I like how some forum dwellers think they understand the JPN market better than anyone.
I like how some forum dwellers think they understand the JPN market better than anyone.
Soundwave said:
/Donald Trump: "Wrong" This is the excuse movie studios say when a movie badly underperforms their expectations in the US. Under 900k opening in Japan for a Final Fantasy game is like a main line Star Wars opening to only $30-$40 million in the US. That would be a disaster. Square-Enix execs are gutted by this. No doubt about it, it will definitely also impact the budget of Final Fantasy XVI, I have little doubt. The days of Square's dev team getting any amount of money and time to make a Final Fantasy game are likely coming to an end. |
You may have a point overall, but the bolded is an unnecessary exaggeration. It's far from a disaster. It's good but not great for FF standards. If a more Western FF game helps it sell better in the West and equal overall, I see no problem with lower (yet in no way disastrous) sales in Japan.

Soundwave said:
PS4 hasn't done shit in Japan to deserve a Dragon Quest game. That belongs to the market leader, Enix has said this in the past. 3DS is the current market leader, and Switch will be the future market leader. And don't get me wrong, I'm happy PS4 owners get to enjoy the game. That said would it kill Square to give Nintendo the same benefit of the doubt? Final Fantasy VII Remake and XV and XVI and Kingdom Hearts III should be on Switch. Fair is fair. It's for their own damn benefit anyway, having to "argue" that Japanese developers should support the Switch is like having to argue with a man who thinks shooting himself in the head is a good idea. Nintendo is going to have to save these stubborn developers from themselves. We need a strong, healthy traditional game platform in Japan. Nintendo is the only one that can provide it. Time to party like it's 1990 and support that thing like it's Super Famicom. |
PS4 is the market leader on Japan, handheld is a different market.
That isn't "benefit of doubt" It is that every single Final Fantasy game sold almost 10 millions on PS.

| Alkibiádēs said: People don't seem to be able to accept the truth here. Yes, Final Fantasy XV bombed hard in Japan. The game had a very long development cycle and must have cost a lot of money to make. If Japanese developers had any self-preservation they would switch to Nintendo. The best selling Dragon Quest game came out on the DS and not the more powerful PSP or PS3. A game doesn't need to be on a powerful console for it to sell a lot or be good. Pokémon Red and Blue and Pokémon Gold and Silver offer more content than 99% of the modern games. Pokémon Sun and Moon only took around 3 years to develop (with part of the team making a remake of Ruby and Sapphire as well) and it absolutely destroyed Final Fantasy XV in sales. The budget of Pokémon Sun and Moon will have been only a fraction of Final Fantasy XV. Square Enix is only hurting themselves by releasing games exclusively on the PS4 (and the XBONE). Kingdom Hearts 3 is another game that is taking forever to develop and I'm pretty sure Dragon Quest XI will see many delays as well because of the PS4 version. I can say the same for Capcom. Street Fighter V was a total flop. Bandai Namco meanwhile worked together with Nintendo and made Super Smash Bros. for Wii U and 3DS (best selling in the franchise) and Pokken Tournament (surprisingly outsold Street Fighter V on the PS4). Koei Tecmo made Hyrule Warriors which was one of the most successful Dynasty Warrior games in years. The 3DS should have gotten a mainline Final Fantasy game, but it didn't and only game companies can be that stupid to ignore such a large market segment. (Japanese) developers have always put blind faith in Playstation consoles, it's time they do the same for the Switch. And why on earth is Square Enix supporting Microsoft more than Nintendo? Their anti-Nintendo bias will hit them hard in the future if they don't watch out. We get it Square, you don't like cartridges, get over it because your most famous franchise is getting trashed by "the guys who still make cartridge games". Oh the irony. |
That should be fairy obvious; because Microsoft offer hardware that SE's AAA titles can be easily scaled onto, while Nintendo haven't. It's for that same reason that we've seen Final Fantasy progressively move further into the PC market too.
SE have been one of the 3DS's strongest 3rd party supporters. They clearly have no problem supporting a Nintendo system when they consider it worth their time. What they clearly aren't interested in though is either fundamentally re-engineering their games to serve a fraction of the market (the WiiU), or alienating the overwhelming majority of an existing fan-base (in this instance Final Fantasy's) in favour of the 3DS. If they were going down that rout, i'd expect them to skip straight to mobile. That at least is a growing market.

Zekkyou said:
That should be fairy obvious; because Microsoft offer hardware that SE's AAA titles can be easily scaled onto, while Nintendo haven't. It's for that same reason that we've seen Final Fantasy progressively move further into the PC market too. SE have been one of the 3DS's strongest 3rd party supporters. They clearly have no problem supporting a Nintendo system when they consider it worth their time. What they clearly aren't interested in though is either fundamentally re-engineering their games to serve a fraction of the market (the WiiU), or alienating the overwhelming majority of an existing fan-base (in this instance Final Fantasy's) in favour of the 3DS. If they were going down that rout, i'd expect them to skip straight to mobile. That at least is a growing market. |
Enix has been a strong supporter of 3DS (bet the guy who pushed for DQXI on 3DS/Switch is feeling pretty damn vindicated today) ... but the Square side I'd say has been fairly dissapointing.
Who's dick does Nintendo have to suck at Square to get some real Final Fantasy? World of Final Fantasy and Final Fantasy X couldn't have been on the 3DS but rather go to Vita (a system that has less than 1/4 the sales).
20 million install base only gets you two music game spin-offs? Really Square? Really?
IMO Square has had a bias towards Nintendo since the N64 days, it's time the executives at the company took charge of the situation and said "you're supporting Switch, period. Stop crying". I think some cold hard reality is going to be dawning on the Square side of the company given these sales. They've let the inmates (the developers) run the aslyum and it's taking the company right down the toilet.
Nintendo has made some poor hardware choices, but Switch looks like an honest attempt to make a powerful system *given* the limitations of portability, which is the only type of game platform Japan will accept today. It's time Japanese developers instead of shunning Nintendo understand that Nintendo is trying to save the damn industry in Japan so that *they* themselves also have some kind of future to work with other than iOS.
| Soundwave said: Enix has been a strong supporter of 3DS (bet the guy who pushed for DQXI on 3DS/Switch is feeling pretty damn vindicated today) ... but the Square side I'd say has been fairly dissapointing. Who's dick does Nintendo have to suck at Square to get some real Final Fantasy? World of Final Fantasy and Final Fantasy X couldn't have been on the 3DS but rather go to Vita (a system that has less than 1/4 the sales). 20 million install base only gets you two music game spin-offs? Really Square? Really? IMO Square has had a bias towards Nintendo since the N64 days, it's time the executives at the company took charge of the situation and said "you're supporting Switch, period. Stop crying". I think some cold hard reality is going to be dawning on the Square side of the company given these sales. They've let the inmates (the developers) run the aslyum and it's taking the company right down the toilet. Nintendo has made some poor hardware choices, but Switch looks like an honest attempt to make a powerful system *given* the limitations of portability, which is the only type of game platform Japan will accept today. It's time Japanese developers instead of shunning Nintendo understand that Nintendo is trying to save the damn industry in Japan so that *they* themselves also have some kind of future to work with other than iOS. |
No one had to push for DQXI to be on the 3DS roflmao It's the other way around. Someone at Square Enix pushed for a PS4 version (most likely Horii). It was always going to be on the 3DS. And you seem to forget Final Fantasy Explorers.
Boutros said:
No one had to push for DQXI to be on the 3DS roflmao It's the other way around. Someone at Square Enix pushed for a PS4 version (most likely Horii). It was always going to be on the 3DS. And you seem to forget Final Fantasy Explorers. |
Actually it would not surprise me in the least if Nintendo had to lobby a bit to get DQXI on 3DS/Switch.
If DQ had any sort of decent sales potential in the West, Square-Enix foolishly probably would've made it a PS4/XB1 release and let that be that.
Because they know 90% of DQ's sales would be in Japan they probably went "aw shit, I think we probably should throw Nintendo or two, just in case".
3DS honestly is not supported by Japanese devs nearly as strongly as it should be.
This is also terrible for Square-Enix's future. Final Fantasy is the cornerstone of the company, if its large decline like this (is it even one of the top 5 franchises in Japan any more? Splatoon at 1.5 million is likely going to have a higher LTD on the Wii U) .... yikes Square-Enix.
Boutros said:
No one had to push for DQXI to be on the 3DS roflmao It's the other way around. Someone at Square Enix pushed for a PS4 version (most likely Horii). It was always going to be on the 3DS. And you seem to forget Final Fantasy Explorers. |
Yeah, because spending millions of dollars to make a game for a tiny demographic (the PS4 in Japan) makes sense. I swear, some of these companies seem to be run by idiots lol. I wonder if the 3DS version and PS4 version will release at the same time. We all know that the PS4 version will get delayed (like every other Square game), but the 3DS is nearing the end of its life cycle. This could be another disaster waiting to happen.
And people say that FF XV is a game catered to Western gamers. Really? Have you taken one look at the main characters? That's not catered to Western gamers. Fallout, The Witcher and The Elder Scrolls are catered to the West. I'm not sure who FF XV was catered at. Obviously it will sell in the West - on brand recognition alone. If this was marketed as a new IP I doubt it would do well in the West.
"The strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must" - Thoukydides
Alkibiádēs said:
Yeah, because spending millions of dollars to make a game for a tiny demographic (the PS4 in Japan) makes sense. I swear, some of these companies seem to be run by idiots lol. I wonder if the 3DS version and PS4 version will release at the same time. We all know that the PS4 version will get delayed (like every other Square game), but the 3DS is nearing the end of its life cycle. This could be another disaster waiting to happen. And people say that FF XV is a game catered to Western gamers. Really? Have you taken one look at the main characters? That's not catered to Western gamers. Fallout, The Witcher and The Elder Scrolls are catered to the West. I'm not sure who FF XV was catered at. Obviously it will sell in the West - on brand recognition alone. If this was marketed as a new IP I doubt it would do well in the West. |
The PS4 version could still sell 1m in Japan which might be enough to cover the cost depending on what it is. But the PS4 version is Square Enix's attempt at making the franchise more popular outside of Japan. Also that's simply what Horii wanted and what Horii wants Horii gets lol
Boutros said:
The PS4 version could still sell 1m in Japan which might be enough to cover the cost depending on what it is. But the PS4 version is Square Enix's attempt at making the franchise more popular outside of Japan. Also that's simply what Horii wanted and what Horii wants Horii gets lol |
When you think about it, there's a pretty good chance Final Fantasy XV is the most expensive Japanese made game ever.
These sales are a really bad omen for Japanese AAA development.
I think Japanese developers have miscalculated the success of the PS4 as well thinking it was basically PS2-all-over-again. It's not. It's very popular in the West with WESTERN games. Final Fantasy XV underperforming and Street Fighter V flopping should be sobering wake up calls. In Japan the PS4 is selling relatively poorly, it is no second coming of the PS2 in Japan. Traditional gaming is under serious threat.