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Forums - Sony Discussion - How Many First Party Remasters Has Sony Actually Done?

Sony:
TlOU
Uncharted Collection
God of War 3

Microsoft:
MCC
Gears

Third Party;
Countless lol



Preston Scott

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JWeinCom said:

Here's the big difference.

If 1984 is made available on Kindle, George Orwell is not converting it.  1984 being made into an ebook does not take away time from other potential books that Orwell could be writing (obviously).  The person who is doing the conversion is almost certainly not a professional author.  The conversion of 1984 to Kindle in no way reduces the amount of books that will be available.  No new writing is not being done so that 1984 can be "remastered".  If I had to estimate the dollar amount of converting 1984 to Kindle, I'd say it would probably cost under 1000 dollars. (In fact, I'd estimate it is far far far less.  I don't know how licensing works, but the actual cost of conversion would be close to 0 dollars.  I'm sure a version of these books already existed on a computer, and putting them on the Kindle store probably took about one man hour).

Games are different.  Remasters cost money.  Maybe not a ton of money, but probably enough money to make a decent indie game.  It takes programmers.  While the guy who is converting 1984 to pdf most likely can't write a decent book, the team converting the Last Of Us into super duper HD most certainly can make a game.  If you took the same amount of people, and the same amount of money, you could get actual games. 

And that goes into the lack of games.  These remasters are taking up resources that could be used to make games which justify the purchase of the console.  I'm not going to argue about it, but I feel like the first year lineup for the next gen consoles is considerably worse than for the older systems.  Now, of course, the money generated from the remasters could be used to invest in awesome new IPs down the line, but that hasn't shown to be the case yet. 

Pricing is not a seperate issue, because it's what we see, and it's part of the reason people are complaining.  I'm not complaining about a theoretical world where remakes are reasonably priced, I'm talking about the actual world where pricing is laughable.  Developers are putting in considerably less work and charging signigicantly more money.  That's the reality, and that's what people are complaining about.

So, here's the thing.  Either

a) The remakes take very limited resources and we are being vastly overcharged for the products.

or

b) The remakes are taking up resources that could be used to create new content.  So we are getting less new content. 

That's why people are complaining.

Why advance something like this without even the slightest bit of corroboration?  I look at all of Sony's first party studios, all of which are working, some even with multiple projects, and I wonder what you're talking about.  I look at all the second-party studio projects Sony is funding and wonder what you're talking about.  I look at remasters being done by contractors that specialize in remasters and I wonder what you're talking about.

There are a ton of announced and unannounced games in the channel that we know about.  They aren't out yet?  That's because making games takes a long time, especially with new hardware and new tools, and Sony did support the PS3 until the end.  They'll be ready when they're ready.

As far as anti-consumer goes, wait a little while and they'll be under twenty dollars.  Remastering a game might require a fraction of the money needed to create a new game from scratch but they did invest resources and obviously they expect a return; no one should be surprised that it costs more than an older version with copies already shipped and sitting in retailer warehousing.  Nintendo games, on the other hand, will still be close to full price years after release but I seldom see people complain about that.  Isn't Skyward Sword still retailing for $50 much worse for consumers?  The Uncharted Collection is only $10 more now and will probably sell for less within a year's time.



It's not Sony so much as the PS4. It's not the PS4 so much as it is 8th gen systems.



Tachikoma said:
JWeinCom said:


I really don't get why people are so eager to defend anti consumer policies.  Thank you Sony may I have another I guess.  If they want to do remakes, that's fine.  They can offer those remakes at a fair price, or actually make meaningful additions to the core experience.

Or you know, just keep releasing remakes so that the people who didn't get the chance to play it the first time around actually get to do so without buying another console.

And they could do that in a much more consumer friendly way. 

Just because a game took less time and resources to make doesn't mean it should be priced much lower, or are you saying that price spent on a games production should reflect the retail value directly?

Have fun whining over gtav releasing at $400 then.

*sigh* No that's not what I'm saying.  I already said clearly what I thought on that matter.  "Like I said, if the amount of resources used up for a remaster is so small, then consumers are being vastly overcharged for them. Of course, it's not an exact science, but the amount of resources invested in a game should have some bearing on its price."  That's what I said on the matter.  If you're going to argue with me, at least read what I said. 

Believe it or not, games companies aren't here to entertain you, theyre here to make money. If a company re-releases an old game and makes some money on it, then they earn a profit, profit that keeps the company going and allows them to take risks.in the future on new IP's and having larger budgets for future games, so even if you think "they're ripping people off" what would you rather have. A company that re-release a game for $5 and go out of business a year later (and all games in development get scrapped) or a company that re-releases, makes.some nice bank from people who bought it (regardless of their reasons to) and kept the cpany afloat?

How dare a company even think about doing something profitable?? What disgusting behavior.

So wait... anything a company does is fine as long as it makes a profit?  Oh boy.  This attitude is what brings us such lovely things as the season pass, games broken at launch, disc locked DLC, and all that lovely stuff.  Obviously they want to make money, but they should be required to do so while also offering a good value to their customers.

As for "what I would rather have" you've prevented a very ridiculous scenario.  First off, I'd rather have them use the programmers and resources towards new game.  But, if they must do a remaster, why are $5 dollars and full price the only possibilities?  Why not release it at something like $30, and give it some bonus content or meaningful changes to the gameplay?  That would be a fair price for people who haven't played the game, and would give those who haven't played it more incentive to try it.

In the end, you don't get it because you don't *want* to get it. You have a set opinion on the matter and that's that, millions disagree, and as it happens those millions are the ones buying remasters, so the practice will continue.

Ok.  And I think that practice sucks.  I'm not sure what your point is.  People have different opinions.  That doesn't invalidate mine.

And last but not least, remastering a game doesn't devalue the original game, sure it cost less to remaster than to make the original, but the company still had to make the original to begin with, so the remaster actually took the original effort and the remastering effort to make.

That's a fair point.  I'll have to consider that.





pokoko said:
JWeinCom said:

Here's the big difference.

If 1984 is made available on Kindle, George Orwell is not converting it.  1984 being made into an ebook does not take away time from other potential books that Orwell could be writing (obviously).  The person who is doing the conversion is almost certainly not a professional author.  The conversion of 1984 to Kindle in no way reduces the amount of books that will be available.  No new writing is not being done so that 1984 can be "remastered".  If I had to estimate the dollar amount of converting 1984 to Kindle, I'd say it would probably cost under 1000 dollars. (In fact, I'd estimate it is far far far less.  I don't know how licensing works, but the actual cost of conversion would be close to 0 dollars.  I'm sure a version of these books already existed on a computer, and putting them on the Kindle store probably took about one man hour).

Games are different.  Remasters cost money.  Maybe not a ton of money, but probably enough money to make a decent indie game.  It takes programmers.  While the guy who is converting 1984 to pdf most likely can't write a decent book, the team converting the Last Of Us into super duper HD most certainly can make a game.  If you took the same amount of people, and the same amount of money, you could get actual games. 

And that goes into the lack of games.  These remasters are taking up resources that could be used to make games which justify the purchase of the console.  I'm not going to argue about it, but I feel like the first year lineup for the next gen consoles is considerably worse than for the older systems.  Now, of course, the money generated from the remasters could be used to invest in awesome new IPs down the line, but that hasn't shown to be the case yet. 

Pricing is not a seperate issue, because it's what we see, and it's part of the reason people are complaining.  I'm not complaining about a theoretical world where remakes are reasonably priced, I'm talking about the actual world where pricing is laughable.  Developers are putting in considerably less work and charging signigicantly more money.  That's the reality, and that's what people are complaining about.

So, here's the thing.  Either

a) The remakes take very limited resources and we are being vastly overcharged for the products.

or

b) The remakes are taking up resources that could be used to create new content.  So we are getting less new content. 

That's why people are complaining.

 

 

 


Why advance something like this without even the slightest bit of corroboration?  I look at all of Sony's first party studios, all of which are working, some even with multiple projects, and I wonder what you're talking about.  I look at all the second-party studio projects Sony is funding and wonder what you're talking about.  I look at remasters being done by contractors that specialize in remasters and I wonder what you're talking about.

This is just really basic common sense stuff.  If a team is working on a remaster, then that time is not spent on new content.  I'm not sure how you could get around this as a basic point of logic.  If you took the people who are working on remasters, and put them instead towards creating new content, you'd have more new content.  Yes?

There are a ton of announced and unannounced games in the channel that we know about.  They aren't out yet?  That's because making games takes a long time, especially with new hardware and new tools, and Sony did support the PS3 until the end.  They'll be ready when they're ready.

Sure.  And when they're ready, people will probably not complain as much.  But, right now, the amount of great new experiences is extremely low while the amount of last gen rehashings is extraordinarily high. 

As far as anti-consumer goes, wait a little while and they'll be under twenty dollars.  Remastering a game might require a fraction of the money needed to create a new game from scratch but they did invest resources and obviously they expect a return; no one should be surprised that it costs more than an older version with copies already shipped and sitting in retailer warehousing.  Nintendo games, on the other hand, will still be close to full price years after release but I seldom see people complain about that.  Isn't Skyward Sword still retailing for $50 much worse for consumers?  The Uncharted Collection is only $10 more now and will probably sell for less within a year's time.

I'm not sure where Nintendo games came into this, so I'm not going to veer off topic.  While nobody should be surprised more that a remaster costs more than the original title, it's a question of how much more, and what content is added.  For exampe, there are remasters like the Kirby Superstar Ultra, Devil May Cry 3 Special Edition, The Orange Box, or The Master Chief Collection which offer a good value.  These games made significant visual changes, added a significant amount of content, or bundled a large amount of content.  Then there are games like Tomb Raider Bouncy Hair, The Last Of Us Remastered, Ultimate Street Fighter IV Input Lag Edition, the NES remakes on the GBA, and so on that offer a crappy value.  Sure you can wait, but there's really no reason for them to charge full price in the first place.



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ArchangelMadzz said:

I see this a lot everywhere but I'm actually wondering how many first party remasters has Sony actually done on their PS4? Considering it's getting quite the name for having remastered games so far I can only think of:

The Last of Us
God of War 3
Uncharted Collection

And only one of those actually is out, and it came out last year?

 

This is a genuine question so please enlighten me :)

there are more if you look at digital. 

flower

flow

unfinished swan

sound shapes

escape plan

pixal junk shooter ultimate (combines 1 and 2)
it needs to be said though that sony gave me each of these games for free on ps4 either via cross buy or in the case of pixal junk shooter ps+. not exactly "anti-consumer" to get them for free...


JWeinCom said:
pokoko said:

 

 

 


Why advance something like this without even the slightest bit of corroboration?  I look at all of Sony's first party studios, all of which are working, some even with multiple projects, and I wonder what you're talking about.  I look at all the second-party studio projects Sony is funding and wonder what you're talking about.  I look at remasters being done by contractors that specialize in remasters and I wonder what you're talking about.

This is just really basic common sense stuff.  If a team is working on a remaster, then that time is not spent on new content.  I'm not sure how you could get around this as a basic point of logic.  If you took the people who are working on remasters, and put them instead towards creating new content, you'd have more new content.  Yes?

There are a ton of announced and unannounced games in the channel that we know about.  They aren't out yet?  That's because making games takes a long time, especially with new hardware and new tools, and Sony did support the PS3 until the end.  They'll be ready when they're ready.

Sure.  And when they're ready, people will probably not complain as much.  But, right now, the amount of great new experiences is extremely low while the amount of last gen rehashings is extraordinarily high. 

As far as anti-consumer goes, wait a little while and they'll be under twenty dollars.  Remastering a game might require a fraction of the money needed to create a new game from scratch but they did invest resources and obviously they expect a return; no one should be surprised that it costs more than an older version with copies already shipped and sitting in retailer warehousing.  Nintendo games, on the other hand, will still be close to full price years after release but I seldom see people complain about that.  Isn't Skyward Sword still retailing for $50 much worse for consumers?  The Uncharted Collection is only $10 more now and will probably sell for less within a year's time.

I'm not sure where Nintendo games came into this, so I'm not going to veer off topic.  While nobody should be surprised more that a remaster costs more than the original title, it's a question of how much more, and what content is added.  For exampe, there are remasters like the Kirby Superstar Ultra, Devil May Cry 3 Special Edition, The Orange Box, or The Master Chief Collection which offer a good value.  These games made significant visual changes, added a significant amount of content, or bundled a large amount of content.  Then there are games like Tomb Raider Bouncy Hair, The Last Of Us Remastered, Ultimate Street Fighter IV Input Lag Edition, the NES remakes on the GBA, and so on that offer a crappy value.  Sure you can wait, but there's really no reason for them to charge full price in the first place.

So you argue that remasters aren't worth the money because so little resources go into making them, but at the same time complain that their creation has a sizable impact on the development of new games?

Which is it exactly?



They haven't done enough because I still don't have my Gravity Rush Remaster.



Sigs are dumb. And so are you!

No matter what Sony does someone will complains and dismiss this it. "Sony has too many indies" "Sony has too many remasters" Sony's has too many multiplats" "Sony's AAA sent scoring high enough on Metacritic so they Dont count" "Sony has too many f2p". Well it sound to me like Sony just pumps out tons of games regardless of how they are developed and are trying to be well balanced to make as many people happy as possible. The fact of the matter is, if you can't find games on this platform that you enjoy than you never intended to. Judging by the originators of some of these comments that's a very accurate statement.



A_C_E said:
JWeinCom said:

I really don't get why people are so eager to defend anti consumer policies.  Thank you Sony may I have another I guess.  If they want to do remakes, that's fine.  They can offer those remakes at a fair price, or actually make meaningful additions to the core experience.

.

 


I bought TLoU Remastered, I didn't get ripped off. I bought it and knew full well what I was buying (played and beat on PS3) and would have willingly paid full price for the game had I had the chance to do it again. I hold value in the entertainment that I purchase and I got more than what I paid for in TLoU Remastered. You just keep talking for all the people who bought and support remastered content but your views DO NOT match everyones. Value is in the eyes of the beholder not in the eyes of JWeinCom. Just because you don't think a certain remaster is worth its price doesn't mean the next person is going to view it the same way; some people are willing to pay the extra dollar for the extra frame rate, resolution and DLC

Oh wow.  My opinion does not reflect the opinion of everyone else in the world?  Golly, thanks for filling me in on that.  I totally thought I was entitled to speak for the world -_-...

I'm not speaking for anyone else in the world.  I'm giving my opinion on the perspective, and I never claimed to be doing anything differently.  Honestly, it's kind of annoying that you're acting as I did otherwise.  Other people can have different views, but that does nothing to invalidate mine.

As for The Last Of Us, if you wanted to buy it twice, or three times, whatever.  Go buy up a warehouse full of copies if you want.  But, the fact that Sony released it on the PS3 while knowing full well they would create a remake within a year without letting their consumers know is anticonsumer.  Tell people that the game will be available on both systems.  Let them choose if they want the PS3 version, the PS4 version, or both. 

Most people have already figured out the solution to Sony charging full price for their "training program". The trick is to not buy the product. There, now you have even more nothing to whine about. Your welcome.

The sarcasm and condescension in your post are entirely unnecessary, particularly when my post wasn't even directed towards you. If you want to disagree fine.  Do so respectfully. 

If people wouldn't buy this, that'd be great.  Unfortunately, they do, and that effects my experience.  If people buy overpriced remakes, that means more overpriced remakes will be released.  If people keep buying games that are broken, that means games I want will be broken at launch.  So, I don't have to endorse a program to be negatively impacted.