it has only one game.

By the times hpiment two is coming, buyers will have now two games. Zelda and Mario Kart?  I dont' know the release schedule. By the time shipment 3 comes out, add splatoon 2 to that list. (again rough guessing from memory)

As you said shipment 1 will be sold out regardless. With mario kart and zelda (and some others) it's not a stretch to say that shipment 2 should sell decent if not also sell out. By shipment 3 you have a very good line-up of games out and looking at the schedule there is more good games coming out basically monthly.

The Wii U had the problem of having a ton of games on release and then nothing for months. And most of those games were already palyable on 360/p3/one/ps4 and thus you probably just purchased them on a system you already own if you didn't buy the Wii U at launch. So in the following months what was the incentive to buy a WIi U? nothign was coming out. You played basically everythign it has to offer on something else.

Splatoon 2 still has a lot to prove in order for me to call it a great addition to the launch line up.  Was the first one a flash in the pan kind of success or can it be sustained?  I am guessing it will be great, but it has potential not to be.  Mario Kart 8 Deluxe I would certainly include, though tentatively because it is essentially a remaster/port.  So we have 2 games that are great, one that is probably going to be great, and then a bunch of not much hanging around.  To me that still isn't a great launch line up.  It doesn't hit any target other than "Nintendo Fan" that well.  Having a couple of solid third party games launch within those timeframes would go a very large way.  Sports games, military shooters, RPGs, other titles that fill other demographic roles outside of the casual (1-2 Switch) and the Nintendo groups are what would make it a good launch lineup.

Edit: and with a few of the new IPs they do have dropping it will be fun to do this exercise again in six months to see if the launch lineup surprised people like myself.  I can see a game like Arms (which I have zero interest in) pulling a Splatoon this year and coming out of nowhere to critical and commercial success.  I don't see it as that likely, but it isn't impossible.  Same with any number of games in the lineup that looks weak.