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Forums - General Discussion - What do you think you have to do to get to Heaven?

kazadoom said:
stranne said:
Imagine there's no heaven
It's easy if you try
No hell below us
Above us only sky
Imagine all the people
Living for today

The sad thing is he is not imagining anymore and now knows the truth.  Imagining does not make things untrue no matter how hard you imagine.


Of course, with you, the reverse is true. 



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Magnific0 said:
@kazadoom

First of all you'd have to ask yourself , "do I have a SOUL ?" Every religious person asumes they have souls and after the physical body stops functioning (brain death) somehow this soul detaches itself from wherever it resides in you and travels to a "spiritual plane". When does this soul enters the physical body in first place? Is it when both reproduction cells unite? And where was this soul before inhabiting our earthly matter? Can we just asume it was created then and there too (at the union of the cells)?

The belief of Heaven and Hell also asumes the soul is eternal. But aren't eternal things those of which we know no beginning and end, like God? Are we supposed to asume our souls have existed since forever too?

About Hell. Eternal Damnation. So souls are indeed eternal, or so the Bible preaches. Isn't Hell the most sadistic invention imagined? Is that divine justice? Have anyone, the worst of the sinners of mankind history, -Adolf Hitler! comes inmediately to mind-, have anyone really been eternally evil to deserve eternal punishment? If that's the way God works, I'd rather believe there's no God.

The first answer I can give is I don't know where a sould comes from and where it goes I take it as a matter of faith and someting I feel. As to what a soul is as a quaker I believe that God is inside everyone we call it the inner light and so therefore our souls are a part of god.

About Hell. Well depends on your take. Jesus used two words to describe hell Gehenna and Sh'eol. Gehenna in judaism is the worst place to be and is named after a place of shame. This is where the jewish people sacrificed their children to the cainite god Molech. For you WoW players if you goto Molten Core you will see a boss named Gehennas. Anywyas the jewish version of hell has different layers where demons pick at your soul for each sin you have done. If you done to many sins than your soul will eventually dissappear. Sh'eol seems to be a lesser type of hell and that along with Pauls revelation of a third heaven is the catholic churches basis for purgatory(well that and a chance to ring the coffers up in the dark ages). The Catholic church teaches Hell as the absence of God and complete alienation from others. Whose rigth or wrong I don't know.

 

The opposite is Gan Eden which is supposed to be heaven. However most of Jewish teaching of the afterlife is fairly minimal compared to christianity.



SamuelRSmith said:
kazadoom said:
stranne said:
Imagine there's no heaven
It's easy if you try
No hell below us
Above us only sky
Imagine all the people
Living for today

The sad thing is he is not imagining anymore and now knows the truth.  Imagining does not make things untrue no matter how hard you imagine.


Of course, with you, the reverse is true. 


Well the reverse is not true. If there was no heaven and no hell then he wouldn't know because he wouldn't be hear. Which is comforting to know if I am wrong than nothing will happen.



@redspear I really don't understand what you're trying to say.



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redspear said:
SamuelRSmith said:
kazadoom said:
stranne said:
Imagine there's no heaven
It's easy if you try
No hell below us
Above us only sky
Imagine all the people
Living for today

The sad thing is he is not imagining anymore and now knows the truth. Imagining does not make things untrue no matter how hard you imagine.


Of course, with you, the reverse is true.


Well the reverse is not true. If there was no heaven and no hell then he wouldn't know because he wouldn't be hear. Which is comforting to know if I am wrong than nothing will happen.


 There certainly does not have to be a heaven or a hell for there to be an after life.



@mesoteto

Not following a religious doctrine does not preclude people from leading fulfilling lives full of love and compassion. Just as following a religious doctrine does not preclude an individual from leading a life full of hate, bitterness, fear and lonliness.



SamuelRSmith said:
@redspear I really don't understand what you're trying to say.

LOL. All I am saying is this. If there is no heaven or hell nobody will no once they died. I went ot be both catholic and jewish schools. Even though I have said this before I will say it again in this thread. I asked a nun what if tehy are wrong and htere is no heaven or hell and you lived your life like this for no reason. Her reply was than I will not know and it will not bother me. that is all I am saying.



redspear said:
SamuelRSmith said:
@redspear I really don't understand what you're trying to say.

LOL. All I am saying is this. If there is no heaven or hell nobody will no once they died. I went ot be both catholic and jewish schools. Even though I have said this before I will say it again in this thread. I asked a nun what if tehy are wrong and htere is no heaven or hell and you lived your life like this for no reason. Her reply was than I will not know and it will not bother me. that is all I am saying.

 Well, that nun was wrong. Your logic is blind to other possibilities because of something you were told as a child. There is no requirement for a heaven or a hell for there to be an after life. If you can prove otherwise please do.



I believe one must be part of the 144,000. Everyone else has a hope to live on a paradise earth for eternity.

@Magnific0: I'm religious and don't believe in a soul that is separate from the physical body.