SlayerRondo said: I disagree and think it's a completely realistic standard to hold that the belief's people hold should be based on reason and empirical data. I am not going to pretend I know the first thing about string theory but if any of the arguments are based on intuition and emotions I will gladly disregard them if that's all there is to it. I will agree the irrational beliefs are in no way restricted to religion but religions themselves have never presented any rational basis for believing in them. And intuition, while it can be helpful it can also prove harmful as it can norrow our ways of thinking as it does when it comes to religion. Many people have a strong intuition that their is a god because they have had it drilled into them as children that their is one as did most of their ancestors. Intuition may lead us to ask a question but does not provide the answer as many people claim to have. Allegory can be a double edged sword as well since it is in many cases harmful and open to dangerous interpretations in other's. With religious allegory you take the good with the bad, with reason and common sense you can just take the good. Many people are no longer able to follow their religious teaching because their standards of morality are superior to those found within their faith. As to the question of the afterlife I have never seen a rational argument for why I should believe their is an afterlife and can only view it as an irrational belief. |
Can you tell me that every single belief you hold (and please include the ones which you've not fully self realized) is based off a testable experiment? If not, how can you expect the same of others? It is alright for some beliefs to not be hyper-rational because we are human beings.
All science has emotions and intuition in it. People don't do science as if they are robots. We do it because we enjoy it, and we pursue particular ideas because we are interested in them especially. It takes a lot of work and rigor to make sure the science is bias-proof and a lot of mental strength to drop an unsupportable idea. It contradicts our primal humanity, and it isn't very easy, even for the most empirical thinkers. For an example of a highly intuitive scientist you just have to look at Einstein. He often pursued interests based off of intuition. For example, he claimed, "God does not play with dice" with regards to Quantum Mechanics. Basically he felt that the uncertainty at the micro-level was due to an unknown phenomena, whereas his colleagues were pretty sure it was inherently fundamental. Einstein made this claim based off of experential knowledge and not empirical knowledge. I keep citing physics, because it is the most rational (as in quantifiable) science and therefore would logically have the most rational thinkers.
Certrainly, I never objected to the existence of the harm of intuition. My point was that there is value in irrational beliefs, and the good of intuition is a necessary wheel in scientific progression as wheel in the progression of other pursuits of knowledge or beliefs.
Unfortunately (or maybe not unfortunately) there is no measurement that can be made with regards to morality and ethics. It is necessarily subjective. This is a prime example of a case in which no matter how hard you try to apply reason (quantify something) you just can't do a good job. Ethics is a field principally based on emotion and feeling. Why do we not kill people? Because we feel guilt, for example. So anytime somebody tries to construct an objective moral or ethical system the end result is more often than not conflict, and the "bad" (for most people) does come with the good. This is true for the most rational ethical system and the least rational one. What is good and bad is not something we test and observe of reality, but is something we feel and introspect upon. Ironically for this matter certain religions are the ones (but not solely) which try to claim that we can quantify ethics/morals and in that case are the ones whom attempt to be rational (albeit they fail at it.)
Afterlife is a question which we need a lot of pre-requisite science to test. First we need to understand what consciousness is, empirically and in detail. After that we might be able to posit reasonable assumptions with regards to afterlife and test them. However, it is a belief that hasn't really been solidly falsified yet, and certain concepts of afterlife (such as mirror neurons or mind uploading) have been emprically studied and observed. So unlike certain other irrational (non-quantifiable) beliefs held by people, it isn't quite odd to understand that people hold such a belief and how they've come to it.