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Forums - Gaming - Apple A9X: The Mobile Processor That Outperforms a Wii U?

Soundwave on 25 September 2015
Solid-Stark said:
Soundwave said:


It probably can produce something on the screen that's close if you allow it to cheat on resolution. 

That said it's probably also a chip that would generate a lot of heat and would certainly require a very large battery. 

It would be not be possible in something the size of the current 3DS XL I don't think. Not without melting the inside of the casing. 

You need some legroom and quite possibly even a fan (just in case) to get that level of performance. 

This is the battery of an iPad Mini, and it's massive compared to the current 3DS battery, and even that, at say 8 watts consumption/hour would only give you 3 hours of battery life. 


We would assume all things possibly equal or so I thought was the OP, such as the Nvidia Shield console which has a Tegra X1 (better than a8x) and if I recall correctly edges out the PS3/360. Though the K1 beat the 7th gen consoles in compute performance it would still be behind in actual game performance, but the X1 would be a different story I think. Therefore the a9x (better than the X1) should do it no problem.


I don't really doubt that a processor like the A9X in an enclosed game-focused environment couldn't smoke a Wii U/PS3. 

The question though is what kind of form factor could you realistically put such a chip into. Even at 14nm, I don't think you could put that into a 3DS XL sized casing. 

If I was Nintendo I'd just say fuck it, and go for it. They can't really compete on the low end against phones anyway, the only future for $40 portable games I think is to make them far, far more impressive than they are now. 

Go all out, make a portable that's so powerful it can even function as a home console, if it has to be the size of say DVD portable player from back in the day ... that's OK. 

When you get down to 10nm maybe you can make a pocket sized version of it down the line. You couldn't put the original Game Boy in your pocket, the thing was a damn brick anyway, and even the 3DS XL and 2DS models are a pain in the ass to fit into a pocket. May as well just go with a bigger form factor. 



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Solid-Stark on 25 September 2015
Soundwave said:
Solid-Stark said:


We would assume all things possibly equal or so I thought was the OP, such as the Nvidia Shield console which has a Tegra X1 (better than a8x) and if I recall correctly edges out the PS3/360. Though the K1 beat the 7th gen consoles in compute performance it would still be behind in actual game performance, but the X1 would be a different story I think. Therefore the a9x (better than the X1) should do it no problem.


I don't really doubt that a processor like the A9X in an enclosed game-focused environment couldn't smoke a Wii U/PS3. 

The question though is what kind of form factor could you realistically put such a chip into. Even at 14nm, I don't think you could put that into a 3DS XL sized casing. 

If I was Nintendo I'd just say fuck it, and go for it. They can't really compete on the low end against phones.

Go all out, make a portable that's so powerful it can even function as a home console, if it has to be the size of say DVD portable player from back in the day ... that's OK. 

When you get down to 10nm maybe you can make a pocket sized version of it down the line. You couldn't put the original Game Boy in your pocket, the thing was a damn brick anyway, and even the 3DS XL and 2DS models are a pain in the ass to fit into a pocket. May as well just go with a bigger form factor. 


Oh yeah for sure, to fit this in to a suitable handheld console we would still need more advancement due to heat and efficiency due to battery and such. I'm not familiar with the progression of the non-x varients compared to the previous x varients (such as a9 compared to a8x) and what a a10 would bring compared to the a9x. I'd imagine they are still slightly behind, but an a10 should match an a8x more or less which is a lower barrier if this type of comparison.



e=mc^2

Gaming on: PS4 Pro, Switch, SNES Mini, Wii U, PC (i5-7400, GTX 1060)

Miyamotoo on 25 September 2015
Conina said:
Soundwave said:
All hardware eventually gets more expensive over time anyway due to inflation.

The PS4's $399.99 is the equivalent to the PS1 launching at $299.99.

Not all hardware. It was pretty normal in the 90s to pay $2000 - $3000 for a decent PC, nowadays it's usually $800 - $1200.

Average prices for TVs, monitors, mass storage, RAM, "music players", "movie players", cameras and other entertainment devices have also gone down a lot over the years.


http://www.ign.com/articles/2013/10/15/the-real-cost-of-gaming-inflation-time-and-purchasing-power

http://kotaku.com/36-years-of-console-prices-adjusted-for-inflation-1485353267



Miyamotoo on 25 September 2015
spemanig said:
Miyamotoo said:

I don't see any connection between DS device and unifying platform. I dont think we will se DS device again, I think better chances are for Wii U concept, using NX device like Wii U gamepad for playing some games (probably Wii U games) on TV.


The connection is Nintendo and their history of devices with dual screens. If this was Sony making a unified platform, I've be arguing a single screen, because it would make absolutely no sence for Sony to make a dual screen handheld and console at this point. It makes even less sence with Nintendo to do the opposite, since removing the bottom screen from only the handheld when the console still has two screens would make it incompatible with NX, Wii U, DS, and 3DS games for literally no good reason.

Not going to happen. It's already confirmed that there will be both a handheld and a home console, and it's already confirmed that they will be apart of a unified platfrom. It makes no sense, then to have your console be some weird portable hybrid that plays the console games on the TV that you can then take with you away from the screen. Absolutely no chance anything like that is happening. That completely goes against having a unified platform.

What is event the point of having a unified platform when your console is already portable? Why would Nintendo make a device which is capable of having dual screen play, but limit that to only legacy games? Why would Nintendo make a device that forces developers to make every game playable with only only screen, when they are making a device that can support two? Why would any developer create a dual screen game for a system that would primerily be played with one screen? Why would Nintendo make any device that would make a developer question that? Why would Nintendo, then, be making a dual screen device where most of the games would render the bottom screen useless when plugged into a TV, rendering the botton screen a nuisence since it would negatively effect the urganomics of the controller for no reason? What are Nintendo going to do when all NX games are made to use a single screen touch screen that can't be seemlessly emulated on a dual screen TV set up? Are you going to touch the TV screen? Is every game going to be like Kirby Canvas Curse where the same thing is shown on both screens, but since you need to look at the bottom screen to use any touch functionality, you'll just look at the bottom screen the entire time, making plugging into the TV useless? Why would Nintendo waste money producing such an extremely flawed and useless device at all?

No. They'll make both dual screen, just like with this generation, and they'll both talk to each other seemlessly, unlike this generation.

Like I wrote, I don't think we will see DS device again. All points that they completely abandoning Wii and DS concept and making something completely new, Iwata said "brand new concept".



Pemalite on 25 September 2015
walsufnir said:
Pemalite said:


I already game at resolutions higher than 4k. (7680x1440 eyefinity to be exact.)

And I have four Radeon R9 290's in crossfire. Before that, Triple Radeon 7970's. Before that... Radeon 6950's unlocked into 6970's.
And I will likely buy into AMD's Fury successor on the 1x node.
Guess where I see the largest performance increase? It's not overclocking my GPU Ram. It's actually on the core clocks, I am compute and ROP bound before memory bandwidth.

If you are thinking the Playstation 4 will be playing Crysis 4... At 4k, with everything dialed up to 11. You are dreaming. No console has the power to do that.


Of course they can. It just would take several seconds to render a frame :)


Semantics. :P

Casual/indie games should have no problem with 4k though, but they would likely have no problems on the Xbox either. :P

Miyamotoo said:

Like I wrote, I don't think we will see DS device again. All points that they completely abandoning Wii and DS concept and making something completely new, Iwata said "brand new concept".

Well. There is zero reason for the DS concept to be completely abandoned in order to back NX does it?
The 3DS is still selling fairly well isn't it? And making cash? No reason why the successor shouldn't, provided they don't have any negative perceptions at it's launch. (I.E. 3D giving headaches fiasco and price.)

In Business it is always wise never to put all your eggs in one basket, I don't see why Nintendo wouldn't release a WiiU and 3DS successor rather then hedging all their bets on a product which may not gain any traction.




www.youtube.com/@Pemalite

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Soundwave on 25 September 2015

It would be kinda crazy/cool if Nintendo dropped an entire family of NX products, even going all the way up to 4K resolution and you could just choose which one you wanted, similar to how you can choose wildly differing flavors of iPhone/iPad or Mac/Macbook/Mac Pro. No bickering over hardware, just pick/choose the one that suits your lifestyle and budget. 

They'll never do it, but then again Mr. Miyamoto did say Pikmin would be great in 4K resolution. 



Frogger on 25 September 2015
Miyamotoo said:

Like I wrote, I don't think we will see DS device again. All points that they completely abandoning Wii and DS concept and making something completely new, Iwata said "brand new concept".


All points to them abandoning the brands. Nothing at all points to them abandoning the hardware. The abandoned the Wii U brand, yet are confirmed through patents to be keeping the gamepad. The same will happen with the NXDS. It's likely not going to have DS in the name, but it'll 100% keep both screens.

The brand new concept it the all digital unified platform and Nintendo's new brand of smart consoles. The brand new concept refers to firmware, OS, UI, and the marketplace, not hardware.



Frogger on 25 September 2015
Soundwave said:

It would be kinda crazy/cool if Nintendo dropped an entire family of NX products, even going all the way up to 4K resolution and you could just choose which one you wanted, similar to how you can choose wildly differing flavors of iPhone/iPad or Mac/Macbook/Mac Pro. No bickering over hardware, just pick/choose the one that suits your lifestyle and budget. 

They'll never do it, but then again Mr. Miyamoto did say Pikmin would be great in 4K resolution. 

 

While I do see them eventually having multiple hardware skews, maybe even eventually including you tablet concept, there's no way they'd drop it all at once. It would be suicide. Apple can have so many different hardware products because they trickled them out across over a decade. Releasing so many different unproven pieces of hardware at the same time or within too short a timespan would oversaturate and confuse the market. Each Apple product had a year where it was the big new thing all to itself. If Nintendo wants to do something similar, they'll have to keep that in mind. And they do. That's how they've treated their handheld line for years.

So while I can see them eventually reaching such hardware diversity, I think it'll only happen after many years of slowly trickling out. Though I do think they could release the NXDS and NX within the same year. But I wouldn't expect a third pillar product for at least two years after those launch.



Miyamotoo on 25 September 2015
spemanig said:
Miyamotoo said:

Like I wrote, I don't think we will see DS device again. All points that they completely abandoning Wii and DS concept and making something completely new, Iwata said "brand new concept".


All points to them abandoning the brands. Nothing at all points to them abandoning the hardware. The abandoned the Wii U brand, yet are confirmed through patents to be keeping the gamepad. The same will happen with the NXDS. It's likely not going to have DS in the name, but it'll 100% keep both screens.

The brand new concept it the all digital unified platform and Nintendo's new brand of smart consoles. The brand new concept refers to firmware, OS, UI, and the marketplace, not hardware.

Yes we saw gamepad in patents, and we didnt see any DS. I really can't see any DS device because its dead.



Frogger on 25 September 2015
Miyamotoo said:

Yes we saw gamepad in patents, and we didnt see any DS. I really can't see any DS device because its dead.


We haven't seen any DS patents because there haven't been any patents for a handhelds system yet. Only applications. And you're seriously saying dual screens are dead when the Wii U sold 1/5th of the 3DS and is still keeping the gamepad in its successor? Are you joking?