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Forums - General Discussion - ? concerning transgender people

 

Are you transgender(or any other special gender)?

Yes. 7 6.36%
 
No. 103 93.64%
 
Total:110
Nettles said:
Brain doesn't matter.Popping pills won't change the thing that matters most....
Men are born with a Y chromosome, women with another X chromosome.This is what determines gender.
XX = female, XY = male.

Wrong, your sex chromosomes determine your sex not your gender, look up the difference and educate yourself. 

Transgender is pretty well described and scientifically recognised in the field of psychology. So if you want to understand the science behind it then you can pretty easily look it up and you don't have to rely on the laregly uneducated opinions of people who frequent video game forums.

I'm unsure whether psychologists have really answered the question of what is it that makes a person fell like a man or a woman. But they certainly do know that people perceive their gender psychologically independant of their physical form. For the majority of people how they feel, aligns with their sex, but sometimes it doesn't. So the question is what's the "legitimate" thing, how people feel, or what bits they were born with? Most psychologists will say that it's what gender you feel that's most important, not what sex your born with. I agrre with that order of priority.



“The fundamental cause of the trouble is that in the modern world the stupid are cocksure while the intelligent are full of doubt.” - Bertrand Russell

"When the power of love overcomes the love of power, the world will know peace."

Jimi Hendrix

 

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I can't imagine what it must be like to be born one gender and feel like you actually belong to the other. Still, I think it's better to learn to accept your birth gender than going through drastic and expensive medical procedures.



binary solo said:
Nettles said:
Brain doesn't matter.Popping pills won't change the thing that matters most....
Men are born with a Y chromosome, women with another X chromosome.This is what determines gender.
XX = female, XY = male.

Wrong, your sex chromosomes determine your sex not your gender, look up the difference and educate yourself. 

Transgender is pretty well described and scientifically recognised in the field of psychology. So if you want to understand the science behind it then you can pretty easily look it up and you don't have to rely on the laregly uneducated opinions of people who frequent video game forums.

I'm unsure whether psychologists have really answered the question of what is it that makes a person fell like a man or a woman. But they certainly do know that people perceive their gender psychologically independant of their physical form. For the majority of people how they feel, aligns with their sex, but sometimes it doesn't. So the question is what's the "legitimate" thing, how people feel, or what bits they were born with? Most psychologists will say that it's what gender you feel that's most important, not what sex your born with. I agrre with that order of priority.

But isn't it that which is physical more real than that whitch we feel? 



The science of it doesn't really matter. We, as humans, have transcended the biological idea of gender. It doesn't matter is she was born a he. It doesn't matter if she will always be a he to you. Just call her a she when you're in her presence. It's just a pronoun. It doesn't cost anyone anything to break that grammar "rule" once in a while if is makes someone happy and comfortable in the skin they're in.



TheLight said:
binary solo said:

Wrong, your sex chromosomes determine your sex not your gender, look up the difference and educate yourself. 

Transgender is pretty well described and scientifically recognised in the field of psychology. So if you want to understand the science behind it then you can pretty easily look it up and you don't have to rely on the laregly uneducated opinions of people who frequent video game forums.

I'm unsure whether psychologists have really answered the question of what is it that makes a person fell like a man or a woman. But they certainly do know that people perceive their gender psychologically independant of their physical form. For the majority of people how they feel, aligns with their sex, but sometimes it doesn't. So the question is what's the "legitimate" thing, how people feel, or what bits they were born with? Most psychologists will say that it's what gender you feel that's most important, not what sex your born with. I agrre with that order of priority.

But isn't it that which is physical more real than that whitch we feel? 

No. What is real? Physical reality is only that which can be perceived by the senses, or by instruments that enhance our senses. So the only reality is that which our minds create based on receiving input data from our senses. We are all just brains in a bottle, it's just that our bottle is body shaped and not made of glass. When it comes down to it our mind is the only thing we actually have that we can be mostly sure is real. So how you feel is more real that what you look like.



“The fundamental cause of the trouble is that in the modern world the stupid are cocksure while the intelligent are full of doubt.” - Bertrand Russell

"When the power of love overcomes the love of power, the world will know peace."

Jimi Hendrix

 

Around the Network
spemanig said:
The science of it doesn't really matter. We, as humans, have transcended the biological idea of gender. It doesn't matter is she was born a he. It doesn't matter if she will always be a he to you. Just call her a she when you're in her presence. It's just a pronoun. It doesn't cost anyone anything to break that grammar "rule" once in a while if is makes someone happy and comfortable in the skin they're in.

So you think we are more than physical beings.  "comfortable in the skin they're in." and that they shouldn't have surgery? 



To drive home this idea of not being an inconsiderate asshole on the principal of insignificant semantics, I'd like to bring up an example of equal consequence.

There once was a young girl. She was born with the name Destiny. However, she preferred a different name. Growing up, people began referring to her by this different name. This nick name. This nick name wasn't her born name, but she asked everyone she knew to call her by this other name, because she did not identify with her birth name, Destiny. Even her birth parents would call her by this nick name. Anyone calling her Destiny at this point were just needlessly and knowingly being jerks. She wasn't hurting anybody asking to be called this other name.

When she turned 18, she made a decision. She identified so strongly with this other name, that it felt like more than a nickname to her. It defined her. It was the true her. It was her identity. Destiny was not her name anymore, not to her. So shortly after she turned 18, Miley Cyrus finally made her new name official.



binary solo said:
TheLight said:

But isn't it that which is physical more real than that whitch we feel? 

No. What is real? Physical reality is only that which can be perceived by the senses, or by instruments that enhance our senses. So the only reality is that which our minds create based on receiving input data from our senses. We are all just brains in a bottle, it's just that our bottle is body shaped and not made of glass. When it comes down to it our mind is the only thing we actually have that we can be mostly sure is real. So how you feel is more real that what you look like.

You are assuming way to much. That assumes people can't be mistaken and that assumes that logic is not greater than feeling and if what you say is true how can we trust our theoretical scientific theroies at all  because how than would we know if our thinking is flawed.  

So you only feel that I am wrong therfore your opinion would mean nothing to me.



TheLight said:

So you think we are more than physical beings.  "comfortable in the skin they're in." and that they shouldn't have surgery? 

No. The point I was making is that human beings are cultured. We are intelligent. If we are smart enough to come up with language, we are smart enough to bend it in a way that makes the recipient happy. If sex change surgery makes someone happy, they should 100% do it. And then everyone should refer to them by their changed gender, because it doesn't matter what they were born as. The literal only reason to call a transgendered woman a man is to be a prick. 



spemanig said:
TheLight said:

So you think we are more than physical beings.  "comfortable in the skin they're in." and that they shouldn't have surgery? 

No. The point I was making is that human beings are cultured. We are intelligent. If we are smart enough to come up with language, we are smart enough to bend it in a way that makes the recipient happy. If sex change surgery makes someone happy, they should 100% do it. And then everyone should refer to them by their changed gender, because it doesn't matter what they were born as. The literal only reason to call a transgendered woman a man is to be a prick. 

But the surgery is just an illusion, you and they are assuming that the surgery will make them happy.  When they can't know what it will feel like before hand and the procedure is ireversable.  If you had a forced sex change surgery and then had corective sugery to do the best surgons could do to restore your form I am 99% sure that you would be unhappy with the result.  You as a person would be un happy with the equivalent transgender body.

http://waltheyer.typepad.com/blog/2013/11/20-regret-changing-genders-over-40attempt-suicide-and-even-after-surgery-a-large-number-remain-traum.html

 Many people do regret the surgery and kill themselfs, but you don't need to take anyones word for it.  We can use logic if we are using feelings over logic we are doomed to go extinct soon and it dosen't mean anything.  You can't turly want what you don't known if a man thinks he wants a female body he wants something that he can't have he will never have a real female body and he will not know what it is like before hand.  He may want to be treated like a women and surgery can fix that, but is it worth risking that and then regret it and commit suicide? Are you encoreging pepole to do something that can likely results in their death?